View Full Version : Shiono vs. Joo Sae Hyuk

08-31-2013, 04:47 PM

Who do you think is better?Shiono or Joo?
I think,
Joo was better a few years ago compared to Shiono nowadays. But atm I think Shiono is better because of the better attack!
Tell me your opinions!

09-01-2013, 12:35 AM
Shiono has yet to confront the top chinese players. I'll wait until then to decide who is better.

09-01-2013, 05:34 AM

09-01-2013, 11:00 PM
I think Shiono has huge potential! It's interesting that that only since recent times hes recently shown himself. I am looking forward to him taking on the likes of Ma Long and Zhang jike. Sure will be good to watch!

09-02-2013, 02:32 AM
Masato Shiono is a great defender and far more spectacular than joo se huyk but against experienced and patient players, I believe he won't achieve great results.

Check this match against primorac,

PRM played with tons of patience and waited for the right ball to take masato off guard

He used slow & soft spinny topspins (bouncing at the middle of masato's side of the table, very difficult for a defender to attack, and to chop also) and not all out attacks unless it was absolutely necessary.

Primorac's experience was the crucial factor in this 1/4 final, 43 years old he cant beat sirucek,machado,koki niwa,xu chenhao, chen chien an (all of them lost to masato shiono) because of his age, but when it comes to tactics he is still great

09-02-2013, 08:16 AM
Primorac is in my opinion The Master against Defence

09-02-2013, 08:39 AM
Primorac and Samsonov are only European Masters against defence. But when shiono plays against any top chinese player, he will not have chance. They have so strong and consistnet topspin, there is no defender in the world nowdays who can win any of them.

09-02-2013, 07:49 PM
I think Shiono lacks experience when using lots of tactics and counter-strategies. He has not been playing against the world class players for years, unlike Joo Se Hyuk. However, like many other people said, he may soon be the greatest defender in the world!

09-03-2013, 02:00 AM
Shiono's counterattacks are something really special I think :D

09-03-2013, 02:44 AM
I can't wait until the future when the biggest players are Fan Zhendong, Yan'An, Masato Shiono and other players yet to come. And Wang Hao and Ma Long will be considered to be like the Ma Lin and Wang Liqin of the 2020's!! LoL

09-03-2013, 02:52 AM
I think Shiono need to learn to give spinny low returns (the type that just barely grace the top of the net) into his repertoire, and vary the high loop chops with the low ones to make it even harder for the opponents to return.

Matt Hetherington
09-05-2013, 01:43 PM
I don't think you can make the comparison yet. Shiono came out of nowhere to win one world tour title, he beat a string of good players however none were Chinese as mentioned above and he struggled with the European style of combatting defensive players.

Joo was top 10 in the world for many years, he won bronze at the world cup and silver at the world championships, I think Shiono is not on this level yet and he has only recently emerged on the international scene, he is not young, I don't feel he has time to achieve what Joo has achieved as a defensive player. My vote goes to Joo for sure.

12-13-2013, 02:46 PM
My vote goes to Joo Sae Hyuk, too.

In my opinion the best defensive player in the world. He is safe on both sides when defending, he has a strong and powerful topspin and can bring back more topspins than any other defender. The only thing that he don't play is a backhand topspin.

I think his results and achievements are great when you consider that he is a defender.
He was among the Top 5 in the world and over years top-ranked in the ITTF world ranking.

Of course Shiono is also a good defender with an spectacular style. But I miss the safety and the coolness in his game.

12-14-2013, 04:22 AM
I love watching top level choppers play against top level attackers.

The only problem is guys like Ma Lin and Wang Hao eat Joo Sae Hyuk alive.

This was a while ago but I was watching a game that was being commentated by the British chap, that does a lot of commentary. He said the record between Ma Lina and JSH was 10-3 in favor of Ma Lin.

Ma lin just won't make mistakes, he can loop all day.

I watched JSH play Timo Boll right after I watched Ma Lin play him. Timo ended up losing the game and it seemed to me that he had a rather hard time against him. Granted both Timo and Lin have very good forehand loops, so I tried to identify and differences in execution. From what I was able to tell, Ma Lin hit angles that Timo Boll wasn't. Timo tended to hit most of his forehands straight down the middle, where as Ma Lin tried to hit them into the corners, and change the angles when he could.
Timo was forced into JSH's rhythm whereas Ma Lin forced JSH into his.

