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TableTennisDaily
11-01-2017, 03:12 PM
The ITTF has published the new world rankings! These were released on November, 1st 2017 and it’s caused some major changes.

The new ranking list doesn't include players that have been inactive in ITTF competition for a period of 4 months+.


Germany's Dimitrij Ovtcharov reaches career high world ranking of 3!


https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/forum/cache.php?img=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tabletennisdaily.com%2Fforum%2Fimages%2Fdimitrijwinworldcup2017.jpg
Dimitrij Ovtcahrov, World #3 in November 2017 - Photo by: ITTF Flickr


Notable changes

Men
03) 4 Dimitrij Ovtcharov
08) 13 Simon Gauzy
43) 51 Benedikt Duda

Women
01) 2 Zhu Yuling
07) 10 Cheng I-Ching
21) 32 Chen Szu-Yu

Players inactive over last 4 months
Xu Xin
Zhang Jike
Jeong Youngsik
Ding Ning
Wu Yang


Men's World Rankings

The new ranking changes have created huge changes for both the men’s and women’s world ranking lists. Most noticeably in the men’s the previous month’s World number 3 Xu Xin and world number 6 Zhang Jike are now off the list. This puts Dimitrij Ovtcharov at number 3, Timo Boll at number 4, Koki Niwa at number 5 and Simon Gauzy flies into the world top 10 with an incredible career high world ranking of 8! Full rankings below...

Full rankings below:

01) 1 Ma Long
02) 2 Fan Zhendong
03) 4 Dimitrij Ovtcharov
04) 5 Timo Boll
05) 8 Koki Niwa
06) 7 Jun Mizutani
07) 9 Lin Gaoyuan
08) 13 Simon Gauzy
09) 11 Kenta Matsudaira
10) 12 Fang Bo
11) 15 Chuang Chih Yuan
12) 10 Wong Chun Ting
13) 16 Lee Sangsu
14) 17 Yan An
15) 14 Vladimir Samsonov
16) 18 Tomokazu Harimoto
17) 19 Marcos Freitas
18) 20 Hugu Calderano
19) 22 Masaki Yoshida
20) 21 OMar Assar
21) 24 Ruwen Filus
21) 24 Yuya Oshima
23) 41 Alexander Shibaev
24) 28 Mattias Karlsson
25) 30 Maharu Yoshimura
26) 26 Emmanuel Lebesson
27) 23 Kristian Karlsson
27) 36 Jeong Sangeun
27) 36 Quadri Aruna
30) 29 Bastian Steger
31) 35 Liang Jingkun
32) 32 Panagiotis Gionis
33) 34 Kou Lei
34) 38 Jin Ueda
35) 33 Chen Chien-An
36) 31 Stefan Fegerl
37) 42 Yuto Muramatsu
38) 38 Jonathan Groth
39) 40 Tiago Apolonia
40) 43 Ricardo Walther


Women's World Rankings

In the Women’s ranking the current Olympic Champion, Ding Ning is off the list and her place is taken by last weekend’s 2017 World Cup winner Zhu Yuling! What a week it’s been for the Chinese 22-year-old.Full rankings below:

01) 2 Zhu Yuling
02) 3 Chen Meng
03) 4 Liu Shiwe
04) 5 Kasumi Ishikawa
05) 6 Miu Hirano
06) 7 Mima Ito
07) 10 Cheng I-Ching
08) 8 Feng Tianwei
09) 9 Sun Yingsha
10) 11 Wang Manyu
11) 12 Han Ying
12) 13 Hitomi Sato
13) 14 Honoka Hashimoto
14) 15 Hina Hayata
15) 16 Jeon Jihee
16) 20 Li Jie
17) 21 Miyu Kato
18) 19 Doo Hoi Kem
19) 17 Shan Xiaona
20) 27 Suh Hyowon
21) 32 Chen Szu-Yu
22) 22 Gu Yuting
23) 23 Kim Song I
24) 24 Sakura Mori
25) 25 Zeng Jian
26) 26 Elizabeta Samara
27) 42 Lee Ho Ching
28) 29 Yui Hamamoto
29) 32 Georgina Pota
30) 38 Saki Shibata
31) 28 Melek Hu
32) 30 Haeun Yang
33) 36 Chen Xingtong
34) 35 Liu Jia
35) 31 Petrissa Solja
36) 34 Fu Yu
37) 40 Mengyu Yu
37) 43 Li Qian
39) 37 Sofia Polcanova
40) 44 Matilda Ekholm


You can view the full World Rankings here. (http://ittfstats.alfaweb.gr/index.php?option=com_fabrik&view=list&listid=69&Itemid=206)

What does everyone think about the ranking system? The new system will come in place soon... Will this encourage players to remain more active on the circuit?

