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View Full Version : New era with DHS D40+ 3 Star Balls



TurboZ
01-24-2017, 06:07 AM
The next ittf India Open will probably start using the new DHS D40+ 3 Star balls after all the dreadful plastic ball breaking during matches. It is about time. :rolleyes:

The new D40+ is available from taobao for the same price of 30 RMB for a box of six as old 40+.

It is the long Chinese New Year holiday right now so orders will not process till early Feb. I like their D40+ 1 Star a lot so my hope on their 3 Star is high. Hope DHS has done it right this time. After all they are the official ball supplier till 2020 and I bet no one really wants to see their 40+ anymore in the next 4 years. :cool:

1188011881

https://world.tmall.com/item/544570039298.htm#detail?

AndySmith
01-24-2017, 08:21 AM
Fingers crossed!

Baal
01-24-2017, 08:00 PM
Long delayed. Hope they are real.

laistrogian
01-25-2017, 01:59 AM
Even if they are good, pray that the QC doesn't fall over. The problem with chinese manufacturing is their generally loose QC

JekaE
01-25-2017, 10:16 AM
how are they better than the regular 40+
Iam using the Nitakku 40+ 3 star and they are very good , we actually able to play with the same ball for months.

Garrison
01-25-2017, 12:48 PM
how are they better than the regular 40+
Iam using the Nitakku 40+ 3 star and they are very good , we actually able to play with the same ball for months.

40+ is not = 40+. The Nittaku ones are known to be the best since their release, but other manufacturers struggle to produce a good and consistent ball. The dhs balls were used in a lot of competitions lately even though pros were angry about poor quality.

At the grand finals FZD was hitting a ball with the edge and it literally exploded into two pieces, stuff like that.

Baal
01-25-2017, 01:23 PM
Actually the seamless balls have been generally OK. Certainly far better than DHS. Decent to play with and durable. I prefer Nittaku, but most of all would like a single standard.

These new DHS balls are suppossed to be made of the same material as the good Nittaku 40+. I hope they also use the same method for attaching the seam.

We will see.

suds79
01-25-2017, 01:44 PM
Baal,

Agreed. Our club uses a seamless ball which is really nice but the neighboring town uses the Nittaku ball which from what I've seen is well reviewed but seamed & most of all super pricey. Our club at this stage simply cannot afford that ball.

Hoping the DHS ball is good as well.

Dan
01-25-2017, 04:05 PM
Actually the seamless balls have been generally OK. Certainly far better than DHS. Decent to play with and durable. I prefer Nittaku, but most of all would like a single standard.

These new DHS balls are suppossed to be made of the same material as the good Nittaku 40+. I hope they also use the same method for attaching the seam.

We will see.

Looks like DHS want a ball as good as and similar to Nittaku 40+. Looking forward to trying these out.

TurboZ
02-13-2017, 08:46 PM
CNT had already start using the new ball, which they also called ABS, in January 2017 for their internal competitions and trials. FZD said that getting used to it fast is his first priority.

LGL talks about it last week after the Trials to WTTC.

"We have tested the new ball for a while. The difference is quite significant, mainly with less spin and more speed. It is better for game play and rallies. From these matches we see lots of strong top spin counters. Especially on the strong BH exchange and balance between BH and FH. It gives more advantage to fierce attacking style players like FZD, LJK and Xu Chenhao. On the other hand players that depends on control and soft touch will suffer.


Now players may feel the change and difference in spin is big. But I believe when giving enough time, especially after WTTC, they will find the feeling of the new ball. After increasing the power, the spin will come back. The playing standard should return to normal. It may cause some shaking in the beginning, but all will go back as usual and the new ball won't change the scene of TT. " said LGL.

I have ordered some from taobao and they are now sitting with my buying agent. I see not many shops has it at the moment but believe China should have enough production power to meet the huge initial demand. Hope it is not like the case of Nittaku Premium which suffers a few months of shortage. The best thing is that DHS claimed to have significantly lower the failure rate in production so they can pass the saving to the customers. Will see how well it goes.

Lee91
02-13-2017, 09:23 PM
I wonder what 'D' on 'D40+' means. I guess it stands for 'Dual', but I am not sure what it means. Does anyone know?

Baal
02-13-2017, 10:49 PM
I received my 1* version of the new D40+ ball from DHS today. Another fast delivery from TT11!!! A few things I can report already, all good.

1. If you hold it up to the light and look at the seam, and compare, it is identical to that of a Nittaku Premium. Some may remember that that feature was one of the innovative things about the Nittaku Premium.

2. It has an identical bounce height to a Nittaku Premium. This is very different from all previous Chinese seamed 40+ balls, which consistently bounced lower.

3. The color (how white it is) and the external surface texture are pretty much identical to Nittaku Premium.

I haven't played with it yet, but already I am very optimistic. In fact, on the basis of the bounce height alone, I would say that they are better than the previous seamed Chinese 40+ balls, even the so-called *** ones. (Without question I can say that these are the bast 1* balls I have ever seen).

Add to that what LGL said about the *** version being the roundest balls yet, and maybe the ball situation is about to get better, at least once everybody starts putting their own label on this ball.

If it's like it was with Nittaku, it may take DHS awhile to get the production fully ramped up, and hopefully they continue to maintain high QC (in general not a DHS strong point). The *** versions are likely to be scarce for awhile.

But things may be looking up.

yuri.saldon
02-13-2017, 11:48 PM
I received my 1* version of the new D40+ ball from DHS today. Another fast delivery from TT11!!! A few things I can report already, all good.

1. If you hold it up to the light and look at the seam, and compare, it is identical to that of a Nittaku Premium. Some may remember that that feature was one of the innovative things about the Nittaku Premium.

2. It has an identical bounce height to a Nittaku Premium. This is very different from all previous Chinese seamed 40+ balls, which consistently bounced lower.

3. The color (how white it is) and the external surface texture are pretty much identical to Nittaku Premium.

I haven't played with it yet, but already I am very optimistic. In fact, on the basis of the bounce height alone, I would say that they are better than the previous seamed Chinese 40+ balls, even the so-called *** ones. (Without question I can say that these are the bast 1* balls I have ever seen).

Add to that what LGL said about the *** version being the roundest balls yet, and maybe the ball situation is about to get better, at least once everybody starts putting their own label on this ball.

If it's like it was with Nittaku, it may take DHS awhile to get the production fully ramped up, and hopefully they continue to maintain high QC (in general not a DHS strong point). The *** versions are likely to be scarce for awhile.

But things may be looking up.
I'm very optimistic with that ball.

And what about the roundness of the balls?

Sent from my 2014819 using Tapatalk

Baal
02-14-2017, 01:58 AM
I checked a couple, not perfectly round, less round than the Nittaku Premium I compared them to, but they are 1* balls, no big deal. If they were perfect I suppose they would be ***.

Ilia Minkin
02-14-2017, 03:03 AM
I desperately want an orange ball. We have white walls in our Uni's gym that drive me nuts sometimes.

Zaid323918
03-01-2017, 01:22 PM
I received my 1* version of the new D40+ ball from DHS today. Another fast delivery from TT11!!! A few things I can report already, all good.

1. If you hold it up to the light and look at the seam, and compare, it is identical to that of a Nittaku Premium. Some may remember that that feature was one of the innovative things about the Nittaku Premium.

2. It has an identical bounce height to a Nittaku Premium. This is very different from all previous Chinese seamed 40+ balls, which consistently bounced lower.

3. The color (how white it is) and the external surface texture are pretty much identical to Nittaku Premium.

I haven't played with it yet, but already I am very optimistic. In fact, on the basis of the bounce height alone, I would say that they are better than the previous seamed Chinese 40+ balls, even the so-called *** ones. (Without question I can say that these are the bast 1* balls I have ever seen).

Add to that what LGL said about the *** version being the roundest balls yet, and maybe the ball situation is about to get better, at least once everybody starts putting their own label on this ball.

