Double Fish Quji High Bounce

says toooooo much choice!!
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Thought I’d try out a different Chinese Tacky Rubber (CTR), and decided on Double Fish Quji High Bounce.
This is a tacky rubber, which is is marketed as having patented technology “Osmose Inverse”
This tech is supposed to maintain the stickiness / tackiness of the top sheet, replenishing the tackiness from within the top sheet!!!!

Packaging was good, outer was standard fair, sheet was vacuum sealed, once this was removed the top sheet had a thin plastic protective sheet as well, similar to those found on DHS rubbers.
Once removed from the vacuum pack there was a fairly strong aroma given off and both sheets curled up on 2 opposite sides, (in the vacuum pack the sheets laid flat). This suggests that there has been some form of factory tuning, although it could be a characteristic of the Osmose Inverse technology???

sponge is blue, dense small pores, hardness - 37 to 39 degrees, 2.1mm.
Top sheet feels reasonably tacky. Tackiness test - ball was held for a couple of seconds or so.
Bounce test - 3 bounces then held on top sheet.
Definitely not ‘high bounce’ !!!
Glued onto a Primorac all wood clone. No boosting.
This rubber unboosted, is one of the hardest feeling and dead CTR’s that I have tried!!! (Compared to DHS 8-80, Tau2 and std H3 etc)
The marketing blurb mentioning ‘high bounce’ seems somewhat misleading!!! this leads me to think that the aroma on opening the vacuum pack is related to the Osmose Inverse tech, rather than boosting to soften up and speed up the sponge. ????

This is a brief ‘1st impressions’ review.
I used the set up for a couple of games and for some serve practice. Rubber was mounted on BH & FH.
This rubber was quite spin sensitive compared to H8-80/Tau2 and required a lot of adjustment.
During the games much more effort was required to get the ball moving!! Generally a slow rubber.
Once enough effort was put in, loops were pretty good, good spin, nice forward kick, low throw.
Good spin when serving.
Pushing and short game was good, controlling incoming spin was an issue to start with, especially side spin, I needed to adjust bat angles more than usual in order to keep the ball in play. Of course the control is down to me not the rubber!!
Blocking was fine.

Personally I think this rubber is crying out for some boosting, to soften up the sponge and feel !!!!!
If you are playing with un-boosted hard dead CTR’s then I still think this rubber will feel harder!! It reminds me of a sheet of un-boosted H3 Nat 40 degree blue sponge I tried a couple of years ago!! Just a little harder feeling!!!!

Anyway the rubbers will be removed, cleaned and boosted over the weekend, not sure if this will work well considering there has been some sort of tuning going on at the factory. I’ll try Falco long term on one sheet and Haifu on the other.

Even though I didn’t really like the feel of this rubber it definitely has potential. I think that if used solely for a couple of months plus, it could really perform well.
Boosting isn’t really my thing, generally can’t be bothered with the process, but it would be unfair not to try boosting this rubber!! If the boosting works well, then I think this rubber could be a bit of a ‘dark horse’ and possibly a good alternative to the H3’s.
 
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Which version did you get? I think there are three: black, red, and blue packaging. And (from what I can tell) the difference is sponge hardness and not pip geometry but I could be wrong.
 
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RUBBER MAKER ANSWERS YOUR QUESTIONS

Rubber Maker


-- People, take it from me. The allegedly existing "OSMOSE" is a pure fib. Aromatic nitro-amines did all the job.

A) DF is now using some smelly additives to the top sheet, following the Dr. Fisher's patented formula from 1934.. It is known as "admixing nitro-amines into raw rubber paste", and those liquid chemicals do produce pronounced smell of rotten fish. No "osmose"is involved in manufacturing this rubber.
 
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says toooooo much choice!!
says toooooo much choice!!
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Read 11 reviews

p

RUBBER MAKER ANSWERS YOUR QUESTIONS

Rubber Maker



A) DF is now using some smelly additives to the top sheet, following the Dr. Fisher's patented formula from 1934.. It is known as "admixing nitro-amines into raw rubber paste", and those liquid chemicals do produce pronounced smell of rotten fish. No "osmose"is involved in manufacturing this rubber.
Probably right about the admix being in the rubber because the sheets had curled in the opposite way to when booster is applied, ie with booster sponge domes upwards, out of the pack these sheets curled rubber upwards.
After 1st coat of booster the rubbers are now laying flat. No curled edges.

