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View Full Version : Tenergy 25 compared to Tenergy 05?



Phil
07-23-2015, 12:36 PM
Hi,

I'm possibly looking to try Tenergy 25 on both sides. I've used 05 quite a bit so does anybody have any opinions on how it plays compared to that in terms of speed, spin, and control?

NextLevel
07-23-2015, 12:43 PM
Don't do it....

T25 is a specialist rubber for close to the table topspinners and it plays differently once you back off the table. If you really want to do it, try out someone else's blade before buying it. Use it both close to and away from the table You will see that it is just a different animal - see whether you want to adjust to it before buying it because it isn't cheap either.

It's great in some ways for a close to a table player because you can play full strokes at the table with confidence and counterhit just about any incoming topspin without a moment's thought. Also good spin in that area for many shots, though the offensive strokes require much more open blade angles than T05 (the opposite is true for many of the passive ones). But once you take a step or two back, you have to start adjusting your instincts and it can be done, but whether you want to do so or should do so is the issue.

Tinykin
07-23-2015, 08:38 PM
Try T64 on the BH. It's good at the table and brilliant away from the table.

Baal
07-24-2015, 03:46 AM
I have never quite figured out who T25 is intended for. It has never really found much of a niche.

Pnachtwey
07-24-2015, 04:45 AM
Don't do it....

T25 is a specialist rubber for close to the table topspinners and it plays differently once you back off the table.

More NextLevel nonsense. How does a rubber know if it is close to the table or away?
The properties of the rubber don't change as a function of how close one is to the table.

However, I agree with the "don't do it part.

The spin to speed ratio or better tangential COR to normal COR, what ignorant TT players call throw, is low. There are plenty of low spin to speed ratio rubbers out there that cost a lot less that T25.

I still have T25 mounted on one of my Firewall Plus blades but it doesn't really play much better than TG3 Neo. What the T25 does do well is block.

Der_Echte
07-24-2015, 06:32 AM
I have never quite figured out who T25 is intended for. It has never really found much of a niche.

I have thought about it and have figured it all out.

I agree T25 is not useful for what either of us do and we like it just about as much as advanced stage gangrene.

The purpose of T25 is to get sheep like EJs to buy it.

The art of business is to cause people to want something they do not need. BTY has some businessmen working for them.

Der_Echte
07-24-2015, 06:33 AM
I agree with TinyK, you would be a LOT happier with T64 than T25.

Tinykin
07-24-2015, 06:42 AM
For me whilst using T25, I was brilliant (in my mind) at flipping backspin serves - basically anything short over the table. Today, I have more trouble attacking surprise short low floaters with my T05 shod FH. When I had the T25, I had far less problems. Active blocking was much easier.
Like the OP, I was really impressed with my performance using this rubber, so I bought T25 for both sides of my blade. (I was better off financially then). But I was so shyte when about a foot or greater away from the table with this setup. To me, it was just not worth it for my style.
T25 greatly benefits those players who do not move away from the table and use a limited amount of stokes. That is, the type of blocker who moves into the incoming ball for an 'off-the-bounce' block no matter what the incoming speed. It is also aids the stoke of receiving the serve off the bounce as this rubber is not very reactive to spin in those circumstances. Think of an SP rubber like 802.
I know this as I gave the rubber to my teammate (Bryan Taylor) who at 71yo surprises many a better player with his blocks from their power loops. Also his short stabby pushes against backspin keeps them a little quieter.

Der_Echte
07-24-2015, 06:43 AM
The jury is out on Pnchy's ability to move in and out and use both close to table topspin and mid distance looping. We will be better convinced with a fresh vid.

We have seen Next Level's vids each week (at OOAK and sometimes here) and we have seen him play all the shots needed for both those ranges at a 2000+ level, although he is clearly a much better player close to table.

If i never had a hit with T25, I would be inclined to believe what NL said, but I have had a session with T25 and instantly disliked it for all the reasons everyone mentioned.

Sure, the rubber don't know distance or player from adam, but the strokes needed for a flexible topspin offensive attacking game are as different as day and night and some rubber/blade combos facilitate the needed shots better or worse.

I wouldn't use T25 even if BTY game me a lifetime supply of the stuff. T05 and T64 are totally different animals I would use in a heartbeat if they cost the same as I can get Aurus.

Suga D
07-24-2015, 11:17 AM
I believe this here may help.
:-)

http://youtu.be/G0CEUQveMuw

Tom TTD
07-24-2015, 03:14 PM
I would recommend Tenergy 05 on the forehand , creates a good arc on the ball and has good spin

NextLevel
07-24-2015, 04:26 PM
I wouldn't use T25 even if BTY game me a lifetime supply of the stuff. T05 and T64 are totally different animals I would use in a heartbeat if they cost the same as I can get Aurus.