If it's like it was with Nittaku, it may take DHS awhile to get the production fully ramped up, and hopefully they continue to maintain high QC (in general not a DHS strong point). The *** versions are likely to be scarce for awhile.

But things may be looking up.

Do you know anything about the 2 star D40s TT11 is selling? How are they compared to the 1 star etc.?

TurboZ
03-01-2017, 02:01 PM
I found it strange that the D40+ 2 stars are always out of stock from TT11 and no taobao store has it. But since the D40+ 3 stars are widely available from China and way cheaper than before so there really is no need to buy anything less. Too bad my order is still stuck with my buying agent because of the long delay of GA5. Nothing I can do now but wait. :(

CNT has already been using the new ball in their internal competitions from January, and Ittf has scheduled to first use it in the upcoming Korean Open in April.
12315

Lee91
03-01-2017, 02:31 PM
12316

My 3 star balls arrived few days ago. I have only been using seamless balls so it is first time for me to try a seam ball. Though I am not sensitive to balls, I can say it bounces slightly higher and spins slightly less than seamless one. Too bad I haven't tried Nittaku balls, so I can't compare this new balls with them. Roundness was good. 4 perfectly round, 2 round enough to play out of 6 balls.

Zaid323918
03-01-2017, 04:18 PM
I found it strange that the D40+ 2 stars are always out of stock from TT11 and no taobao store has it. But since the D40+ 3 stars are widely available from China and way cheaper than before so there really is no need to buy anything less. Too bad my order is still stuck with my buying agent because of the long delay of GA5. Nothing I can do now but wait. :(

CNT has already been using the new ball in their internal competitions from January, and Ittf has scheduled to first use it in the upcoming Korean Open in April.
12315

Is that taobao store reliable?

AndySmith
03-01-2017, 04:37 PM
12316

My 3 star balls arrived few days ago. I have only been using seamless balls so it is first time for me to try a seam ball. Though I am not sensitive to balls, I can say it bounces slightly higher and spins slightly less than seamless one. Too bad I haven't tried Nittaku balls, so I can't compare this new balls with them. Roundness was good. 4 perfectly round, 2 round enough to play out of 6 balls.

Sounds pretty positive so far! Any breakages yet?

Hope you don't mind me asking - where did you order this lovely haul from?

Baal
03-01-2017, 06:42 PM
Spins less than seamless? Doesn't seem entirely positive to me. Oh well.

Baal
03-01-2017, 06:43 PM
Do you know anything about the 2 star D40s TT11 is selling? How are they compared to the 1 star etc.?

No. Haven't seen any. I have ordered some 3-star ones, though. I didn't enjoy playing with the 1-star ones, but they are, after all, 1-star.

AndySmith
03-01-2017, 06:54 PM
Spins less than seamless? Doesn't seem entirely positive to me. Oh well.

I take that with a pinch of salt. I know someone who swears blind that they get more spin with seamless than with Nittaku Premium, and he's one of the best players in the top division of my local league. And I agree with him! But many don't, and you know yourself how hard it is to measure. Is it movement through the air, or how often your opponent blocks off, or what? Anyway, thus far I'm just happy to hear that the bounce is better, roundness is OK, price is mega-cheap and so on.

Zaid323918
03-01-2017, 07:04 PM
No. Haven't seen any. I have ordered some 3-star ones, though. I didn't enjoy playing with the 1-star ones, but they are, after all, 1-star.

So the are the one stars like really bad? Are they good for training and practice?

TurboZ
03-01-2017, 08:58 PM
Is that taobao store reliable?

I found it has one of the best rating in taobao with 2 Golden Crown so I am not worried about its reliability. The price of GA5 and GA8 have also been dropped since new.

TurboZ
03-01-2017, 09:11 PM
Spins less than seamless? Doesn't seem entirely positive to me. Oh well.

LGL had commented about the new ABS (D40+) ball after the Chinese Trials. Don't know how it compare to seamless but certainly less spin than old 40+ from his words.

"We have tested the new ball for a while. The difference is quite significant, mainly with less spin and more speed. It is better for game play and rallies. From these matches we see lots of strong top spin counters. Especially on the strong BH exchange and balance between BH and FH. It gives more advantage to fierce attacking style players like FZD, LJK and Xu Chenhao. On the other hand players that depends on control and soft touch will suffer.


Now players may feel the change and difference in spin is big. But I believe when giving enough time, especially after WTTC, they will find the feeling of the new ball. After increasing the power, the spin will come back. The playing standard should return to normal. It may cause some shaking in the beginning, but all will go back as usual and the new ball won't change the scene of TT. " said LGL.


FZD said that his first task is to adapt to the new ball fast. Don't know how much it has affect his performance in Qatar as I believe they still use the old 40+ there and FZD had competed with the new D40+ but ML did not. Will see the Third Stage of Trials action begin tomorrow.

chuckjordan2
03-01-2017, 11:40 PM
My DHC D40+ *** balls arrived today. I opened the package to inspect them.


Some quick notes:
The color is a nice egg shell (very close to Nittaku 40+ balls)
The surface has a surface similar to the Nittaku 40+ balls
Holding one up to the light, the shell is thinner than Nittaku 40+ balls
Also holding up to the light, the seam is huge (4X) of the Nittaku 40+ balls.

I'll find out Saturday how they play at the club. I normally play Thursday nights, however, am traveling on a business trip to Washington DC.

Here's a quick photo:
12329

Lee91
03-02-2017, 01:29 AM
Sounds pretty positive so far! Any breakages yet?

Hope you don't mind me asking - where did you order this lovely haul from?


I have been playing with this ball three hours per day for three days, so I can't check durability yet.
I ordered these from 'Luciferchen' in Taobao. He has about 17 counselors, so he immediately replies to the inquiries on Taobao messenger. One sad thing is that his counselors speak Chinese only, so I have to ask them in Chinese.
I verified the authenticity on DHS website, so I believe he sells authentic products.

Lee91
03-02-2017, 01:39 AM
Spins less than seamless? Doesn't seem entirely positive to me. Oh well.

I think it is 'slightly'(not noticeably) bouncier, but I am not sure with spin because I am not in the top division in Korea. It's just my opinion so don't trust me too much:)

Baal
03-02-2017, 01:40 AM
I think it is 'slightly'(not noticeably) bouncier, but I am not sure with spin because I am not in the top division in Korea. It's just my opinion so don't trust me too much:)

OK, but I do trust LGL, and also, I kind of got that impression from the 1* ones also, even thought they are probably 1* for a reasons.

Zaid323918
03-02-2017, 12:57 PM
OK, but I do trust LGL, and also, I kind of got that impression from the 1* ones also, even thought they are probably 1* for a reasons.

Should I buy the one stars for training or practice?

Baal
03-02-2017, 01:03 PM
Should I buy the one stars for training or practice?

I personally liked the Nittaku J top a whole lot more.

tlai
03-03-2017, 03:19 PM
J-tops are nice!

suds79
03-03-2017, 06:02 PM
I just want them to push out those two-toned balls.

Those are sweet. I think they make for a much, much nicer TV product.

And if nothing else, they'd make great service practice balls.

hangdog
03-04-2017, 12:20 AM
I just want them to push out those two-toned balls.

Those are sweet. I think they make for a much, much nicer TV product.

And if nothing else, they'd make great service practice balls.

Joola makes a celluloid training look-alike of the China Super League ball:

http://www.tabletennis11.com/other_eng/joola-spinball-2-color-12-tk

Loopadoop
03-04-2017, 01:07 AM
Are these balls being used for the current Chinese Championships ?

TurboZ
03-04-2017, 02:11 AM
Joola makes a celluloid training look-alike of the China Super League ball:

http://www.tabletennis11.com/other_eng/joola-spinball-2-color-12-tk

I have a pack and no one wants to play with me. :(

TurboZ
03-04-2017, 02:18 AM
Are these balls being used for the current Chinese Championships ?