 
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Damn, I almost opened a new thread because of the typo in the name. It should be Qiji, not Quji.

I have tried this rubber too, but not the one shown previously as that I think it the one called "power", I got the "spin" version. I mainly wanted to try it on my backhand.
I think the topsheet is the same between them, the sponge is the only difference. It's not as hard as the power mentioned before. Certainly not as hard or dead as a H3, or H8-80, maybe among the lines as H3-50 37deg, but the sponge feels more lively and transparent.

I'm not going to say that it's a D09c replacement, because it's different, but it's an alternative. Tack is similar, the sponge is softer and more transparent, and just bouncing the ball it's slower. But if you start using it in game it hits down on the blade sooner and it might be faster this way. It has lower arc than D09c but is seems to be more vicious.

I mainly tried it on my backhand and when getting weak and slow balls I wished it was faster, but it's not like a H3 Neo or H8-80... It's faster than those, but you need to use good power. Coming from a D64 on BH of course it feels slow...
I really like D64 on BH but I have this weird feeling how the topsheet is not moving in sync with the sponge on weak shots which makes control a bit wonky. Sometimes it catapults a lot sometimes it's acting normally. In the heat of the moment it can make me do some easy misses which doesn't inspire much confidence.
The Qiji doesn't have this issue as the topsheet is not acting wonky, I think it works very well together with the sponge. Like other Chinese rubbers you need to adjust since it's easy to block the ball in the net if you don't block actively.
What's really good about it is that you can just hit confidently with it, it's a stable rubber. In fact it encourages you to use more power. I like that aspect of it.

I'm actually considering to try it on my FH a bit more as it felt really good there and D09c is good on BH too, it has that additional bounce that the Qiji doesn't.

Can't comment on durability, if it doesn't bubble up then I think it should be fine. These tacky topsheets last a long time, especially Chinese ones.

I wish it was lighter... Cut it's 52.5g on my Nexy Eucrasia, on a Viscaria I guess it would be around 51g. For a FH rubber that's ok, but for BH... and especially using on both sides... You need to like a head heavy blade or you need to balance it out somehow.

It has some sweet smell but I don't think it's booster. It almost smells like nail polish?? But this smell doesn't disappear in a day, it remains while nail polish should evaporate very quickly. I don't think it needs any boosting either.
It's funny because it came in a vacuum sealed package, kinda like H3 Neo, but I guess it's just to protect it from oxidation?

The price is not that cheap erither, it's around 25USD on aliexpress, which certainly isn't too bad, but I don't think Double Fish has enough presence outside of China to make this price justifiable even though it seems to be a bargain if I look at the quality of the product.

Speaking of quality, Double Fish, wtf?? Please calibrate your cutting machine especially for the bottom side of the rubber, which is the only side that matters!!! It was cut like it was done by some poor human who got a blunt scissor as a prank or by some uncalibrated machine with a blunt scissor or knife.

TLDR: The spin version is a good rubber, I recommend it. Especially good if you want a D09c alternative with a bit softer and more transparent sponge. Bit heavy...
 
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says toooooo much choice!!
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Damn, I almost opened a new thread because of the typo in the name. It should be Qiji, not Quji.

I have tried this rubber too, but not the one shown previously as that I think it the one called "power", I got the "spin" version. I mainly wanted to try it on my backhand.
I think the topsheet is the same between them, the sponge is the only difference. It's not as hard as the power mentioned before. Certainly not as hard or dead as a H3, or H8-80, maybe among the lines as H3-50 37deg, but the sponge feels more lively and transparent.

I'm not going to say that it's a D09c replacement, because it's different, but it's an alternative. Tack is similar, the sponge is softer and more transparent, and just bouncing the ball it's slower. But if you start using it in game it hits down on the blade sooner and it might be faster this way. It has lower arc than D09c but is seems to be more vicious.

I mainly tried it on my backhand and when getting weak and slow balls I wished it was faster, but it's not like a H3 Neo or H8-80... It's faster than those, but you need to use good power. Coming from a D64 on BH of course it feels slow...
I really like D64 on BH but I have this weird feeling how the topsheet is not moving in sync with the sponge on weak shots which makes control a bit wonky. Sometimes it catapults a lot sometimes it's acting normally. In the heat of the moment it can make me do some easy misses which doesn't inspire much confidence.
The Qiji doesn't have this issue as the topsheet is not acting wonky, I think it works very well together with the sponge. Like other Chinese rubbers you need to adjust since it's easy to block the ball in the net if you don't block actively.
What's really good about it is that you can just hit confidently with it, it's a stable rubber. In fact it encourages you to use more power. I like that aspect of it.

