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Hawsegawa
05-17-2014, 10:12 PM
Hello all,

Here are a few videos of me practicing on the robot. Any advice would be much appreciated, and sorry for the awkward camera angle!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qD_Pe56JtC0


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1NOrYU98qo

DDF2
05-17-2014, 10:55 PM
In general I think your pose is too high. Try bending your knees more and get your back a little lower. Also It looks like you're standing very close to the table which isn't the best thing to do in the basic stance you wanna have. If you drop your forearm only the outer part of your bat should hit the table.

For the forehand I think it's better if you extend your arm a little more and do the swing towards your forehead. That way you can produce more speed and spin for offensive shots. In the video I only see you doing flat shots which aren't all that great in opening up and controling the game.

On the backhand your stroke is very reliant on your wrist movement which means you won't produce the highest amount of speed if you want to attack. To play a good backhand topspin you will have to bring your elbow forward, maybe turn your body a bit so your shoulder faces the table. From that position you can play either slow spinny shots and fast spinny or flat shots so it's a good position for opening up the game offensively.

mahomedy13
05-18-2014, 11:03 AM
you need to lower you centre of gravity-you standing too high

mahomedy13
05-18-2014, 11:05 AM
here a clip that will help-


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhAI64BtQ_c

Timo explains quite well-especially the stance and body positions.

tan.theveteran
05-18-2014, 01:30 PM
I think your shoulders are too stiff or it is just me? haha. try relaxing a little bit more.

Hawsegawa
05-18-2014, 01:38 PM
Thanks all - I gotta bend my knees more, only realised how upright I am after filming practice

XariuzCruz
05-18-2014, 01:38 PM
I think when you're playing your forehand, your left foot should be slightly forward than your right foot.

Hawsegawa
05-18-2014, 01:47 PM
I think when you're playing your forehand, your left foot should be slightly forward than your right foot. As a left-hander i should have my left foot forward?

XariuzCruz
05-18-2014, 01:50 PM
As a left-hander i should have my left foot forward?
Oops, sorry I didn't see that. Yes but you have your left foot too forward.

Der_Echte
05-18-2014, 09:24 PM
Drink a few pints, film a match vs a slightly better player, and show us the results where you win. We will be happy to analyze the details for you.

Take care of the easy stuff and keep plugging away. Get a good stance. Hit your BH a little closer to your body. Keep your bat up some moar. get down sum moar. Explode sum more for your power shots. Use less arm and more core body on your control shots. Get a coach that will tell you these things and take money. go on forums and show your results of conquering the field and walking off with big paycheck and the girlz. Wake up and realize it is an endless amount of work to be at the pinnacle, but accept the challenge and the fun of it to be continually improving.

agold
05-19-2014, 01:01 AM
Drink a few pints, film a match vs a slightly better player, and show us the results where you win. We will be happy to analyze the details for you.

Take care of the easy stuff and keep plugging away. Get a good stance. Hit your BH a little closer to your body. Keep your bat up some moar. get down sum moar. Explode sum more for your power shots. Use less arm and more core body on your control shots. Get a coach that will tell you these things and take money. go on forums and show your results of conquering the field and walking off with big paycheck and the girlz. Wake up and realize it is an endless amount of work to be at the pinnacle, but accept the challenge and the fun of it to be continually improving.

Can I do that too? Haha ;)

Der_Echte
05-19-2014, 01:00 PM
agold, you go to my former club in Korea (or just about any one for that matter) and have at it.

agold
05-19-2014, 01:50 PM
Can I do that too? Haha ;)

Except I am underage :)

SpinQuark
05-20-2014, 12:07 AM
OK, I am no expert so please be gentle with me if I have this wrong. I should probably leave coaching comments to the coaches.

It seems to me that with both your forehand and your backhand you are rotating or turning your wrist over somewhat as you hit the shot and this is producing a slight slapping action to your shots. It almost looks like you are playing a kind of half flip type shot. I would suggest trying to keep the plane of the bat constant with no turning over of the wrist through the shot. Just brush the ball with an upwards saluting action up to your forehead. You should then get more top spin which will give more control. This will probably feel really weird to you if you do it right.