If you mean the current WTTC Trials then I believe they are using the official Nittaku balls for the event. But they did used the ABS (D40+) for the earlier Stage 1 and 2 since January.

chuckjordan2
03-05-2017, 03:13 AM
I brought a box to the club and shared them with the top players 1800+ USATT. All commented that the balls were very round. Not one egg.

Feedback I received: spins well, easy to read (large lettering), plays fast. One player mentioned it was 'slow to launch' and at first i didn't understand him.

Then it was my turn to play (disclosure: i am a lower rated player). The surface grips well (spinning impacts on the table take effect. And i came to realize what one player meant ('slow to launch') in that when starting a new ball, it's slower the first minute until a few hits, then it it's normal (sounds weird, however, 2 people noticed this).

5 balls from one lot doesn't mean instant success. It is in the right direction.

I'd like to read other's experience with them.

Chuck

Baal
03-09-2017, 01:08 AM
Thanks to a tip from Chuck Jordan I was able to buy two boxes of the new DHS 3* D40+ balls from this place:

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Exclusive-Sales-Newest-DHS-3-Star-D40-Table-Tennis-Balls-ITTF-Approved-Seamed-New-Material-Plastic/32793435592.html

I received them in about 10 days and I played with them this evening. I paid $15 for 12 balls. Note that these are the ones that come in a box with Ding Ning's picture on it. The ones with Ma Long on the box are the crappy old ones. Here is my review:

I already believe that this is the best plastic ball in table tennis right now when everything is considered.

From a playing perspective I actually like them slightly better than the Nittaku Premium!! I never thought I would say that about a Chinese plastic ball!

Surface of the ball looks exactly like Nittaku Premium. The seams are a little larger, though, more like earlier seamed balls from China.

They are absolutely perfectly round.

The static bounce is exactly the same height as Nittaku Premium. If you let the bounces die out on the table, they stop bouncing at exactly the same time the Nittaku does. This is a huge improvement for DHS. None of their earlier plastic balls bounced for crap.

The D40+ have a normal sound on bouncing (this is different from the 1* version).

Spin and speed is very similar to the Nittaku, but the DHS feels a little more solid. My practice partner could not tell the difference from the Nittaku Premium when I switched up on him. More significantly, coach Li Kewai (~2700 player) could tell a slight difference and his opinion is that he preferred the DHS D40+ to the Nittaku Premium, and I shared that opinion, although the difference is very very slight. I think the DHS might be very slightly heavier. There is no accounting for tastes, but I would be really surprised if very many people conclude that the D40+ is significantly worse to play with than Nittaku Premium.

On top of all that, the DHS40+ is cheaper. Also, as DHS stops the production of their previously horrible awful terrible miserable plastic balls, these will probably become the standard, and hopefully other companies will be putting their brands on this ball. It would be a major improvement for the sport. The key will be if DHS can make enough of these D40+ balls to meet the demand and still maintain this level of quality.

This is the best news I have been able to report in a really long time. As for my expertise on this, I think it is extensive. I know the plastic ball situation in detail (more than I know about most other equipment issues). Very early on I completely stopped playing with celluloid balls, and I have tried about every 40+ ball made, and I was the first one on English language TT forums to really push the idea that the seamless balls are decent, and not as bad as the prototypes floating around for awhile might have led us to believe. (At the time the expectation was that they would be really bad). Seamless balls actually have a lot of good properties, especially durability, but I think these new balls by DHS will probably be very bad news for the makers of seamless balls. I doubt once people get their hands on these, especially given the price, that people will want to use seamless very much. The playing properties are superior (by which I mean a lot closer to celluloid) and they are cheaper.

The likelihood as a result is that in the foreseeable future we will have a lot more uniformity of balls, which for the last few years has been a big problem for our sport. If in the future the dominant balls become the D40+ ones made by DHS (possibly sold by many companies) and the Nittaku Premium, we will have returned to a situation where the brand of ball doesn't matter very much (as in celluloid era).

UpSideDownCarl
03-09-2017, 04:12 AM
Thanks to a tip from Chuck Jordan I was able to buy two boxes of the new DHS 3* D40+ balls from this place:

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Exclusive-Sales-Newest-DHS-3-Star-D40-Table-Tennis-Balls-ITTF-Approved-Seamed-New-Material-Plastic/32793435592.html

I received them in about 10 days and I played with them this evening. I paid $15 for 12 balls. Note that these are the ones that come in a box with Ding Ning's picture on it. The ones with Ma Long on the box are the crappy old ones. Here is my review:

I already believe that this is the best plastic ball in table tennis right now when everything is considered.

From a playing perspective I actually like them slightly better than the Nittaku Premium!! I never thought I would say that about a Chinese plastic ball!

Surface of the ball looks exactly like Nittaku Premium. The seams are a little larger, though, more like earlier seamed balls from China.

They are absolutely perfectly round.

The static bounce is exactly the same height as Nittaku Premium. If you let the bounces die out on the table, they stop bouncing at exactly the same time the Nittaku does. This is a huge improvement for DHS. None of their earlier plastic balls bounced for crap.

The D40+ have a normal sound on bouncing (this is different from the 1* version).

Spin and speed is very similar to the Nittaku, but the DHS feels a little more solid. My practice partner could not tell the difference from the Nittaku Premium when I switched up on him. More significantly, coach Li Kewai (~2700 player) could tell a slight difference and his opinion is that he preferred the DHS D40+ to the Nittaku Premium, and I shared that opinion, although the difference is very very slight. I think the DHS might be very slightly heavier. There is no accounting for tastes, but I would be really surprised if very many people conclude that the D40+ is significantly worse to play with than Nittaku Premium.

On top of all that, the DHS40+ is cheaper. Also, as DHS stops the production of their previously horrible awful terrible miserable plastic balls, these will probably become the standard, and hopefully other companies will be putting their brands on this ball. It would be a major improvement for the sport. The key will be if DHS can make enough of these D40+ balls to meet the demand and still maintain this level of quality.

This is the best news I have been able to report in a really long time. As for my expertise on this, I think it is extensive. I know the plastic ball situation in detail (more than I know about most other equipment issues). Very early on I completely stopped playing with celluloid balls, and I have tried about every 40+ ball made, and I was the first one on English language TT forums to really push the idea that the seamless balls are decent, and not as bad as the prototypes floating around for awhile might have led us to believe. (At the time the expectation was that they would be really bad). Seamless balls actually have a lot of good properties, especially durability, but I think these new balls by DHS will probably be very bad news for the makers of seamless balls. I doubt once people get their hands on these, especially given the price, that people will want to use seamless very much. The playing properties are superior (by which I mean a lot closer to celluloid) and they are cheaper.

The likelihood as a result is that in the foreseeable future we will have a lot more uniformity of balls, which for the last few years has been a big problem for our sport. If in the future the dominant balls become the D40+ ones made by DHS (possibly sold by many companies) and the Nittaku Premium, we will have returned to a situation where the brand of ball doesn't matter very much (as in celluloid era).

Baal, this is the best news I have heard about TT in a very long time. Thanks for this great write up.


Sent from The Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy

Suga D
03-09-2017, 07:03 AM
Thanks to a tip from Chuck Jordan I was able to buy two boxes of the new DHS 3* D40+ balls from this place:

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Exclusive-Sales-Newest-DHS-3-Star-D40-Table-Tennis-Balls-ITTF-Approved-Seamed-New-Material-Plastic/32793435592.html

I received them in about 10 days and I played with them this evening. I paid $15 for 12 balls. Note that these are the ones that come in a box with Ding Ning's picture on it. The ones with Ma Long on the box are the crappy old ones. Here is my review:

I already believe that this is the best plastic ball in table tennis right now when everything is considered.

From a playing perspective I actually like them slightly better than the Nittaku Premium!! I never thought I would say that about a Chinese plastic ball!

Surface of the ball looks exactly like Nittaku Premium. The seams are a little larger, though, more like earlier seamed balls from China.