I'm actually considering to try it on my FH a bit more as it felt really good there and D09c is good on BH too, it has that additional bounce that the Qiji doesn't.

Can't comment on durability, if it doesn't bubble up then I think it should be fine. These tacky topsheets last a long time, especially Chinese ones.

I wish it was lighter... Cut it's 52.5g on my Nexy Eucrasia, on a Viscaria I guess it would be around 51g. For a FH rubber that's ok, but for BH... and especially using on both sides... You need to like a head heavy blade or you need to balance it out somehow.

It has some sweet smell but I don't think it's booster. It almost smells like nail polish?? But this smell doesn't disappear in a day, it remains while nail polish should evaporate very quickly. I don't think it needs any boosting either.
It's funny because it came in a vacuum sealed package, kinda like H3 Neo, but I guess it's just to protect it from oxidation?

The price is not that cheap erither, it's around 25USD on aliexpress, which certainly isn't too bad, but I don't think Double Fish has enough presence outside of China to make this price justifiable even though it seems to be a bargain if I look at the quality of the product.

Speaking of quality, Double Fish, wtf?? Please calibrate your cutting machine especially for the bottom side of the rubber, which is the only side that matters!!! It was cut like it was done by some poor human who got a blunt scissor as a prank or by some uncalibrated machine with a blunt scissor or knife.

TLDR: The spin version is a good rubber, I recommend it. Especially good if you want a D09c alternative with a bit softer and more transparent sponge. Bit heavy...

Hi,

Any photos of the packaging? Sponge hardness?

Seems to be a completely different kettle of fish to the version I tried!!

 
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Hi,

Any photos of the packaging? Sponge hardness?

Seems to be a completely different kettle of fish to the version I tried!!

So this is the cardboard box. It's got the dark crimson color, you had the blueish one.
Sponge hardness is 37-39deg. There's a diagram in the back of the intended "attribute" of these rubbers, and it's different from the power version of course. I wouldn't give it much thought tho.



I didn't say before but the spin is really good, comparable with D09c, and full power swings feel great, even on BH. Full power swings on BH feel lightyears better and safer than D64.
FH needs more testing, but because it's slower and has lower arc than D09c I expect it to be able to create somewhat higher spin on slow open ups. But for me the most interesting is loop killing, if it can do it well then this rubber is different gravy than most.

 
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So after trying it on the FH it is great close to the table. It's better than d09c from close. Touch, loop killing, blocking maybe even countering from on top of the table is better but from mid and far distance it doesn't have the arc or speed of d09c. It's really stable, in fact I would say it's like a Yasaka Rising Dragon with a more bounce and a tackier topsheet. Doesn't hold the ball as much or have the stretchy topsheet of D09c but if you hit trough the sponge down to the blade it feels fantastic.

Gonna keep it on BH as it works well. It can flick great, I can do the nasty receives that tacky Chinese rubbers allow and if I bock actively and hit trough the sponge it's kinda disregarding the incoming spin. It's making that metallic clicking sound that many Chinese rubbers make.
If I don't hit trough the sponge it can actually have quite a bit of catapult effect and high throw. If I hit trough I can keep the ball low close to the net during blocking too and countering on top of the bounce is quite possible, certainly easier than with most rubbers. (I was literally experimenting how close I can block to the net and I was probably smiling behind my mask it was so effortless)

Opening loops on BH work as well, I can either try hard loopkill, (it works on BH too) or do a slow spinny open up. Looping continuously from the back is not something you wanna do with it but like honestly who does that with backhand anyway and how often during a match? Maybe a point in a match...? And if someone gives the ball the spin and speed it doesn't feel that slow anymore it's just hard to generate much speed with it from blocked balls from the back.
I'm a lefty so I welcome rubbers which I can control forehand loops and drives well. This one does.

