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SURF
02-14-2022, 09:00 PM
How to make footwork easy for everyone. Now you will see it everywhere :)
https://www.youtube.com/embed/9NAi8NVOUgc?autohide=1&controls=1&showinfo=0

UpSideDownCarl
02-15-2022, 12:55 AM
How to make footwork easy for everyone. Now you will see it everywhere :)

www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NAi8NVOUgc
I figured I would embed the video so people could just click and watch your video from this page.
https://www.youtube.com/embed/9NAi8NVOUgc?autohide=1&controls=1&showinfo=0

SURF
02-15-2022, 05:34 AM
Thank you Carl.
I was trying to do this, but the player did not show for some reason this time.
What is proper way to embed it?

NDH
02-15-2022, 08:08 AM
How to make footwork easy for everyone. Now you will see it everywhere :)

www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NAi8NVOUgc
Hey SURF,

I watched the video in full.

I just want to start by reiterating something..... Regardless of my opinions on your analysis or methods, I really admire the time and effort you've put into the videos.

You clearly believe in this method, and I look forward to seeing where you go with it!

Some feedback from me.....

1. I appreciate it's early days, but I think you need to get into the main part of the video quicker. I only watched the whole thing so I could offer feedback. If I stumbled upon your video by accident, I would have switched off quite quickly.

2. I'm not really sure I got anything from that video at all. The importance of the split step seemed to be the overwhelming take away, but that isn't new?

3. I'm not sure if this is just a difference of opinion, skill level or something else, but I strongly disagree with the comments around the 7:00 mark.

Sam was forced to go back from the table and float a backspin shot to Ma Long. You comment that this was "almost game breaking answer" and that Sam "missed an opportunity" due to Ma Long having to play a safe loop.

Unless Sam hit that shot and then charged the table immediately (which just isn't going to happen, because he wouldn't have the time to see where his backspin shot was going to end up, and he probably thought Ma Long would need to play another firm attacking shot anyway), then I don't see how Sam had any opportunity at all.

Ma Long was in complete control of that point, and the only way you could ever say that Sam had a chance, is if you ignore the footage and over analyse the point (and this is what I fear your method may do).

On paper, it might read:

Long: Backhand attack (slow crosscourt) to Walkers backhand away from the table.
Walker: Backhand chop (short) to Ma Long Forehand
Long: Forehand slow loop - OPPORTUNITY Walker
Walker: Tame backhand - MISSED OPPORTUNITY

That is how your analysis of those shots came across, but in reality, I just don't think that opportunity was ever there (unless Walker could see into the future!)

Again, regardless of my opinion, I still want to commend you on the effort you've put into them, and you certainly shouldn't stop!

SURF
02-15-2022, 09:15 AM
to explain it,
regarding to part at 7:00, yes there might be several opinions and in reality there is definitely more to it. I was making conclusions with the reference to the approach presented.

The game breaking answer it would be if somehow Sam managed to get the second bounce of the ball even closer to the edge or on the table. It was not probable, but still, Ma's intention was clear when the ball reached peak of the bounce. At that point and even earlier Sam definitely had a time to see where the ball lands and what comes next.
I think problem might be, he misjudged rotation of the ball, so the length of second bounce was hard to predict for him.

I agree on that, it was not the opportunity to win the ball, but there was opportunity to act differently upon resulting bounce trajectory and on the trajectory of Ma Longs slow loop. We are analysing footwork. I might not be correct on everything in this analysis, it is theory after all. So there is room for discussion. Thanks for that.

If you look at Sams feet in the air when Ma prepares the shot, you can see that he basicaly performed small jump at the wrong time. Ma had very large range from the paddle to the ball at that point. So the timing there according to the theory is wrong. This paradoxically took time from Sam.
Situation is similar to Ma saving his backhand disbalance. Ma reached for the block, Sam reached for the fishing shot - if that make sense.
This is how I can see and how I interpret it.

Finally, yes I will try to do better job with start of the video. My intent was to focus viewers attention to specific details in the video and how it works together.
I am aware that automated voice does not help with it. But I am not able to narate it with my voice.
I am trying to improve with every video. As you mentioned, its early days for the channel. If I take into account history of the channel, its only one week from the 1st and 2nd lesson. So be patient.

I also did this example at the quick notice, because a lot of people wanted to see real life example of the approach presented.
so, lets get better together :)

NDH
02-15-2022, 09:24 AM
Yeah, I appreciate the effort that has gone into it, I really do.

Having watched all of the videos, and read your comments on here, I'm still not convinced this is going to be helpful to many people.

Perhaps the very top players (or more importantly, coaches), who can take advantage of these things - But I'd be amazed if anyone watching from home can really improve.

These are such tiny margins that you are analysing, with decisions needing to be made in fractions of seconds, that even professionals get it wrong.