My sentiments precisely.

mahomedy13
07-24-2015, 05:35 PM
Pnatchwey back with his big words...when he learns how to 'loop' in its correct context,then his advice will be appreciated...just saying

sebas-aguirre
07-24-2015, 05:52 PM
I think most players would do better with 25 than with 05.
-easier to serve short and spiny
-easier to push
-easier to block
-easier to chop

05 is better only for looping and counterlooping.
it has more power, more spin, and the ball falls more suddenly.

oh one problem of 25 is it gets worn out much faster than 05.
I have one 05 and 25 I used together the same amount of time and the 25 looks destroyed while the 05 barely has traces of usage.

BeGo
07-24-2015, 06:13 PM
Agree with Sebas.

On paper, Tenergy 25 similar to Bluefire JP series.

Blocker Looper
Butterfly Tenergy 25

Driver
Butterfly Tenergy 64 FX

Driver Looper
Butterfly Tenergy 80
Butterfly Tenergy 05 FX
Butterfly Tenergy 64

Looper
Butterfly Tenergy 05

Non Chopper
Butterfly Tenergy 25 FX

NextLevel
07-24-2015, 06:56 PM
I think most players would do better with 25 than with 05.
-easier to serve short and spiny
-easier to push
-easier to block
-easier to chop

05 is better only for looping and counterlooping.
it has more power, more spin, and the ball falls more suddenly.

oh one problem of 25 is it gets worn out much faster than 05.
I have one 05 and 25 I used together the same amount of time and the 25 looks destroyed while the 05 barely has traces of usage.

Seriously? So T25 is so much better than T05 at serving, pushing, blocking and chopping (I never chop, BTW) that it is better for most players than T05, which is probably the best looping rubber in the world and excellent for serving, pushing and topspin blocking?

So Sebas, how many good players do you know that use T25, including yourself? And why don't you use it?

NextLevel
07-24-2015, 08:52 PM
I think the better you become the more you appreciate 05.
top players will indeed be way much more comfortable with 05 than with 25.
but most players are not top players.

personally I count on the fact that I will be using the same rubbers for a long time.
so I go for something very fast and spiny and then with time let it become more controllable.
my 05's are more than a year old and no plans of changing them for now.

So you are saying that only top players can loop or can appreciate the importance of looping and counterlooping? So you are a top player and the other players who are not top players and hate using T25 are idiots?

Just trying to make sense of why you think T25 is a better rubber for most players when most players who are trying to get good loop - they don't push, block or chop! And even for pushing, blocking and chopping, it is not like T25 will win the point while T05 will lose the point.

Anyways, sorry - it is your opinion. Some opinions are just funny.

NextLevel
07-24-2015, 09:53 PM
well it's the same dilemma you will face with many rubbers.
generally what's best for attacking has less control.
what has best control has limited attacking power.

it's your choice and you are the only one who knows which is the best rubber for you.

This isn't true unless you explain what you mean by control. And again, how many basement players (which is the style you are describing) will buy Tenergy? And how many serious attackers will pick a rubber for how well it chops and blocks rather than how well it loops and then how well it does other things?

Maybe you have crappy players in Argentina. Where I play in the US, no one uses Tenergy 25 because it is not a good rubber for people who want to be able to play reasonably well at all distances from the table without adapting their technique.

Tinykin
07-24-2015, 10:39 PM
Oops. I just remembered that my experience was with T25FX. Unusually, it plays significantly different from the harder T25.

UpSideDownCarl
07-24-2015, 11:33 PM
I wouldn't use T25 even if BTY game me a lifetime supply of the stuff.

I would take the lifetime supply and figure out something to do with it even if I didn't play with it. But it is true, I wouldn't want to use them either. Hahaha.


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NextLevel
07-25-2015, 12:10 AM
We have seen Next Level's vids each week (at OOAK and sometimes here) and we have seen him play all the shots needed for both those ranges at a 2000+ level, although he is clearly a much better player close to table.



Thanks for the kind words, bro. Seriously, T25 was recommended to me when I was playing around 1700 level. The guy who recommended it felt it would help my close to the table game seriously. I kinda thought about it but couldn't find any players using it so I never took it seriously.

One of my practice partners used it for a while and I borrowed his blade to play a match since I forgot my paddle at home. I was like WTF - it felt like I had picked up bizarro paddle - nothing was happening the way I expected it to given my high spin game. The angles I had to use were so open that I just gave him back his paddle after a few points and then borrowed another paddle with bluefire m2 on it, which I proceeded to dust off my opponent with.