Garrison
11-01-2017, 03:23 PM
Ovtcharov lacks big results againt chinese top players before he can legitimate call himself #3 in the world. I expect a lot from him at german open in 10 days

massa
11-01-2017, 03:29 PM
wow, no xu xin

sanavasaraja
11-01-2017, 03:36 PM
Thanks so much for keeping me/us informed!
My Koki Niwa fanboyism is liking this.. don't even try to reason with me. :cool:


A little typo @ #9 Lenta Matsudaira :)

Đào Tùng
11-01-2017, 03:41 PM
So, if the one who has been taken out of the list, do they still have same ranking points of the last ranking list?

Tinykin
11-01-2017, 03:48 PM
Ovtcharov lacks big results againt chinese top players before he can legitimate call himself #3 in the world. I expect a lot from him at german open in 10 days

Rubbish.
He is ranked number 3 according to the criteria used by the ITTF. If we follow your line of argument, we can argue over the ranking of any player in any league.

Suga D
11-01-2017, 04:03 PM
Rubbish.
He is ranked number 3 according to the criteria used by the ITTF. If we follow your line of argument, we can argue over the ranking of any player in any league.

I´m pretty sure this wasn´t meant literally. I think Garrison was basically saying that he was hoping for good results of Dima next weekend and a victory over one of the top chinese would "legitimate" his new ranking... of course i could be wrong too

Tinykin
11-01-2017, 04:10 PM
And what I am saying is that his ranking is legitimate. He has met all the criteria.
We all know that the if all the Chinese CNT players could play internationally, the rankings would look very different.
But this BS is said every time a non-Chinese player achieves a high ranking. You should see the absolute racist comments that flowed when Timo Boll was number one.
I'm just tired of the BS sometimes.

rainneverever
11-01-2017, 04:29 PM
The current issue of World Ranking is based on old rules. The hidden rank due to no activity within 4 month is also old rules.
Here is the test of New ranking system. Under new ranking rules, Dima is ranked #2 in November.
http://teststats.alfaweb.gr/index.php?option=com_fabrik&view=list&listid=80&Itemid=237

14541

Vector Operator
11-01-2017, 04:39 PM
This new system hurts talent rich countries. ie. China, Japan, Korea.

passifid
11-01-2017, 05:15 PM
This new system hurts talent rich countries. ie. China, Japan, Korea.
only if they perform poorly, it should be better now for them as it is incentive to send the newer players to 'less important' tournaments where before there was no benefit to going there. Also as now the ranking list will take you out after 12 months of inactivity rather than 3 you can afford to send a higher number of players to international tournaments who are in your B list to competitions. its worse for the top 3 but better for a lot more especially for countries who cannot always send players to lots of competitions.

thomas2901
11-01-2017, 05:27 PM
Why there is no xu xin and jike anymore?

rainneverever
11-01-2017, 05:38 PM
@zoomtt wrote a great article comparing the current and new ranking system. According to his analyses, the current ranking system is able to predict 76% of the match results correctly while the new ranking system 67% (just meet the criteria of a generic ranking system). The only problem is that the article was written in March and ITTF changed the ranking points table in Oct and made it worse.
https://zoomtt.com/2017/03/31/new-wr-big-changes-bigger-challenges/

Under new ranking system, all the ranking points are good for 1 year except for WTTC and WTTC team events. However, there is no real distinction between good results and not so good results. For example, a winner in ITTF World Tour Platinum is 2250 points and a R32 is 1125 points; which means if one plays only one World Tour Platinum within a year and wins the champion, the rankings points are the the same as a player who plays two World Tour Platinum but loses in R32 twice. Of course, a pro player will not only play 1 or 2 tournament each year and the new ranking system counts the best 8 results within a year. But it is still possible that a player does not play too many tournaments (due to schedule/funding/injuries, whatever), and if he/she did not have 8 results within a year, he/she will be ranked much lower.
If you take a look at women's ranking in new system, Ding Ning is ranked #19 because she has not played 8 tournaments within a year. At the beginning of next year her rank won't be high and it is very likely that she won't be a seed or even have to play qualification...

rainneverever
11-01-2017, 05:40 PM
Why there is no xu xin and jike anymore?
In the current system, if the player is inactive for 4 months, the rank will be folded. That does not hurt seeding. And the rank will be re-activated once the player attend a tournament. XX, ZJK will play German Open this month therefore their ranks will show up next month.
BTW, this is no news at all. At the beginning of the year, ZJK, LSW's rank were both folded because of lack of activity for 4 months.

