Recommendations for softer OFF blades vs. Viscaria

thomas.pong · Aug 28, 2017

Hi everyone,

I'm looking for an offensive blade with a bit softer feel than Viscaria (which I'm currently using), with hopefully a tad more control and spin yet retaining considerable speed. My idea is to pair it with MX-P or Rasanter R47 and reach a good balance.

I've been considering the Freitas ALC or Michael Maze (if I can get my hands on one), or a lighter Nittaku Acoustic Carbon (mine's close to 94g, too heavy for me).

Any thoughts and suggestions?

UpSideDownCarl · Aug 28, 2017

To me, it sounds like you are looking for an Innerforce ZLC or ALC.

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TTLOVE · Aug 28, 2017

innerforce layer alc is the real answer

UpSideDownCarl · Aug 28, 2017

The thing is, Innerforce ALC has these outer plies over the composite layer:

Limba-Limba-ALC

Innerforce Layer ALC, I think it has these plies:

Limba-Spruce-ALC

I think that is right and I am pretty sure the Spruce layer is correct.

And Spruce is bouncier, faster and springier than Limba. I think the reason that Butterly made the Innerforce Layer blades was that the softness of Limba-Limba was not as exciting as the faster ALC blades like Viscaria.

So, if the OP wants something softer than the traditional ALC blades from Butterfly, it actually might be the Innerforce blades and not the Innerforce Layer blades.

Hard to really tell though.

Best suggestion is to try them and see what you like. A lot of people who really liked the IF blades did not like the IFL blades. That probably goes both ways.

But the Spruce should make the IFL blades play closer to a Viscaria than the IF blades do.

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Giangt · Aug 28, 2017

Both the Innerforce and Innerforce layer series are noticeable slower than the Viscaria. Also worth mentioning is that the core ply of the Innerforce series is Ayous and not Kiri like the Viscaria. Ayous is a bit harder than Kiri and will give a different feeling when playing. There is a lot of options out there so if you could try some other blades at your club and then let us know your preference. It would narrow down what you actually like.

Floris · Aug 28, 2017

You might try Xiom Ignito with hinoki outer plies

UpSideDownCarl · Aug 29, 2017

Giangt said:
There is a lot of options out there so if you could try some other blades at your club and then let us know your preference. It would narrow down what you actually like.

This is the best info you can get. Try as many setups as you can and you will get a better idea of what you want.

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MindTrip · Aug 29, 2017

I have both Freitas and Viscaria . Freitas is not softer in feeling. Viscaria is softer and stiffer. Freitas is harder and more catapult from flex. Andro Treiber Z feels softer than Viscaria with more control.

yuri.saldon · Aug 29, 2017

Try Bo 2, it's cheaper, makes it affordable for tests

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DennyTTLover · Aug 29, 2017

TTLOVE said:
innerforce layer alc is the real answer

Would it be suitable for bh flick and looping as well? I've tried both viscaria and inf layer zlc but I'm wondering if the feeling on inf layer alc is as pleasant as that on viscaria

thomas.pong · Aug 29, 2017

Thanks everyone for your input thus far. I've tried many different blades and rubbers already, but still trying to find the one that feels right. The Nittaku Acoustic Carbon has come close, except the one I have feels a bit too heavy for me at 94g, which makes me want to get a lighter one, probably around 87-88g. The Viscaria feels good as well, although I would much prefer a ST handle, which is why I might want to test the Freitas ALC ST.

Based on your recommendations, I might also give the Innerforce Layer ALC.S a try.

DennyTTLover · Aug 29, 2017

thomas.pong said:
Thanks everyone for your input thus far. I've tried many different blades and rubbers already, but still trying to find the one that feels right. The Nittaku Acoustic Carbon has come close, except the one I have feels a bit too heavy for me at 94g, which makes me want to get a lighter one, probably around 87-88g. The Viscaria feels good as well, although I would much prefer a ST handle, which is why I might want to test the Freitas ALC ST.

Based on your recommendations, I might also give the Innerforce Layer ALC.S a try.

Hi

Just to save you some time on money, time and energy as well, I have tried Freitas ALC for 2~3 months and to tell the truth, its kinda stiff without feeling and becomes flexy when blocking. I can 100% assure you that Freitas ALC certainly is not a better option if you are looking for Viscaria alternative.