Then when I was around 1800, someone tried it and gave me his sheet after he went back to 05. I stuck it on a blade and hit with it for a couple of days. It was so good at controlling incoming topspin that I was tempted. But then I tried to loop away from the table, started slapping the ball to get pace, and decided that while there was a technique for this rubber, it was unlike any rubber that I usually played with. And I wasn't going to change the way I played just to use a rubber that I knew no other rubber that played quite like it.

Trust me, it would have been heaven to find a rubber that made my close to the table game better while supporting even my strokes just 1 meter from the table. I could give up lobbing and chopping for that since that is no part of my game. But to step a foot back and to feel weird with a paddle - that only happened with T25 - it didn't even happen with Hurricane or Big Dipper or Globe 999 Chinese rubber. No need for that shyte.

NextLevel
07-25-2015, 03:10 AM
Koki Niwa is using 05 now. He had to change as 25 was too limiting as he improved. You can see the change in his stroke selection and some of the bad habits that T25 encouraged in his blocking.

Baal
07-25-2015, 03:29 AM
Trying to put a positive view of the thing, which is hard because I dislike the rubber, maybe some women players who play fast from close in use T25? Women don't usually get mentioned in the threads on what top players use, and I can't say I know of any who use it. By the way, T25FX is not too bad on BH side for some people, but it plays very differently from T25.

NextLevel
07-25-2015, 04:10 AM
The main person people talk about is Adina Diaconu. She is a Romanian prospect who uses T25 on FH and T25 FX on BH.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8oQWIitVII

Here is John Bozi's video - you can see his stroke selection to get a gist of what T25 feels like in the hand of a looper. To quote Bozi:

" After a week I found I had to kill everything - so it didn't suit me. table tennis rally tenergy 25 fx 05 64 ishlion blue whale 2 Timo Boll Spirit
Brian Pace reveals tenergy 25, but I reveal it differently."


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wZATDwlk3I

Baal
07-25-2015, 04:05 PM
You know who the top European girl cadets are and also what rubber they use? That is the definition of a fan.

NextLevel
07-25-2015, 05:28 PM
You know who the top European girl cadets are and also what rubber they use? That is the definition of a fan.

Nah - this came out of the T25 thread on mytt where pnatchwey was slapping the ball over the net in his video to prove to me that you can loop with T25. Someone referred to her so I googled her and saw the same upward looping and smashing game that I couldn't live with.

John18
07-25-2015, 07:01 PM
Nah - this came out of the T25 thread on mytt where pnatchwey was slapping the ball over the net in his video to prove to me that you can loop with T25. Someone referred to her so I googled her and saw the same upward looping and smashing game that I couldn't live with.

It was me ! :) And Adina Diaconu is the Junior Girl European champion (from the recent EYC 2015). 3rd European single title in a row in Junior and Cadet categories and 10th European title with team and doubles. But it's true she has a strange style/loop form though.



"http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_images/quote_box.png rajd1234 wrote:

I was really curious about T25. Has anyone tried it? Why no professional player use it?




Response : Well, not a "top player" but Adina Diaconu (ROU) plays with T25 on FH and T25FX on BH."

Der_Echte
07-26-2015, 11:57 PM
I would take the lifetime supply and figure out something to do with it even if I didn't play with it. But it is true, I wouldn't want to use them either. Hahaha.


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I absolutely could NOT in good conscience do that.

Now if BTY sends a Goon Squad after me for no good reason, then everything is all fair in "love + war".

UpSideDownCarl
07-27-2015, 02:28 AM
I absolutely could NOT in good conscience do that.

Now if BTY sends a Goon Squad after me for no good reason, then everything is all fair in "love + war".

Hahaha.

In good conscience, you couldn't give them to kids who can't afford new rubbers? I have a friend who would give them to kids in the Dominican Republic who really can't afford new equipment.

How about making a rubberized floor in your apartment?


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Pnachtwey
07-27-2015, 04:18 AM
Pnatchwey back with his big words...when he learns how to 'loop' in its correct context,then his advice will be appreciated...just saying
I can loop just fine. You are a biased idiot. You see only what you want to see and are totally clueless. You ignored an earlier post where I was looping when making 3rd ball attacks. My percentages were much better than bogeyhunter's.

Pnachtwey
07-27-2015, 05:25 AM
No one has been able to tell us HOW T25 PLAYS DIFFERENTLY AWAY FROM THE TABLE? I don't see how T25's properties can change as a function of how fast away from the table it is.

I want the so called experts to explain this. I know they can't.

This I know. There is no force or impluse you can generate with other rubbers that you can't generate with T25. It will take a different stroke but one can achieve the same trajectories with T25 as with T05.

I like T25 but I would not buy it again. Like I said above there are other rubbers that can do the same thing that cost much less.