So I'm not sure how anyone else can seriously improve.

That being said, I'll continue to watch each video you do, and I appreciate you made this one to show a real world example.

If you don't want my feedback at any point, feel free to say and I'll keep quiet.

I'm certainly not here to be negative about it, and I'm keen to see if you ever change my mind! 😁

SURF
02-15-2022, 10:03 AM
Yeah, I appreciate the effort that has gone into it, I really do.

Having watched all of the videos, and read your comments on here, I'm still not convinced this is going to be helpful to many people.

Perhaps the very top players (or more importantly, coaches), who can take advantage of these things - But I'd be amazed if anyone watching from home can really improve.

These are such tiny margins that you are analysing, with decisions needing to be made in fractions of seconds, that even professionals get it wrong.

So I'm not sure how anyone else can seriously improve.

That being said, I'll continue to watch each video you do, and I appreciate you made this one to show a real world example.

If you don't want my feedback at any point, feel free to say and I'll keep quiet.

I'm certainly not here to be negative about it, and I'm keen to see if you ever change my mind! 😁
I am quite happy for your inputs,
frankly your approach is the same as mine. I also question everything. But I am trying to find a solution for the problems we are facing with the training routines. I am also trying to disect chinese game and game in general to details, find patterns and prove that there is a way to transfer it to non-chinese players other way than by drilling shots, by visualization and thinking process. It is abicious, I know.

I am trying to show that there might be way to do things differently, if we shift focus and importance of training routines to trajectories and abilities to read them. To read the future as you ponted out :D

Innovation is mother of progress, right?

UpSideDownCarl
02-15-2022, 02:37 PM
I agree with the idea that it takes way way toooooo long to get into any content in the video. That combined with the robot voice made it hard for me to watch to the point where there was actual content. It takes over 2 min for you to get into any new information.

I definitely recommend you try to do the voice part yourself even if you have a thick accent and it is hard for you. Either that or find someone who can speak in English a little better. But the robot really makes me have the urge to turn the video off despite being interested in seeing if you have anything useful for TT players that you are offering. Maybe I am alone on that. But.......

And I agree with NDH about the fact that I am not trying to criticize. I just think there are things you could do to make people interested and want to watch your videos that will help both you and people who want to learn from what you are presenting.

I do teach something (not Table Tennis) so I do understand that even if you have great content, if how it is presented causes people to not engage and not be drawn in, the information you are offering will not be appreciated or understood because people won't pay attention to it.

Takkyu_ga_suki
02-15-2022, 03:15 PM
I definitely recommend you try to do the voice part yourself even if you have a thick accent and it is hard for you. Either that or find someone who can speak in English a little better. But the robot really makes me have the urge to turn the video off despite being interested in seeing if you have anything useful for TT players that you are offering. Maybe I am alone on that. But.......

You are not alone. I have watched 100's of TT videos with various accents. I have found none of them objectionable... except for the robot voices. I actually enjoy hearing the various accents.

SURF,

If you speak slowly and clearly it should not be a problem.

You should post a 20 second video with your voice narrating instead of that annoying robot voice and I'll bet most, if not all, posters here would prefer your voice. If not, it should be easy to find a human that can read a script. Gosh, even a parrot would sound better than that robot voice.

SURF
02-16-2022, 06:32 AM
Thank you guys for the feedback,

I added chapters to all videos now, so you can easily navigate to part of the video you are interested in and skip intro section easily.
I also find out that you can set custom speed for video. If you set speed x1.15, audio starts to be more comfortable (at least for my ears). Try it and let me know how it feels.

I include link to playlist to the series so you can watch episodes in order.

LGBT new approach to TT - S01 - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLQPy2iyVdbl6l5C7Dg6wMY6PsYsY_DHoX)

tomahawk11
02-16-2022, 10:50 AM
I have just finished watching all of your videos, and I find them very relevant for me.
I agree with the others that the information presented is not as easy to digest.

My goal for this year is to improve my footwork, and not "stress" about the ball. I think this is related to the rhythm part that you are covering. I tend to rush the ball to quickly, to try to attack quick and powerfully. (i think you described it as "dangerous" trajectory - low arc, and not safe). And i also have trouble with having already decided to use FH or BH too early.

I feel like the concepts you talk about are very relevant, but they are not crystal clear, and I am not sure how to train them.

Some questions that I have.:

You mention to do a backjump at the same time as the opponents backswing. How does this relate to the finishing of your own stroke? Are you supposed to "wait" until his backswing, or would you say the end of your stroke and his backswing happens simultaneously - and I could think of it as jumping back is part of my own stroke.
How does this work in shortgame? Should you not step out as soon as you finished your push, so you are ready for an attack, or do you propose to wait for opponents instep?