NextLevel
11-01-2017, 06:05 PM
@zoomtt wrote a great article comparing the current and new ranking system. According to his analyses, the current ranking system is able to predict 76% of the match results correctly while the new ranking system 67% (just meet the criteria of a generic ranking system). The only problem is that the article was written in March and ITTF changed the ranking points table in Oct and made it worse.
https://zoomtt.com/2017/03/31/new-wr-big-changes-bigger-challenges/

Under new ranking system, all the ranking points are good for 1 year except for WTTC and WTTC team events. However, there is no real distinction between good results and not so good results. For example, a winner in ITTF World Tour Platinum is 2250 points and a R32 is 1125 points; which means if one plays only one World Tour Platinum within a year and wins the champion, the rankings points are the the same as a player who plays two World Tour Platinum but loses in R32 twice. Of course, a pro player will not only play 1 or 2 tournament each year and the new ranking system counts the best 8 results within a year. But it is still possible that a player does not play too many tournaments (due to schedule/funding/injuries, whatever), and if he/she did not have 8 results within a year, he/she will be ranked much lower.
If you take a look at women's ranking in new system, Ding Ning is ranked #19 because she has not played 8 tournaments within a year. At the beginning of next year her rank won't be high and it is very likely that she won't be a seed or even have to play qualification...

It is clear that they are rewarding tour participation over performance. It seems a bit too much right now. Hopefully they will adjust the formula better over time.

T!Joachim
11-01-2017, 07:24 PM
What does everyone think about the new ranking system? Is it better? Will this encourage players to remain more active on the circuit?

This is not the "new World Ranking system". It is the one which was used for several years now. All players that have been inactive for more than 4 months are greyed out and do not appear on the list. However their WR-points are frozen, and as soon as they play again they are back where they were.

However the System will change with 1 January 2018 and bring more dynamic into the ranking. The exact rules are already written down and confirmed and the ITTF will published them very soon.

Cadoce
11-01-2017, 07:38 PM
The rule of 4 months is clear but the question is why ZJK and XX were inactive for the last 4 months ? Injuries or perhaps consequences of the rebellion ? And LGL is nowhere to be seen, as well as other best known coaches. Is anybody able to enlighten us as to what is really happening ? And what is the current organisation of Chinese TT ?

TableTennisDaily
11-01-2017, 08:21 PM
This is not the "new World Ranking system". It is the one which was used for several years now. All players that have been inactive for more than 4 months are greyed out and do not appear on the list. However their WR-points are frozen, and as soon as they play again they are back where they were.

However the System will change with 1 January 2018 and bring more dynamic into the ranking. The exact rules are already written down and confirmed and the ITTF will published them very soon.

Hi Joachim, you're right, we had a slight misunderstanding. Thanks for letting us know, the new ranking system will be very interesting. Will keep an eye out of the updates :)

MaLongFamily Fans Club
11-03-2017, 08:31 AM
Ma Long is ranked No.1 once again in Nov Issue of ITTF World Rankings. Being No.1 for 63 months in total and 33 months in a row - the record seems unbreakable by anyone but Ma Long himself.
The current World Ranking points consists two parts, rating points which reflects the opponents against whom a player have played and bonus points/penalty points which indicates the positions that a player has reached in tournaments within a year. For example, Ma Long's current 3323 ranking points are made of 3036 rating points, 312 bonus points for tournaments he attended within a year and 25 penalty points for China Open withdrawal. Depending on the difference in rating points between him and his opponents, Ma Long gained very little even none rating points winning over most players and lost huge rating points upon defeat. For example, in 2017 World Cup, Ma Long gained 2 rating points after beating Omar Assar, Koki Niwa and Simon Gauzy, respectively while lost 32 rating points after losing to Timo Boll. You can tell how difficult it is for Ma Long to keep such high rating points (3036), even higher than the total points of the current No.3 Dimitrij Ovtcharov (3011 ranking points =2676 rating points + 335 bonus points).
However, Ma Long will no longer be ranked No.1 next Jan when a new ITTF ranking system will be in effect. The new ranking system adds up the best 8 results within a year (World Championships events within 2 years). Ma Long will have only 7 valid results next Jan and very likely drop out of top 5 in ITTF World Rankings (he has been within top 5 since Dec 2007).
https://scontent.fftw1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/22894350_756632097794701_3500856194370278191_n.png?oh=c4913fc64933d46b46b522a447d8ba5e&oe=5AAC23CD