They are absolutely perfectly round.

The static bounce is exactly the same height as Nittaku Premium. If you let the bounces die out on the table, they stop bouncing at exactly the same time the Nittaku does. This is a huge improvement for DHS. None of their earlier plastic balls bounced for crap.

The D40+ have a normal sound on bouncing (this is different from the 1* version).

Spin and speed is very similar to the Nittaku, but the DHS feels a little more solid. My practice partner could not tell the difference from the Nittaku Premium when I switched up on him. More significantly, coach Li Kewai (~2700 player) could tell a slight difference and his opinion is that he preferred the DHS D40+ to the Nittaku Premium, and I shared that opinion, although the difference is very very slight. I think the DHS might be very slightly heavier. There is no accounting for tastes, but I would be really surprised if very many people conclude that the D40+ is significantly worse to play with than Nittaku Premium.

On top of all that, the DHS40+ is cheaper. Also, as DHS stops the production of their previously horrible awful terrible miserable plastic balls, these will probably become the standard, and hopefully other companies will be putting their brands on this ball. It would be a major improvement for the sport. The key will be if DHS can make enough of these D40+ balls to meet the demand and still maintain this level of quality.

This is the best news I have been able to report in a really long time. As for my expertise on this, I think it is extensive. I know the plastic ball situation in detail (more than I know about most other equipment issues). Very early on I completely stopped playing with celluloid balls, and I have tried about every 40+ ball made, and I was the first one on English language TT forums to really push the idea that the seamless balls are decent, and not as bad as the prototypes floating around for awhile might have led us to believe. (At the time the expectation was that they would be really bad). Seamless balls actually have a lot of good properties, especially durability, but I think these new balls by DHS will probably be very bad news for the makers of seamless balls. I doubt once people get their hands on these, especially given the price, that people will want to use seamless very much. The playing properties are superior (by which I mean a lot closer to celluloid) and they are cheaper.

The likelihood as a result is that in the foreseeable future we will have a lot more uniformity of balls, which for the last few years has been a big problem for our sport. If in the future the dominant balls become the D40+ ones made by DHS (possibly sold by many companies) and the Nittaku Premium, we will have returned to a situation where the brand of ball doesn't matter very much (as in celluloid era).

That sounds almost too good to be true. Very very cool.
Really appreciate your expertise. Guess i have to order a few.

Had to laugh about this part though



Seamless balls actually have a lot of good properties, especially durability, but I think these new balls by DHS will probably be very bad news for the makers of seamless balls...

Sorry, Mr. Sharara
[EMOJI12]

UpSideDownCarl
03-09-2017, 11:42 AM
Had to laugh about this part though


Seamless balls actually have a lot of good properties, especially durability, but I think these new balls by DHS will probably be very bad news for the makers of seamless balls...

Sorry, Mr. Sharara
[EMOJI12]

Hahahahaha. That is a good one.


Sent from The Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy

Baal
03-09-2017, 12:49 PM
As I read through my review I realized there is something I need to clarify. I don't actually have any information or knowledge that says that DHS is going to discontinue the crappy awful terrible and unacceptable 40+ balls they have been selling for the last few years (the ones with the Ma Long box). I would hope that in time they will just stop selling those and that all the companies they have been supplying with those same crappy balls will in time adopt the new D40+ ones. I would hope that ITTF will eventually make their approval process sufficiently stringent that the crappy ones won't be able to be sold anymore. But I have no information on what DHS and other companies are planning to do.

The thing that may delay the more general adoption of these balls is how quickly DHS can increase the production capacity of the D40+ to meet the demand. It took Nittaku some time to do this, and it the availability of these D40+ balls to regular people (as opposed to the CNT) has been delayed by almost a year and you still can't buy them from places like TT11.

I have no information on any of that. All I can say is that the D40+ 3* is an outstanding ball and along with the Nittaku Premium should become the standard.

Zaid323918
03-09-2017, 12:52 PM
As I read through my review I realized there is something I need to clarify. I don't actually have any information or knowledge that says that DHS is going to discontinue the crappy awful terrible and unacceptable 40+ balls they have been selling for the last few years (the ones with the Ma Long box). I would hope that in time they will just stop selling those and that all the companies they have been supplying with those same crappy balls will in time adopt the new D40+ ones. I would hope that ITTF will eventually make their approval process sufficiently stringent that the crappy ones won't be able to be sold anymore.

The thing that may delay that is how quickly they can increase the production capacity of the D40+ to meet the demand. It took Nittaku some time to do this, and it the appearance of these D40+ has been delayed by almost a year and you still can't buy they from places like TT11.

I have no information on any of that. All I can say is that the D40+ 3* is an outstanding ball.

So if I was interested in buying this ball I should only go with the 3 star version? (i.e. don't buy the one and two star versions) Plus how is the durability of this ball compared to the seamless ones?

Baal
03-09-2017, 01:30 PM
So if I was interested in buying this ball I should only go with the 3 star version? (i.e. don't buy the one and two star versions)

I don't know about the 2* version, I could never find it in stock. I didn't like the 1*.

Zaid323918
03-09-2017, 01:31 PM
I don't know about the 2* version, I could never find it in stock. I didn't like the 1*.
The 2 stars are on TT11

Baal
03-09-2017, 01:36 PM
But they were never in stock on TT11 when I tried to buy them. So I have no info. The Nittaku J Top is a good training ball.

Zaid323918
03-09-2017, 03:13 PM
Oh sorry to bother you but I wanted to know about the D40 3 star's durability. How is compared to the Nittaku? The seamless balls like XSF, Xiom, Kingnik?

Baal
03-09-2017, 04:50 PM
I don't know yet. The 3* D40+ are cheap so less crucial.

laistrogian
03-09-2017, 05:14 PM
I don't know yet. The 3* D40+ are cheap so less crucial.

If DHS can maintain a good QC, this might be the winner product for plastic ball especially since ITTF will use DHS until tokyo 2020

TurboZ
03-14-2017, 07:30 AM
Finally got my shipment after a long delay waiting for the Gold Arc 5. As I love their 1 star D40+ a lot so my expectation of their 3 stars is always high. Will start playing with it tomorrow and see how good it is. After reading so many positive feedbacks here I bet I won't be disappointed, except an overflow of Ding Ning in my head. :p

12477

NextLevel
03-14-2017, 11:49 AM
I got my shipment yesterday. I lent a ball to two different clubmates and then used the ball briefly after they were done. TT is going to be fun again. I also liked the way this ball aged vs the Nittaku so far. Does not feel yet as if it is going to become a shiny fragile turd.

IT's really an awesome ball. 55 cents for this after the repeated $3 rapes by Nittaku is a big relief.

Shifu
03-14-2017, 12:00 PM
12488

I will test in a few days :)

Baal
03-14-2017, 03:21 PM
I have not had one break. I don't think they spin less than seamless. I think judging how much a ball spins is very difficult for reasons I can go into if people are interested.

NextLevel
03-14-2017, 03:27 PM
I have not had one break. I don't think they spin less than seamless. I think judging how much a ball spins is very difficult for reasons I can go into if people are interested.

Most people who make the comparison are comparing them to the crappy DHS 40+ balls. That said, the spin effect of these balls is reasonably good. I don't see them being any worse than Nittaku but I will get more practice in today.

Baal
03-14-2017, 04:41 PM
Here is why it is hard to judge whether one 40+ ball has "more spin" than another.

Among different classes of 40+ balls, there are very marked differences in: (1) how high they bounce, (2) how much they weigh and the average outer diameter, (3) how smooth the outer surface is, which affects how they fly through the air and how they interact with the table, (4) the type of plastic they are made of, which affects hardness, durability, and how high they bounce, as well as sound, (5) presence or absence of a seam, which can affect ball rotation, more or less like a gyroscope.

Because of all of this, different types of 40+ balls can be annoyingly different, more than we ever dealt with in the days of 38 and 40 mm celluloids. A bad situation for sure.