Personally, I would recommend you Drinkhall Powerspin from Tibhar(A tiny bit flexy, not stiff and packed with control. defo worth a try)
or, ZJK ALC is a good option if you are into bh flicking(I found it had loads of dwell and I actually had to adjust my option to be more forward and close the angle a bit more(it indeed depends on how much you use your wrist)

or, inf layer ALC.S (yes, the recent one) This one certainly felt softer than viscaria. If you were to have a soft blade for your life time, I can confidently recommend you this one.

I hope I have been helpful

6Finger · Aug 29, 2017

Check out Avalox Ma Wenge C555.

thomas.pong · Aug 29, 2017

DennyTTLover said:
Hi

Just to save you some time on money, time and energy as well, I have tried Freitas ALC for 2~3 months and to tell the truth, its kinda stiff without feeling and becomes flexy when blocking. I can 100% assure you that Freitas ALC certainly is not a better option if you are looking for Viscaria alternative.

Personally, I would recommend you Drinkhall Powerspin from Tibhar(A tiny bit flexy, not stiff and packed with control. defo worth a try)
or, ZJK ALC is a good option if you are into bh flicking(I found it had loads of dwell and I actually had to adjust my option to be more forward and close the angle a bit more(it indeed depends on how much you use your wrist)

or, inf layer ALC.S (yes, the recent one) This one certainly felt softer than viscaria. If you were to have a soft blade for your life time, I can confidently recommend you this one.

I hope I have been helpful

Thank you! Very helpful!

I think this reinforces my beliefs that I should try the ALC.S first and foremost and pair it with MX-P.

In addition, I will probably try the the Maze or Freitas in the future, perhaps pair it with the softer EL-S, then get another Acoustic Carbon in my preferred weight of ~87g.

DennyTTLover · Aug 30, 2017

thomas.pong said:
Thank you! Very helpful!

I think this reinforces my beliefs that I should try the ALC.S first and foremost and pair it with MX-P.

In addition, I will probably try the the Maze or Freitas in the future, perhaps pair it with the softer EL-S, then get another Acoustic Carbon in my preferred weight of ~87g.

Budgetwise, Andro Rasant Grip is a great alternative for T05s but not as durable(dies quicker)
Maze is pretty rare but you can make a LF post for the blade and you can negotiate with the seller at http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum_topics.asp?FID=16

If you are into softer feel rubbers, 05FX is a good option as well. too much feel would be an overkill but never hurts to get additional control.

I always end up coming back to 05FX for that extra ease of producing spin and more control despite the price.

I havent tried any tibhar rubbers apart from mx-p but I heard FX-p and EL-s are the soft ones.

For bh flicks, Rasant Grip from Andro is the best one ive tried. not so sensitive to spin, cool green sponge and grippy topsheet. only if it didnt die so quickly..(lasted me a year or two but it depends how much you use it)

azv · Aug 30, 2017

Any Innerforce Layer ALC.S reviews? How does it compare to korbel?

DennyTTLover · Aug 30, 2017

azv said:
Any Innerforce Layer ALC.S reviews? How does it compare to korbel?

In terms of the feel, Korbel feels softer and is more forgiving with control and dwell time. Strange enough, I found ALC.S and Viscaria to have just as pleasant feel as each other

timdm · Aug 30, 2017

I just posted my innerforce in the for sale section today...

Tinykin · Aug 30, 2017

A cheap experiment/option

I have a Viscaria and a Timo Boll Spirit, both shod with T05 on both sides. From reports, these blades are basically of the same build. However, my TBS is far softer than the Viscaria.
There are two reasons for this; the TBS was treated with linseed oil and the rubbers were attached using VOC glue. The Viscaria was not treated before use and the rubbers attached with water-based glue.
So you can make the Viscaria 'softer' by simply treating the blade and/or using VOC type glue to attach the rubbers.

DennyTTLover · Aug 31, 2017

Tinykin said:
I have a Viscaria and a Timo Boll Spirit, both shod with T05 on both sides. From reports, these blades are basically of the same build. However, my TBS is far softer than the Viscaria.
There are two reasons for this; the TBS was treated with linseed oil and the rubbers were attached using VOC glue. The Viscaria was not treated before use and the rubbers attached with water-based glue.
So you can make the Viscaria 'softer' by simply treating the blade and/or using VOC type glue to attach the rubbers.

That's interesting

I tried with TBS and Viscaria and I felt that viscaria has more of a soak-in soft feeling whereas TBS felt slightly more flexy. everyone has different feeling on their hands so not easy to judge from just one's view..

Recommendations for softer OFF blades vs. Viscaria

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