I would use T25 if it was much cheaper. I can return the most severe chops and hit with the high speed with T25. It is a a real shocker when I twiddle and block a hard loop with my T25 on the BH instead of my LPs. The T25 ball comes back fast with topspin. The LP block comes back slow with back spin. The opponent must adapt, quickly.

Der_Echte
07-27-2015, 11:47 AM
I have seen Bogeyhunter live and he is every bit the 2200-2300 level player he has been the last few years. I am a very solid looer and I can tell you up front, it is very difficult to loop 4-5 in a row vs him. He knows how to chop heavy and vary the spin.

As for his attacking ability, when he choose, he can step around and loop it like a regular inverted attacking player.

I think I saw the same vid Pnchy is referring to where bogey posted a vid of 3rd ball attack and he was really off sync that vid. That is not his normal standard. Bogey is not afraid to post any vid, good or bad.

mahomedy13
07-27-2015, 06:09 PM
I can loop just fine. You are a biased idiot. You see only what you want to see and are totally clueless. You ignored an earlier post where I was looping when making 3rd ball attacks. My percentages were much better than bogeyhunter's.
Your percentages are shaky.when you say you loop,and 90% of the other people say you don't,then to me that clearly is an indication of a fault lying somewhere,and it all points in your direction.

NextLevel
07-27-2015, 06:18 PM
Your percentages are shaky.when you say you loop,and 90% of the other people say you don't,then to me that clearly is an indication of a fault lying somewhere,and it all points in your direction.

90% is too kind.

NextLevel
07-28-2015, 04:20 AM
BTW, one of the sad things about TT coaching is that some coaches are willing to take your money while not improving your game. In PNUT's case, that is probably a good thing. As they say, a PNUT and his money are soon parted. I guess that is what happens when PNUT takes lessons from some coaches. They realize that they can't help him, but since he is paying the money, they let him do as he pleases.

Tinykin
07-28-2015, 09:07 AM
My EJ instinct has been aroused by this thread. I think that I might again try T25FX on my BH.

negp70
08-02-2015, 02:13 PM
Thanks for the video, Suga D


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doraemon
12-06-2016, 09:29 PM
Agree with Sebas.

On paper, Tenergy 25 similar to Bluefire JP series.

Blocker Looper
Butterfly Tenergy 25

Driver
Butterfly Tenergy 64 FX

Driver Looper
Butterfly Tenergy 80
Butterfly Tenergy 05 FX
Butterfly Tenergy 64

Looper
Butterfly Tenergy 05

Non Chopper
Butterfly Tenergy 25 FXWhy do you say that it is similar to bluefire JP?

BeGo
12-08-2016, 10:24 PM
Why do you say that it is similar to bluefire JP?
In a sense that it is good for block and loop style, which was why I am agree with Sebas, back then,

1 year 3 months ago. [emoji6]

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ronz91
12-09-2016, 05:51 PM
11554

ajtatosmano2
12-09-2016, 06:19 PM
Koki Niwa is using 05 now. He had to change as 25 was too limiting as he improved. You can see the change in his stroke selection and some of the bad habits that T25 encouraged in his blocking.

(He doesn't use Victas V>15? Just sayin', I don't want to this become KN equipment topic.) EDIT: I missed the date.

NextLevel
12-09-2016, 06:47 PM
He doesn't use Victas V>15? Just sayin', I don't want to this become KN equipment topic.

Dude, read the date of the posts. Come on, man....

ajtatosmano2
12-09-2016, 07:03 PM
Dude, read the date of the posts. Come on, man....

Sorry, I had a hard day.

Suga D
12-09-2016, 08:50 PM
That's where this necromancing leads to...
[emoji12]

Baal
12-10-2016, 04:12 AM
Next thing you know there will be zombies all around eating people's brains.

I fear it may have already begun.

rokphish
12-10-2016, 06:04 AM
Fear not. Join The Murphy revolution.

UpSideDownCarl
12-10-2016, 12:05 PM
Why do you say that it is similar to bluefire JP?

The real question is, why didn't anyone call doraemon on waking up a thread that was dead for over a year. See, this is what young EJs who don't quite understand what they read end up doing.

He asked, "why do you say that T25 is similar to JP series?"

And yet he did not realize that BeGo said "ON PAPER". He may not have even understood what ON PAPER meant. But he clearly did not get that this thread was dead for over a year.

This is why I have a feeling, the goon squad may already be seeking out doraemon to capture him. He has all the distinguishing signs of an EJ in the worst throws of the disease.

Shuki
12-10-2016, 04:32 PM
T25 is different than T05 by 20 points.

yuri.saldon
12-10-2016, 09:11 PM
T25 is different than T05 by 20 points.
You just have to level up your tenergy, maybe one day you get the tenergy lvl 80

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