For all those reasons, two different kinds of 40+ balls with the actual same amount of rotations per second (let's say an XSF vs a Nittaku premium, or maybe a previous DHS 40+) are going to behave differently as a result of that rotation. The differences in how they behave are usually the things we use to judge how much spin a ball has, since most of the time we can't see the rotation directly, as the ball is spinning too fast. We judge spin by arc on the ball, by feel, by what happens when the ball hits the table or our own or the opponent's racket. And some people may rely more on one thing than another, either because of their level, or how they play, or even the table they use and the lighting, etc. etc. That is why you see people here and elsewhere coming to pretty opposite conclusions about spin of a ball.

Personally I don't think the new D40+ spins appreciably less than seamless. (If anything I would say the reverse, but for reasons above, my impression may not be worth much).

Because D40+ bounces the same as a Nittaku Premium, and is made form the same kind of ABS plastic, I find it to play most similar to that ball. It is a little bit heavier. People might notice a slight difference because of that, but you can adjust in a few seconds from one to another.

Does the D40+ spin less than the earlier crappy DHS 40+ balls? I honestly don't know. Beyond all the reasons I just gave, there is another: those cellulose acetate 40+ balls are so crappy, so fragile, so egg-shaped, and so low-bouncing, that I refuse to play with them. LGL thinks the D40+ spins less, and that is good reason to think this might be real, but even he might be fooled unless they have analyzed this stuff with a high speed camera.

Zaid323918
03-14-2017, 06:08 PM
Do the D40s come with that white powder stuff like on the Nittaku? Oh yeah do they lose a bit of spin as they wear like the seamless ones?

Baal
03-14-2017, 06:49 PM
Pretty dusty. Maybe not quite as much as Nittaki.

chuckjordan2
03-15-2017, 02:20 AM
I have 15 hours (4 sessions) on 1 ball. The outer surface still has grip. I'm finding that the ball surface picks up paint chips off the Butterfly tables i play on.

The ball still spins great after these hours of use.

I lent out 3 DHS D40+ balls to others players in the club. Nobody wanted to return them........

Again, each ball was perfectly round. Bounced and played like a Nittaku 40+

NextLevel
03-15-2017, 03:32 AM
It wears its outer surface much better than a Nittaku plus. This is a great and durable ball. I hit the net post in a third ball drive and it survived and played quite a few games I don't like how it takes my spin but I will accept that because of the consistency of the quality.

NextLevel
03-15-2017, 05:41 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cR0mH6Dp1qI

TurboZ
03-15-2017, 02:21 PM
Play alternatively with D40+ 3 stars, 1 star and Nittaku Premium for a few hours today. The outcome is positive as expected. In a drop test both NP and 1 star bounce more. But in play the 1 star will not go forward as much. Still I would say 1 star is about 80% similar and I can happily play with it all day. 1 star has a higher pitch ping noise than 3 stars, until after playing with NP that the ping noise of 3 stars became noticeable.


I remember a 1 star last me a few days. Can't say much about the durability of 3 stars after just 1 day of play but it is still in one piece after lots of hard banging so I won't doubt it. The rough surface is still rough but scared with table paint.


Butterfly released an Easy Ball before but I would say this D40+ is truly easy to play. Balls kept coming back even with kill shot that is not expected to be returned. My friend said that he can return my spiny loops now which he had trouble before. Does that mean it has less spin or slower speed? Possibly both. But it still kicks after making top and side spin loops so the fun is not loss.

The trajectory is predictable, even more so than seamless. Considering the price and all the positive aspects I sure will not waste more money on other balls again. I am happy DHS finally done something right. :)

Baal
03-15-2017, 02:44 PM
TT11 says they will be selling the D40+ balls in about a month.

CroneOne
03-17-2017, 08:19 PM
Couple of years of blatant obviousness knocking on their heads, but good
news nonetheless...

http://www.ittf.com/2017/03/17/ittf-president-thomas-weikert-ensures-work-improve-quality-balls/

TurboZ
03-17-2017, 11:04 PM
Couple of years of blatant obviousness knocking on their heads, but good
news nonetheless...

http://www.ittf.com/2017/03/17/ittf-president-thomas-weikert-ensures-work-improve-quality-balls/

Glad that they have finally pay attention to how different balls are played and try to level it. But I guess seamed and seamless balls will never play similar and any change of action will favor the new DHS and gradually fade out seamless if they really aim to support only one standard.

My D40+ ball survived another day of hard banging so it is all good. This time I mix in the old 40+ and the first few loops did block long and curve in the air seems more prominent. But anything can adapt fast and difference became less noticeable after a few minutes.

The surface of old ball is very smooth and new ball very rough. It seems logical to think that the rough surface will give more friction so higher spin and reaction to spin is expected. So why the opposite? The rough surface of new ball is so rough that it just kills off spin in the air perhaps? Nevertheless I already find myself hitting harder trying to compensate for it.

I wonder how much TT11 will priced their new balls in the future as I see them drop ridiculously fast in taobao. The old 40+ can be bought even cheaper now. I believe they will fade it out very soon.

CroneOne
03-18-2017, 12:09 AM
Ordered some from TTnPP. Looking forward to hitting with them. If they play like the NP40+ I won't have to adapt much. I just hope that the local clubs get rid of those nasty STAG 40+ balls.

Baal
03-18-2017, 01:07 AM
Still haven't broken one! Not for lack of trying. I now agree with whoever said the outer surface holds up better than Nittaku. This surprises me but it is pretty clear to me now.

So at this point all my questions about this ball are pretty much answered. Good play, good price, good durability. All good. Now, if they can just maintain this quality.

Ilia Minkin
03-18-2017, 01:28 AM
Where are the orange balls when I need them so much? White walls in our gym drive me nuts.

UpSideDownCarl
03-18-2017, 02:31 AM
It is a really good question why, after close to 3 years, there are still no yellow Poly balls.


Sent from The Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy

TurboZ
03-28-2017, 04:40 AM
My order of 2 x 72 balls from TTNPP arrived today. It is placed on 20th March, shipped 23rd and arrived 28th. Not bad for shipping from HK. I am surprised to see 15 boxes of 10 instead of pack of 6 so I received 6 bonus balls for free. :rolleyes: Only problem is that many boxes are badly crushed at the corners. The Double Fish V40+ has much better package by comparison.

12633

TurboZ
04-23-2017, 09:11 AM
After watching the Korea Open which is the first international tournament to use the new D40+ balls, it kind of surprised me to see Timo Boll came up winning Men's Single with his spiny game play. Glad to see it is not just about winning with power after all and spin is still there if you have the technique. But I have to say the game play in the China Trials earlier was much faster and intense with the same ball. Would have to see what the top Chinese can do with it next and how much the new ball will affect the balance.

BTW I have yet to break one after more than a month, what am I suppose to do with hundreds of them? :p

Murre5
04-23-2017, 11:53 AM
BTW I have yet to break one after more than a month, what am I suppose to do with hundreds of them? :p

Break 2 of them, put them in the heels of your shoes and then do footwork multiball with the rest.

Baal
04-23-2017, 02:29 PM
Last time I wrote here to say I haven't broken one yet was March 17.

I still haven't broken one (although I alternate the D40+ with my Nittaku Premiums, which I will do until I have used up my stash of Nittakus).

As for the whole "no spin" issue (non-issue), I for one am not in the least bit surprised that Timo Boll won a tournament with this ball.

Here is my prediction for the upcoming year: 12 months from now, the world's top two players will be Ma Long and FZD in some order or another, and there will be some other CNT players at the top. Ovtcharov will be in the top 10. So will Mitzutani. With Timo it will depend on whether he stays healthy, and he and Vladi are not young.

