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View Full Version : What's going on here? Doubles match



ILoveTT
11-30-2018, 06:27 PM
Table Tennis England did a post on their facebook this morning "What's going on here? Portugal serve for SIX points in a row against England in the Cadet team event at the Portugal Youth Open! Has anything like this ever happened to you in the 11-up era?"


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCUdJ4EeFSw

zeio
11-30-2018, 10:05 PM
The kid with the 84 tag is genius. He has it in him to be a great hypnotist.

The English pair served first in the game at 0:0. The error wasn't discovered until two points later, which should've been the English pair's turn to serve. According to the rule, if I'm not mistaken, the game should resume with the Portuguese pair serving since that would've been their turn, therefore serving 6 in a row?


2.14 OUT OF ORDER OF SERVING, RECEIVING OR ENDS
2.14.1 If a player serves or receives out of turn, play shall be interrupted by the
umpire as soon as the error is discovered and shall resume with those players
serving and receiving who should be server and receiver respectively at the
score that has been reached, according to the sequence established at the
beginning of the match and, in doubles, to the order of serving chosen by the
pair having the right to serve first in the game during which the error is
discovered.
2.14.2 If the players have not changed ends when they should have done so, play
shall be interrupted by the umpire as soon as the error is discovered and shall
resume with the players at the ends at which they should be at the score that
has been reached, according to the sequence established at the beginning of
the match.
2.14.3 In any circumstances, all points scored before the discovery of an error shall
be reckoned.

bircham boi
12-01-2018, 12:37 AM
Classic failure of umpire to keep track of service rotation. You can see the English team get talked out of it by the Portuguese righty, even though at the end of the first two serves the umpire indicates England to serve next. After four consecutive serves, the English players make a fuss, but the umpire is quite correct insisting Portugal serve yet again. But England should complain about the umpire after the match.

yogi_bear
12-01-2018, 02:39 AM
Yup umpire's fault. It is a common mistake to lose track of the order of serving in tt. I usually write down the receiver and server per game.

FruitLoop
12-01-2018, 04:54 PM
Completely umpires fault. He directed the English to serve. Then the Portuguese argued and he just let them serve...

jafdfm
12-01-2018, 08:17 PM
Yup umpire's fault. It is a common mistake to lose track of the order of serving in tt. I usually write down the receiver and server per game.

Why is it the umpire's fault? Didn't you see the umpire point twice to the serving side?
It´s easier to blame the umpire, but he pointed to the correct side TWICE and was the first to see the mistake, in that point the ITTF rules say the order must be corrected, so made the correct call.
The players made the mistake and mess the serve order.

yogi_bear
12-01-2018, 08:34 PM
Yes it is still his fault because why in the hell the match continued with the wrong order?!! If you are an umpire your responsibility is not just calling in rules, you need to enforce them!

yogi_bear
12-01-2018, 08:40 PM
You also did not see situation enough and my arguement. The umpire only discovered it after more than 3 serves which of course error in service order was already done! Hence it is the umpire' s fault! Although it is the player's responsibility to also keep track of his score and sevice order, overall in a match the umpire' s responsibility is to have a smooth and correct continuity of the game. In this case which you have not gotten the point was the umpire's lapse!

jafdfm
12-01-2018, 11:19 PM
Yeah, the umpire is always the weakest link and the easier to blame. Always umpire's fault...

ttmonster
12-01-2018, 11:35 PM
This is funny as hell .. I don't think there is a rational explanation ... I think the umpire has a lot of teenage grandkids at home and knows very well gentle persuasion is better than argument ... its better to leave them to learn on their own .. kind of philosophy ... "hey I am telling you what you are doing is wrong , and I am going to keep reminding you, till one of you decides to listen... but I am not going to get into a fight with you kids till you know better " ... ROFLAO !!!

bircham boi
12-02-2018, 12:02 AM
Yeah, the umpire is always the weakest link and the easier to blame. Always umpire's fault...
Not sure why you would want to blame the kids for what is an umpiring mistake. It is not the responsibility of the players to control the game. It is not the responsibility of the players to determine who serves and when. It is not the responsibility of the players to do anything much other than hit the ball.

FruitLoop
12-02-2018, 12:06 AM
Yeah, the umpire is always the weakest link and the easier to blame. Always umpire's fault...

But it clearly is his fault. Your Portuguese with 2 posts, maybe he's your relative. He let Portugal serve in the wrong order even though he KNEW it was wrong. Then only fixed it after they had two serves. LOL! Senility or corrupt who knows but it was his fault.

yogi_bear
12-02-2018, 12:10 AM
I am assuming he has not undergone any basic umpire's course because of his arguement. It is taught as basics to would be umpires, in my case taught by an I.U., to always have the responsibility and accountability to have a smooth flowing game and make the right calls. Right calls, not just the quality of your calls but also the timing. Timing in this case is delayed and not enforced fully right away.

jafdfm
12-02-2018, 12:16 AM
But it clearly is his fault. Your Portuguese with 2 posts, maybe he's your relative. He let Portugal serve in the wrong order even though he KNEW it was wrong. Then only fixed it after they had two serves. LOL! Senility or corrupt who knows but it was his fault.

Wrong and wrong.


I am assuming he has not undergone any basic umpire's course because of his arguement. It is taught as basics to would be umpires, in my case taught by an I.U., to always have the responsibility and accountability to have a smooth flowing game and make the right calls. Right calls, not just the quality of your calls but also the timing. Timing in this case is delayed and not enforced fully right away.

Well, you are wrong in your assumption. It's because i am an umpire that i know the umpire did the correct call at 7-7 ;)
I will assume you are a trained umpire. If you are you know how easy can a wrong order in doubles matches to happen, expecially with 10 year-old kids. But as i said before, it's easier to blame the umpire and make a scene out of it when i saw this happening even in OLYMPICS, the diference was that the umpire did not have the balls this guy showed to do the right call and continue in the correct order.

yogi_bear
12-02-2018, 12:25 AM
I was not saying he made the wrong call, i am saying he FAILED TO ENFORCE his call which resulted to having more than 2 serves!! Please do not put words in my mouth! If you are an umpire then you need to go back to training because you clearly do not understand the impact of not enforcing your calls on time!

yogi_bear
12-02-2018, 12:26 AM
Yes I am a trained umpire aside from being an ITTF Coaching Course Conductor. Even it happens in the Olympics or World Championships does not mean it is not the umpire's fault because it is!!

jafdfm
12-02-2018, 12:27 AM
I was not saying he made the wrong call, i am saying he FAILED TO ENFORCE his call which resulted to having more than 2 serves!! Please do not put words in my mouth! If you are an umpire then you need to go back to training because you clearly do not understand the impact of not enforcing your calls on time!

Ok Master ;)