Sali
11-03-2017, 10:57 AM
And what I am saying is that his ranking is legitimate. He has met all the criteria.
We all know that the if all the Chinese CNT players could play internationally, the rankings would look very different.
But this BS is said every time a non-Chinese player achieves a high ranking. You should see the absolute racist comments that flowed when Timo Boll was number one.
I'm just tired of the BS sometimes.
I just think that some people treat ranking as unfair, of course Dima was a bit lucky after Timo took down to great chinese and was too tired to face Dima in the final. So someone could say that Dima had better half. In my opinion each sport has the same problem, we cannot organize event that every player meets every other to see who is the best. There will be always some lineup when someone say it is unfair - but this is the sport and we cannot meet everybody expectations.
I really do not like complicated ranking system, when you get some bonus points and then minus points. It is very enough to cancel all points by the end of march and you just gain the points by playing tournaments. I understand that china and japan have at leat 10 great players but nobody forbid them to send all players to world tour. Probably this is just the case of money why the do not send all guns.

TTHopeful
11-03-2017, 11:08 AM
A joke Ma Long won't be World Number 1 on new ranking.

yoass
11-03-2017, 03:30 PM
[…] we cannot organize event that every player meets every other to see who is the best.

Even if we could do that, it would still not be fair. But I guess that's your point, and I subscribe to it. There's an element of randomness, unavoidably, with the tournament schemes tourning out lucky — or not. Anybody that's ever known the true meaning of having an ‘angst gegner’ will testify to the luck of that feared opponent being taken out in another branch of the scheme — or the misery of meeting that opponent in the qualification rounds.

Tony's Table Tennis
11-03-2017, 03:40 PM
If world ranking can't justify "ranking", but justify participation
then it should be called world participation ranking
not world ranking

Waiting for seeding list to be a problem next year
imo, this is not good for the sport

rainneverever
11-03-2017, 03:53 PM
I think zoomtt's article has very good points. A generic ranking system shall predict the match results correctly (higher-ranked player wins over lower-ranked player) more than 2/3 of the time. The current ITTF ranking system is better than the new ranking system announced in March. The new ranking system announced in March meets the criteria marginally and we do not have statistical test yet about the new ranking system modified in October.
For tennis ATP rankings, runner-up gets 0.6 times of the points of winner; semifinalist gets 0.6 times of the points of runner-up. In ITTF new ranking system, runner-up gets 0.9 times of the points of winner; semifinalist gets 0.9 times of the points of runner-up. Participation is more important than to win the champion.

NextLevel
11-03-2017, 04:06 PM
They will fix it to find a better balance like the ATP. They can't skew towards participation so much that it makes ranking meaningless. ELO systems on the other hand can be maintained by anyone. Ratings central is still there for everyone else.

TT Guru
11-04-2017, 04:39 PM
Ma Long is ranked No.1 once again in Nov Issue of ITTF World Rankings. Being No.1 for 63 months in total and 33 months in a row - the record seems unbreakable by anyone but Ma Long himself.
The current World Ranking points consists two parts, rating points which reflects the opponents against whom a player have played and bonus points/penalty points which indicates the positions that a player has reached in tournaments within a year. For example, Ma Long's current 3323 ranking points are made of 3036 rating points, 312 bonus points for tournaments he attended within a year and 25 penalty points for China Open withdrawal. Depending on the difference in rating points between him and his opponents, Ma Long gained very little even none rating points winning over most players and lost huge rating points upon defeat. For example, in 2017 World Cup, Ma Long gained 2 rating points after beating Omar Assar, Koki Niwa and Simon Gauzy, respectively while lost 32 rating points after losing to Timo Boll. You can tell how difficult it is for Ma Long to keep such high rating points (3036), even higher than the total points of the current No.3 Dimitrij Ovtcharov (3011 ranking points =2676 rating points + 335 bonus points).
However, Ma Long will no longer be ranked No.1 next Jan when a new ITTF ranking system will be in effect. The new ranking system adds up the best 8 results within a year (World Championships events within 2 years). Ma Long will have only 7 valid results next Jan and very likely drop out of top 5 in ITTF World Rankings (he has been within top 5 since Dec 2007).



This is a great summary, thanks. It's great to see the new system is easy to understand for all audiences. There should be plenty of discussion about this coming up in the coming days and weeks. You're quite right, Ma Long won't be no.1 in January.