In other words, nothing much will change. Of course it is possible that someone young may emerge from somewhere (because someone often does and that would happen with any of the balls), and somebody we are used to seeing at the top will suffer injuries that cause their level to drop (which pretty much everywhere outside of China is how elite careers end).

flash
04-23-2017, 03:25 PM
I got the D40+ balls as soon as TTNPP had them, so far I have had only one broken (big foot stepped on it), these balls to me play as good if not better than the NP40+ 3 star balls. I like how they stay rougher longer than the NP40+ 3 star balls and they are a whole lot cheaper. Now if the QC of future balls don't go bad, that is the worry.

Ot Ot
04-24-2017, 09:49 AM
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170424/a56859310d3e9634c392c9a774998f6d.jpg

Are there 2 versions of the new ball?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

AndySmith
04-24-2017, 10:26 AM
https://www.tabletennisdaily.co.uk/forum/cache.php?img=https%3A%2F%2Fuploads.tapatalk-cdn.com%2F20170424%2Fa56859310d3e9634c392c9a774998f6d.jpg

Are there 2 versions of the new ball?

Sent from my spyPhone using Tapatalk

No. The one on the left is the old, awful one.

AndySmith
04-24-2017, 10:45 AM
After watching the Korea Open which is the first international tournament to use the new D40+ balls, it kind of surprised me to see Timo Boll came up winning Men's Single with his spiny game play. Glad to see it is not just about winning with power after all and spin is still there if you have the technique. But I have to say the game play in the China Trials earlier was much faster and intense with the same ball. Would have to see what the top Chinese can do with it next and how much the new ball will affect the balance.

BTW I have yet to break one after more than a month, what am I suppose to do with hundreds of them? :p

I don't mind admitting that I thought Timo would struggle with these balls. But that was based on the D40+ being very similar to the NP40+, and also my understanding of how he plays and the conditions his style performs best in. Two things I may be really wrong about. He had a great tournament (with some timely luck against Kenta) and looked very at ease. It was heartening to see.

Quite apart from Timo, I still think that rock-hard balls like NP40+ and D40+ need a different approach in certain circumstances and some players will feel more comfortable than others. Franziska's direct power style looks more effective than I've seen before, but it's probably just a short-term wibble.

Baal
04-24-2017, 05:25 PM
but it's probably just a short-term wibble.
For all these players. Very soon now everybody will have adjusted to ABS balls and table variation will matter more than ball variation. Some DHS tables have a very glassy surface. People don't talk about that so much. I think the world rankings won't change much because of balls per se. (I don't think Ma Long's greatness depends on crappy balls).

Baal
04-24-2017, 05:33 PM
I've been using ABS balls since NP40 came out. I win and lose points just the same as with 40 mm. For me its just ping pong at this point. But cellulose acetate really took the fun out for me but I probably would have adjusted in time. ABS made adjustment to 40+ easier. Since I never adjusted to crappy 40+ I can't guess how hard it is to switch back to a good ball. But rounder and more consistent bounce is a good thing. I think pros will adjust really fast.

NextLevel
04-24-2017, 06:05 PM
I've been using ABS balls since NP40 came out. I win and lose points just the same as with 40 mm. For me its just ping pong at this point. But cellulose acetate really took the fun out for me but I probably would have adjusted in time. ABS made adjustment to 40+ easier. Since I never adjusted to crappy 40+ I can't guess how hard it is to switch back to a good ball. But rounder and more consistent bounce is a good thing. I think pros will adjust really fast.

Yes. And more and better rallies. No silly mistakes in serve return or third ball or rallies because of deformed balls.

I think Timo's struggles with the NP40+ at competitions were really about declining form and good opponents. All those people who beat him have improved vs the field as well against Boll. Boll wqs an off the bounce looping master and monster and other than loss of form, there was absolutely no reason for his game to decline vs anyone else.

yourock
04-25-2017, 02:54 AM
I personally feel now it is not a good time to eliminate seamless ball by changing standard. At this moment DHS D 40+ are not distributed that much. It still takes time to check out their mass production quality. Seamless ball sold cheaper than Nittaku balls. If we only leave DHS and Nittaku on the market, what if DHS raise price again and what if availability is not good. My guts told me, something deeper is behind this launch of new DHS ball, and I highly doubt low-priced good products could be at low for very long. Maybe it's all just a politics show.


从我的 iPhone 发送,使用 Tapatalk

yourock
04-25-2017, 02:59 AM
Who wins presidential is not really my interest. Which manufacturer laughs over the triumph is also not my business. What I want is simply, ball options, consistent quality, reasonable price. I don't like being forced with one certain type of ball.


从我的 iPhone 发送,使用 Tapatalk

Baal
04-25-2017, 12:32 PM
Seamless ball makers have no intention of going away I am sure. I prefer the ABS balls but I hope the seamless ball makers continue to keep downward pressure on prices.

yourock
04-25-2017, 01:12 PM
Indeed new DHS ball improves a lot compares to old crappy version, and I think that's good news for players. Yet it seems exaggerating to claim "new era" when an improvement happens. I didn't see anyone claiming it's a new era when Nittaku P was launched into the market. From what I heard, most balls in Japan are still Nittaku, and most used balls in China are the one named Yinhe seamless ball. I guess that's why DHS lowered price unbelievably cheap, trying to get some decent market share. In Korea, the most favorable ball is also not DHS ball nor its clones... strangely people had high expectation for Butterfly balls before they had German factory to produce for them, yet seems not so many people like their balls. Let's see what happens. Hope other decent balls wouldn't been a sacrifice of some political war! Good to have options.


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AndySmith
04-25-2017, 01:16 PM
Seamless ball makers have no intention of going away I am sure. I prefer the ABS balls but I hope the seamless ball makers continue to keep downward pressure on prices.

As much as constant switching between balls and adjusting from one week to the next drives me mad, things are slowly improving. The harder seamless balls are less floaty, bounce a bit lower, and are more round than earlier batches (Xiom are my favorite so far), and with the D40+ and NP40+ being so close in behaviour, the gaps are closing. Otherwise I'd say that the frustration of constant switching outweighs market forces.

Baal
04-25-2017, 01:44 PM
I think we are approaching the point where differences in tables outweigh differences in balls. Maybe we are not quite there yet, but getting close. (Assuming that the celllulose acetate balls pretty much disappear, and why would they persist since they are bad, fragile, and costly?)

yuri.saldon
04-29-2017, 02:22 AM
Here's my review about dhs d40+

I was so anxious to test this new ball. When the ball come the roundness and lack of spin (or whatever you call ) was evident even when I spin the ball on my nail.

First day playing with it was horrible. I hated that ball it was something stranger in how it behaviour. D40+ lose spin easily in rallys (i cannot explain that even in Portuguese).

The second day was more or less the same.

But after lose all my hope in the ball I get used to it and I like it.

Now I'm in love with the ball too.

Sent from my 2014819 using Tapatalk

Baal
04-29-2017, 12:49 PM
Here's my review about dhs d40+

I was so anxious to test this new ball. When the ball come the roundness and lack of spin (or whatever you call ) was evident even when I spin the ball on my nail.

First day playing with it was horrible. I hated that ball it was something stranger in how it behaviour. D40+ lose spin easily in rallys (i cannot explain that even in Portuguese).

The second day was more or less the same.

But after lose all my hope in the ball I get used to it and I like it.

Now I'm in love with the ball too.

Sent from my 2014819 using Tapatalk

I suspect a lot of people who have not been mostly playing with NP40 will react exactly like this.

NextLevel
04-29-2017, 12:57 PM
He uses an all wood blade too so he doesn't get the benefit of carbon impact.

suds79
05-03-2017, 02:16 PM
Hit with a buddy this morning and was my first hit with the new DHS ABS 40+ 3 star ball.

Our club currently plays with the Gambler 40+ 3 star seamless ball.

I did a spin wobble test. Perfectly round.

Honestly, we played and everything felt normal. I'm perfectly happy with the Gambler ball but if this ball ends up being extremely popular & is cheaper? Why not.