This is what i got from your videos, and what I would try to practise:

Beat 1: (Opponents backswing)
My action: small jump back.
Mental cue: observe speed/spin/trajectory
Beat 2: (Landing from jump back)
My action: should know trajectory. Move accordingly, and get to ready position.
Mental cue: Move to anticipated ball landing
Beat 3: (ball hitting table)
My action: Perform backswing.
Mental cue: Look at opponents position, where do I want to place the ball?
Beat 4: (Hitting the ball)
My action: Catch my movement with my left foot so, I am still in position
Mental cue: Watch opponent in order to pickup beat 1.

SURF
02-16-2022, 01:07 PM
Hi Tomahawk,
Firstly start training this without a bat. Forget your strokes or old footwork.
Just learn yourself to read trajectory. I will give you the exact instructions.

1a. try to jump from ready position at the same time you see your opponent start a stroke from his/her finished backswing (stroke loaded). So his/her bat is approaching to the ball. This takes some fraction of time, you need to get your feet in the air.
1b. try to anticipate rhythm (in other words in this case how quickly your opponent hits the ball, that quickly you jump). Now, push your feet to the ground from the air, at the opponents time of contact.

Those are two phases of split step. a- rising, b- falling.
You can adjust falling by pushing your legs faster if necessary. I hope it make sense.

Right after you land, catch the ball with your eyes and read the trajectory. You basicaly drawn a vector in your mind. Its like you see oriented arrow. It has its direction and size. This gives you enough information about placement and speed of the ball. Do you get it? :)
The ball should be still around 20-30 cm from opponents paddle. In every case ball does not crossed the net so far. This is important.
Look at landing margin in the video.

2a. Now, do second action. this means you are tracking the ball to its peak with eyes and body rotation so your chest is perpernicular to the ball the whole time. Imagine broomstick from your chest pointing to the ball during its flight.

2b. Once ball start falling from its peak, try to synchronize the fall time with your squat (load your feet).

3. As ball hits the table, release your legs and catch the ball with you playing hand, when ball crosses end line of the table.

repeat it until you are able to react at any safe trajectory goint to any direction.
Imagine your body doing it firstly, you need to know whot to do and why before you go behind the table.
Imagination is soo powerfull.

If some graphics is needed, watch again the 2nd episode Chapter 3. This is how you should see trajectory. Now it should be all clear.

SURF
02-16-2022, 01:24 PM
Try to find harmony of your body movement and the ball trajectory discrete paths. (from one beat to another)
After some training your body start to do this subconsciously, so some movements merge together. At that time you do not strictly need to follow this procedure and you can adjust actions to some shifted points also. (based on your stroke dynamics)
But the spit step must be precise always.
This is ideal framework you want to approach your training to.

in 3 weeks of 30min a day, you will see huge difference in your footwork already.

SURF
02-16-2022, 01:36 PM
I have just finished watching all of your videos, and I find them very relevant for me.
I agree with the others that the information presented is not as easy to digest.

My goal for this year is to improve my footwork, and not "stress" about the ball. I think this is related to the rhythm part that you are covering. I tend to rush the ball to quickly, to try to attack quick and powerfully. (i think you described it as "dangerous" trajectory - low arc, and not safe). And i also have trouble with having already decided to use FH or BH too early.

I feel like the concepts you talk about are very relevant, but they are not crystal clear, and I am not sure how to train them.

Some questions that I have.:

You mention to do a backjump at the same time as the opponents backswing. How does this relate to the finishing of your own stroke? Are you supposed to "wait" until his backswing, or would you say the end of your stroke and his backswing happens simultaneously - and I could think of it as jumping back is part of my own stroke.
How does this work in shortgame? Should you not step out as soon as you finished your push, so you are ready for an attack, or do you propose to wait for opponents instep?

This is what i got from your videos, and what I would try to practise:

Beat 1: (Opponents backswing)
My action: small jump back.
Mental cue: observe speed/spin/trajectory
Beat 2: (Landing from jump back)
My action: should know trajectory. Move accordingly, and get to ready position.
Mental cue: Move to anticipated ball landing
Beat 3: (ball hitting table)
My action: Perform backswing.
Mental cue: Look at opponents position, where do I want to place the ball?
Beat 4: (Hitting the ball)
My action: Catch my movement with my left foot so, I am still in position
Mental cue: Watch opponent in order to pickup beat 1.


no no,
just do this in order, according to my previous post.
- jump
- from where you land do not move you feet much
- just turn your body (forehand)/only bend (backhand)
- and squat.
train from backhand half of the table so you can reach the ball easily with your backhand and forehand from one spot.
you can, adjust feet slightly with opening your playing leg if ball is on forehand side.
NO OTHER MOVEMENT!!