12-14-2013, 02:57 PM
Look at Joo's recent results in CSL and you know who is better...

12-28-2013, 06:39 PM
What equipement does Shiono use ?

12-28-2013, 07:26 PM
I think that Masoto Shiono is better than Joo Se Hyuk, because he plays many more topspins than Joo.
Joo's Defense is stronger, but Shiono will have a so strong defense like Joo in two years. Than he will beat
the top chinese players!

12-29-2013, 02:11 AM
Shiono is surely fun to watch, a great story, and he is likely not yet reached his potential.

Is he or will he be as good as Joo S H ???

I do not think so.

Someone please notify me when he hangs in or around the WR top 10 for a DECADE and reaches semis in the WM and other important tourneys.

I agree with others who comment that Shiono gets the spotlight now as he was closer to WR 100 than WR 10 before he started doing well in some ITTF tourneys. When Shiono achieves what Joo has and does it at that high level for a FULL DECADE PLUS, I will be open to a different opinion.

Also, NO ONE on ITTF tour excites crowds like Joo, I mean NO ONE. Evry time you see Joo play a top player, the crowd is on its feet roaring with cheers, oohs, ahs, and the like. You do not see this for Ma Long, Wang Hao, Zhang Jike, Ma Lin, Timo Boll, or any other top player. When Joo is doing his thing in rallies, it is unbelieveable to see live and is compelling as all let-out. No one on hte tour compares with him for this.

12-30-2013, 03:43 PM
I like shiono's defensive play than joo, shiono turn the rubber to chop more often than joo. I think someday he will be more dangerous than joo.

12-30-2013, 09:24 PM
The only reason I don't think Shiono will surpass joo as best defender is because of the fact he does not play a patient game. He is too risky with his counterloops.

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12-30-2013, 10:20 PM
Hopefully we get to see Shiono playing the top Chinese in the upcoming ProTour Finals. His best chance would have been the Japan Open where he came out from 'nowhere' to surprise everyone including his Japanese compatriots. Yes the top Chinese have powerful strokes, but I don't think hitting harder or spinnier is the right way to play Shiono, as can be seen his wins and loses since then. It seems more a matter of control, placement and patience. That said, single minded hard loopers may be more susceptible.

Unfortunately for Shiono, he is now out in the open. He has also changed equipment. Judging by the way his opponents missed in Japan Open, his old set up was way more deceptive.

Dancer in the dark
12-31-2013, 01:56 PM
His backhand rubber is still the same (TSP Curl P4). I'm not sure whether his new FH rubber (Bluefire JP01) or his new blade (Donic Defplay) affect his performance. A the German Open he already made the change and if you look at the following match between Shiono and Ovtcharov you can hardly say Shiono's performance is worse.


12-31-2013, 04:05 PM
for me the players at that level have too much sensibility to have trouble in changing materials

12-31-2013, 06:04 PM
In Japan Open, it seemed as soon as someone tried to power loop against Shiono, mostly they didn't just miss, they missed badly. It was strange. That is why I thought Shiono's setup was particularly deceptive at Japan Open.

Recently, I can see that his opponents can at least put their power shots on the table. DO probably didn't play the right game. He still seemed to be of the mind set that he was going to overpower Shiono.

02-03-2014, 06:36 PM
Both defenders are incredible :D !!!

02-05-2014, 03:53 AM
What I want to know is what changed for Shiono that rocketed him so far up the rankings. In table tennis years, he was pretty old to be making such dramatic gains. Was it equipment? Training? Coaching? Something changed.

02-05-2014, 05:42 AM
Joo Sea Hyuk is much more consistent than Shiono. He is more like a classic defender but Shiono is a modern one.
Joo has reached the final of WTTC and has defeated top Chinese players so many times. Shiono hasn't done any of those. Shiono is ranked #47 in world ranking. Joo is retired but he is still in top 20.

05-09-2015, 12:01 PM
There is no equal or greater a defender than JSH!end of story