Honestly after hitting an hour with it this morning at no point did any bounce or hit feel off or weird. I play short pips so I'm not trying to spin it up all that often so maybe i'm not the best judge on the ball from that standpoint. I completely forgot we were hitting with a different ball until I was thinking about it just now. I would consider that a good thing that I didn't notice the ball.

It will most likely become our standard club ball.

Jabugo
05-03-2017, 03:53 PM
Hit with a buddy this morning and was my first hit with the new DHS ABS 40+ 3 star ball.

Our club currently plays with the Gambler 40+ 3 star seamless ball.

I did a spin wobble test. Perfectly round.

Honestly, we played and everything felt normal. I'm perfectly happy with the Gambler ball but if this ball ends up being extremely popular & is cheaper? Why not.

Honestly after hitting an hour with it this morning at no point did any bounce or hit feel off or weird. I play short pips so I'm not trying to spin it up all that often so maybe i'm not the best judge on the ball from that standpoint. I completely forgot we were hitting with a different ball until I was thinking about it just now. I would consider that a good thing that I didn't notice the ball.

It will most likely become our standard club ball.

I was very hesitant to try the new D40+ ball after my experience with the previous generation DHS ball. It seems to be exactly what the sport has been waiting for ever since the switch to 40+, a reasonably priced pro quality plastic ball. Now my only concern is how well DHS can handle batch consistency over the long term.

Zaid323918
05-03-2017, 04:51 PM
TT11 it's already May and you guys still don't have the D40+!

Suga D
05-04-2017, 07:46 PM
TT11 it's already May and you guys still don't have the D40+!

I beg your pardon.
http://www.tabletennis11.com/other_eng/dhs-dual-3-40-10-balls-seam
[Emoji6]

Zaid323918
05-04-2017, 07:48 PM
I beg your pardon.
http://www.tabletennis11.com/other_eng/dhs-dual-3-40-10-balls-seam
[Emoji6]
Yh I noticed them yesterday lol

suds79
05-04-2017, 07:53 PM
that's significantly more expensive on tabletennis11 compared to ttnpp.

I know there's probably the cost of importing them so you'd have to be pretty vendor loyal to go that route IMO.

Zaid323918
05-04-2017, 07:58 PM
that's significantly more expensive on tabletennis11 compared to ttnpp.

I know there's probably the cost of importing them so you'd have to be pretty vendor loyal to go that route IMO.

How reliable is ttnpp?

Suga D
05-04-2017, 08:25 PM
How reliable is ttnpp?

Haven't heard of any complaints so far.
Mine arrived within 12 days plus they gave me 2 Balls extra.
I've ordered three six packs and they've​ sent me two ten packs.
One could call me a satisfied customer.

suds79
05-04-2017, 09:17 PM
How reliable is ttnpp?

I've ordered from them twice. Everything went normal & no complaints.

TurboZ
05-04-2017, 10:37 PM
Price per ball from ttnpp is less than half comparing to tt11 so that is a no-brainer, but the catch is that you have to buy 72 to get their free shipping. That is probably enough to last a life time for many unless you are sharing it. BTW I just suffer my first lost after two months....by someone stepping on it. :(

Baal
05-05-2017, 11:49 AM
The first ones I bought from an Aliexpress site were closer to the TT11 price. I have no idea how ttnpp manages to sell so cheap. But the balls arrive in about 2 or 3 weeks and are good. TT11 will be faster though, and still a lot cheaper than NP40

Zaid323918
05-05-2017, 04:03 PM
The first ones I bought from an Aliexpress site were closer to the TT11 price. I have no idea how ttnpp manages to sell so cheap. But the balls arrive in about 2 or 3 weeks and are good. TT11 will be faster though, and still a lot cheaper than NP40
Yeah the price per ball is quite cheap compared to even seamless balls.

igorponger
05-06-2017, 06:47 PM
The game is dead. The point only lasts three strokes, all the rallies ending with a failure (net ball /off the table ball) because the plastic ball is stiff, flat bounce, and non spinny, --no arching any more, accurate play impossible as a result.
Stiff plastic material (ABS) killed the sport.
We certainly need a change of the rubber character. The topsheet has to be thick, subtle and soft for a better controlled play.
Those players that make changes shall win. The conervative players using inelastic topsheet will suffer badly.

igorponger
05-06-2017, 07:26 PM
Yes. And more and better rallies. No silly mistakes in serve return or third ball or rallies because of deformed balls.

I think Timo's struggles with the NP40+ at competitions were really about declining form and good opponents. All those people who beat him have improved vs the field as well against Boll. Boll wqs an off the bounce looping master and monster and other than loss of form, there was absolutely no reason for his game to decline vs anyone else.

Players need a new rubber. Thick and subtle topsheet with soft flexible pimples, thinner sponge layer.
He that hesitates to revamp his rubber is lost....

Baal
05-06-2017, 07:51 PM
Funny that the manufacurer's trends based on newly released rubbers are in the complete opposite direction. Thinner topshsets. Thicker sponge. Even shorter pips.

Things like Rasanter, Mantra, Regalis, Karis, Blue Storm.

I think they are trolling Igor.

igorponger
05-06-2017, 08:10 PM
DAMNED ABS PLASTIC. BACK TO THE STONY AGE.

With the stiff ABS plastic, the game did regressed back to the "speed glue" era, those damned years late 90's, fac*ing 38mm ball impossible to control.
We have now got an utterly uncontrollable play. Obvious degradation of the sport. No control. One continued sequense of lapses, to get the public annoyed and unhappy.
Some Stony Age, indeed... Stony perception of the ball... stony bounce of the ball... Mishits overwhelming...

NextLevel
05-06-2017, 08:17 PM
He left mytt to bring this crap here?

Baal
05-06-2017, 08:31 PM
Well, some things are "stony" for sure but I'm not thinking about D40 balls at the moment.

Damn balls ARE hard to control when you are being attacked by pink elephants.

Malcbarber
06-23-2017, 09:17 PM
13606I have managed to get some from presports and delivered in 4 days.
I have managed to get a few hours of practice with them last night.
So far I'm very impressed all are perfectly round unlike the seamless balls.
They do feel a bit faster than the yinhe seamless balls

suds79
08-15-2017, 07:05 PM
Does anybody know what's going on here?

I see there are two of the new DHS 40+ 3 star ABS (they call it cell-free) plastic balls.

The one with picturing Ding Ning is roughly 50 cents a ball. Our club uses these and everybody likes them.
http://ttnpp.com/store/3-stars/869-dhs-new-material-cell-free-dual-40-d40-3-stars-ball-x72-39.html
13951

Then there's from what I can tell the same type of ball just picturing Ma Long. These balls are well over a dollar a ball.
http://ttnpp.com/store/3-stars/734-dhs-new-material-cell-free-40-3-stars-ball-39.html
13952

Does anybody know what the difference is?

NextLevel
08-15-2017, 08:07 PM
The Ma Long ball is not ABS - it is just "cell free". It was the ball that broke a lot before the ABS ball was introduced.

chuckjordan2
08-16-2017, 06:27 AM
I'm waiting for the (non pro) tournament that has these DHS D40+ balls. Anyone know of a tournament (non pro) using them?

Heffs976
08-18-2017, 01:05 AM
Cell free D40+ 3 star balls available at Table tennis hub the ones with Ding Ning on the packaging
https://www.tabletennishub.co.uk/collections/balls/products/dhs-40-3-star-balls-10-pack

JHB
08-22-2017, 07:41 PM
I've just today received a packet of 10 of these from Table Tennis Hub - they were sent air mail from Thailand, took about 11 days to arrive. Looking forward to trying them out at the club on Friday !

Baal
08-23-2017, 02:44 PM
Does anybody know what's going on here?

I see there are two of the new DHS 40+ 3 star ABS (they call it cell-free) plastic balls.