Spinny BH open to FH pivot is good with it, I used to like H3N for this as people hate the spin:speed ratio it creates, this one feels a bit similar. Because of the lower speed it makes if you spin the ball when it's already falling I have more time to pivot. And it is a bit unnatural like H3 and the opponent feels uncomfortable.
If you catch the ball on top of the bounce then it's not slow, in fact quite fast...

 
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So today I had the "spring" seasons first championship match. While my teammates advised against using the Qiji as I only had like 4-5 hours of play in it on my BH and I admit I don't have an "intimate" relationship whit it yet, but it was working really well for me. In fact it felt really freaking stable. There was a dude that was doing the no spin fast pushes on my BH, and if you ever received those ball then you know they like to go to the net. From the Qiji they didn't net not a single time. While I myself felt these balls feel sketchy AF and I don't have much confidence returning them well, the rubber just performed and returned everything and since I got these from top of the bounce returned them well with speed and placement. Open loops felt also good, some got countered on top of the table but most of them were point winning shots as I could use placement and spin variety too. On BH the rubber has quite a bit of an arc, I can't explain but it makes a more pronounced arc than on FH.

What I struggled against is there was a lefty player with a better BH than FH, and he was hitting some more spinny shots one my BH that I recognized. And as I said before if I blocked like a pussy there is a catapult effect or an arc making force that sometimes have made the ball go long. I would say it's a kind of catapult effect since I felt it coming from the sponge + topsheet together. I don't fully have the confidence to hit these half strong but rather spinny balls down to the blade. By the end of the match I did but still I didn't have the full confidence.
Against FH I didn't face this issue at all, the spin:speed ratio is totally different.

So as I said I use this on my Nexy Eucrasia blade which is 84g, so with a D09c @ 49g and the Qiji @ 52.5g + glue @ ~2g, it would be around ~187g with a lot of head heaviness. To balance this head heaviness I used one of those Yinhe shrink grips that you can get from Aliexpress, and it added another 4-5 g. So now I am at 192g which for me would sound like a lot since with D64 and D09c I was on 179g. But heavier it feels more stable and faster. This extra weight made my racket faster by default. It helps D09c even since all my shots have the metallic click on D09c too now and I haven't touched that rubber at all. It has the same glue and everything as before but still changed its play characteristics somewhat.

D09c I considered to be an endgame FH rubber, it has no weakness, or I fail to recognize it. The Double Fish Qiji has some weaknesses but damn it's an impressive rubber from China from an old school manufacturer. Maybe sometimes you only need is a university graduate out of a billion people in the right place that can cook up a fantastic rubber. I think Double Fish caught lightning in a bottle. It's like one of those fair priced headphones that you sometimes find from a Chinese vendor for not much money that just sounds like a 1000$ headset.

Also many people complain about D09c not being tacky enough, I beg to disagree. It is probably the perfect tackiness. Too much tackiness feels like it hinders rotation, like sticks rotation too if that makes sense. Not to mention it sticks speed.
Double Fish Qiji has the same amount of tackiness as D09c and it is enough to feel tacky, enough to have more control, enough to not hinder rotation nor speed. Most of all enough to not slip a well used shiny ball!!!!!!!!! Have you ever encountered with a non sticky rubber slipping a used shiny ball. Not here!
 
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I tried it on my Ice Cream AZX on the ZLC side. I have to say it's funny that on the Eucrasia it felt that the rubber is not so fast on BH, more stable not so rapid, but on an outer blade it feels quite fast indeed. It still has the transparancy, stable as hell, maybe feels softer too? On the Eucrasia I felt the ball is held more, and I thought it is the rubber, but I guess I was wrong. It must come how well the ball can hit down on the blade and the Eucrasia holds much more than the AZX. And it's not like the Eucrasia is slow, it's about Viscaria speed with around 1420hz.
Blades can change the rubber properties quite a bit, very funny indeed.

That being said I played in a different club, smaller hall (so faster) and instead of the usual Joola Flash ball, they use Sanwei ABS. Now what is interesting about that ball is that it is faster than the Joola, but also has less spin, at least before with D09c this is what I felt, that D09c doesn't spin it much.
Now if anyone has tried those balls might know that they last for long, so they can become shiny from 10-20+ hours of use. On D09c it almost felt that it slips. The Qiji didn't feel that way and also the H8-80 spinned it very well too. Not sure what to take away from this but tomorrow I will play with Joola Flash balls, and the DF Qiji was working well with that too.
 
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