The one with picturing Ding Ning is roughly 50 cents a ball. Our club uses these and everybody likes them.
http://ttnpp.com/store/3-stars/869-dhs-new-material-cell-free-dual-40-d40-3-stars-ball-x72-39.html
13951

Then there's from what I can tell the same type of ball just picturing Ma Long. These balls are well over a dollar a ball.
http://ttnpp.com/store/3-stars/734-dhs-new-material-cell-free-40-3-stars-ball-39.html
13952

Does anybody know what the difference is?

Let me add that to what Next Level wrote in more forceful terms. Avoid the Ma Long balls, they are terrible. They are made of cellulose acetate, they are fragile, not round, with weird bounce and ironically, expensive. They were introduced in about 2014.

The recently introduced Ding Ning balls (technically D40+) are made of a plastic similar to the ones used in the Nittaku Premium. They are good, and that is why people in your club like them. The Ma Long balls should be buried in a landfill somewhere.

Once they are out of the box you can tell the difference immediately by playing but note also that the good ones have a small D40+ printed on the ball label.

igorponger
08-24-2017, 01:20 AM
D40+ is a child toy (baby rattle) rather than a ball suited to play the sport game.
Once you can't get celluloid ball any longer, the KINGNIK PREMIUM *** ball is quiet the thing.

http://pro1b422a.pic5.websiteonline.cn/upload/photobank-2_yu5w.jpg

UpSideDownCarl
08-24-2017, 02:39 AM
D40+ is a child toy (baby rattle) rather than a ball suited to play the sport game.[/img]

This is pretty funny. But it seems there are a bunch of people who really like the D40+ ball.


Sent from The Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy

bobpuls
08-24-2017, 04:15 AM
i have already 10 peaces of D40+ from DHS .... But no one wants to play with this balls with me so i realy cant tell ;-) But yesterday i just played with new Gewo balls which i think are abs.... and they are fast and bouncy ..... I have to switch to second blade (more softer top ply) to manage better the speed ..... But generally at the end i get used to it .... The game gets faster and shorter. My third attack is faster so it is OK for me ..... only one down side is the short underspin serves sometimes do not end in the net but opponent hits the top of the net and they fall on my side ;-( , but this can be fixed as well i think

JHB
08-24-2017, 07:18 PM
D40+ is a child toy (baby rattle) rather than a ball suited to play the sport game.
Once you can't get celluloid ball any longer, the KINGNIK PREMIUM *** ball is quiet the thing.



I'll make my own mind up on the D40+. However what I will say is that my team used the Kingnik balls for home matches all through last season and there were no complaints either from our players or from opponents. They were cheap too, the cheapest 3* poly balls available in the UK last year.

JHB
08-26-2017, 04:49 PM
UPDATE - I used a D40+ ball in a "friendly" doubles game yesterday. One of the other players said that the ball was "slow", by which I think he meant that it didn't come off the bat as quickly as our usual ball (Nittaku 3* celluloid, club bought a huge job-lot for the OAP sessions and we're still trying to get through them!) I felt the D40+ seemed heavier than other balls I've tried and had a lower bounce on average. For example, I managed to get a couple of pushes to bounce twice on the opponents' side, which I don't normally manage with any other ball. On the other hand when the ball was hit hard, it stayed hit. Some of these effects may be because the ball was new and gripped better on the surface of the table, or maybe I picked out a rogue one - not sure. Anyway I think the jury is still out on this one and further testing is required....

suds79
08-14-2018, 12:25 PM
So at our club, a member who with some college students, traveled to somewhere to China to train with some academy and they took some of our DHS D40+ balls we get from TTNPP. They were told from people there that the ball we have is fake.

First off, I hate stories like this. There's nothing I can do to prove or disprove this. It's just hearsay. But that's what they were told. That largely most things DHS outside of China are fakes.

I think that probably there is nothing I can do about this. But in investigating, I remember this ITTF video on how DHS balls are made from 2017.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_oBgkMCSS8

There's a section on quality control at 4:13 where they state the the balls that pass through this one by one inspection mark, the "competition balls" are selected. Does anybody know if those are simply the cream of the crop that are used in competitions and/or professional academies in China? I doubt DHS throws out all the balls that don't make the competition ball standard. I assume they're simply boxed up & sold. Could that be what's going here?

For example. I know if that I were to get a DHS H3 National, it wouldn't be the same DHS H3 National say Ma Long gets because they get the best quality cuts pieces reserved for them. Could it be the same for balls?

Thoughts?

FastMisha
03-29-2019, 05:57 PM
18830
These with the world tour logo are 3-4 times more expensive than the regular ones.
I'm wondering, are they any better than the regular D40+?

Loopadoop
03-29-2019, 06:07 PM
Probably higher quality selection process from the production line, otherwise probably not any difference.

MJB999
03-30-2019, 10:37 AM
[QU wOTE=FastMisha;267075]18830
These with the world tour logo are 3-4 times more expensive than the regular ones.
I'm wondering, are they any better than the regular D40+?[/QUOTE]a

Where can you buy these balls with the red logo?

FastMisha
03-30-2019, 01:15 PM
On aliexpress

FastMisha
03-30-2019, 01:16 PM
Here
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/DHS-2019-latest-ITTF-WORLD-TOUR-3-Star-Table-Tennis-Balls-D40-Special-Version-3-Star/32992289199.html

suds79
04-09-2019, 01:44 PM
DHS D40+ update.

Just got some of these balls (they're the Ding Ning ones just as a heads up) in for club. We've been using these balls for a little over a couple of years I'm guessing with good results and people seem to feel they're fine.

However, sometimes I've got to wonder about that infamous DHS quality control. Ordered 144 balls from TTNPP

And while I didn't notice it when they were by themselves, after taking them to club and putting them in the bin of our other DHS D40+ balls that are used, these new ones are kinda off white in color where the old ones are pure white.

I did a bounce test and checked the seam. Hit with them. I couldn't tell any difference. But still, they look kinda off-white or even ivory color in comparison.

Sigh. While I'd prefer them to be more white, as long as they play the same, I guess it's not that big of a deal

18886

The used, white ball is on the left. You can tell by the table stuffs. The new, yellowish ball is on the right.

RidTheKid
04-09-2019, 02:44 PM
I have the same experience with both off white and white D40+ balls in same batch.


DHS D40+ update.

Just got some of these balls (they're the Ding Ning ones just as a heads up) in for club. We've been using these balls for a little over a couple of years I'm guessing with good results and people seem to feel they're fine.

However, sometimes I've got to wonder about that infamous DHS quality control. Ordered 144 balls from TTNPP

And while I didn't notice it when they were by themselves, after taking them to club and putting them in the bin of our other DHS D40+ balls that are used, these new ones are kinda off white in color where the old ones are pure white.

I did a bounce test and checked the seam. Hit with them. I couldn't tell any difference. But still, they look kinda off-white or even ivory color in comparison.

Sigh. While I'd prefer them to be more white, as long as they play the same, I guess it's not that big of a deal

18886

The used, white ball is on the left. You can tell by the table stuffs. The new, yellowish ball is on the right.

mihalichtheone
09-14-2019, 07:15 PM
The white DHS*** balls are not round at all for me, for some reason :(
Actually interesting thing: once I made an order from Aliexpress just for 10 balls (1 pack) and the "yellowish" balls came, very round and high quality.
I thought - good thing! And ordered two more packs from the same seller, but got those more white balls and 9/10 were NOT
round.

After that - exact same situation, only with tabletennis11 and this now scares me. I want quality "yellowish" and round
balls, not these white :(

And the difference is immediately noticeable while training / playing, even the sound is a little bit different.

igorponger
09-15-2019, 12:01 AM
Here
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/DHS-2019-latest-ITTF-WORLD-TOUR-3-Star-Table-Tennis-Balls-D40-Special-Version-3-Star/32992289199.html
1.50 USD a piece/ from Aliexpress

It is now available 0.95 USD from Indonesia dealer of https://shopee.co.id/Bola-Pingpong-Tenis-Meja-DHS-D40-World-Tour-i.39655790.2638687965

Be happy.