Take a look at this video...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0IUVntVwQo

Also I would say that on the forehand you should be moving and changing your foot position when you switch from hitting balls across the table to hitting them down the line. You seem to be changing direction by just altering your wrist/arm action, whereas I think this should stay as constant as possible, alter direction by changing the direction your feet and body are facing in.

Hope this makes sense and some real coaches can point it out if I am talking rubbish.

Hawsegawa
05-20-2014, 05:23 PM
OK, I am no expert so please be gentle with me if I have this wrong. I should probably leave coaching comments to the coaches. It seems to me that with both your forehand and your backhand you are rotating or turning your wrist over somewhat as you hit the shot and this is producing a slight slapping action to your shots. It almost looks like you are playing a kind of half flip type shot. I would suggest trying to keep the plane of the bat constant with no turning over of the wrist through the shot. Just brush the ball with an upwards saluting action up to your forehead. You should then get more top spin which will give more control. This will probably feel really weird to you if you do it right. Take a look at this video...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0IUVntVwQo Also I would say that on the forehand you should be moving and changing your foot position when you switch from hitting balls across the table to hitting them down the line. You seem to be changing direction by just altering your wrist/arm action, whereas I think this should stay as constant as possible, alter direction by changing the direction your feet and body are facing in. Hope this makes sense and some real coaches can point it out if I am talking rubbish. Thanks buddy. I think you're right as when I do a forehand shot I also seem to generate sidespin because I use my wrist a lot. I've tried to alter it but it does feel very strange.

SpinQuark
05-20-2014, 06:54 PM
Also I think, slow that robot down. If you are going to try doing something different you will really need to concentrate on trying to do the new movement and this will take a lot of conscious thought and concentration. Hit 5 times fewer balls but give each one maximum concentration on making a new improved movement. You should also try to get some time with a good coach.

Good luck.

Dan
05-20-2014, 09:48 PM
This is great @Hawsegawa Submitting your training videos on here is a great where to learn and receive feedback.

Firstly, not many players record themselves, you have done this well. You will naturally learn so much through watching yourself. As you have already mentioned here you are aware you need to bend your knees more and learn slightly more forward after having watched yourself.

There have been a lot of good feedback here. One thing I would say is use this robot to practice your technique but try to practice with a human as much as you can and soak up a lot of match play. If you can submit videos of yourself doing this, a lot more greater feedback can be given to you as your play will be less isolated to critique.

Top stuff, I like your backhand you have good wrist movement there.

UpSideDownCarl
05-21-2014, 06:37 AM
Okay, I think you got the basic points, the most important ones: knees more bent, weight more foreword. But you need to do a little something with your right arm (non-racket arm). I think your right elbow should be a little further out away from your body. This will help with using your hips and core when you are taking the stroke. Right now it looks like your right upper arm is being held so tight to your body that your right hand is almost in the way of your racket arm. So I would say to try to get the elbow a little out and the right arm relaxed.

Just a little out so the upper arm is not quite vertical:

5920

UpSideDownCarl
05-21-2014, 06:50 AM
One more piece of information. What does weight foreword mean? You stand in your ready position, you move your weight foreword enough so you start feeling more weight in the balls of your feet and your heels almost come off the ground or they come off a tiny bit. Then, every time you stroke, your feet move a bit as part of the stroke and your heels don't stay stuck on the ground.

ttmonster
05-21-2014, 02:57 PM
Summary of advice :
1. Table tennis is a very fast sport , and if you play close to the table its unlikely that you will be able to switch sideways on both wings to execute you backhand and forehand. So your stance needs to be a little "front-on" rather than so much "Side on" , to use Cricket terminology.
2. Relax your shoulder. If you feel that you need to come down to the level of the table to execute your strokes, try not to do it by bending forward rather by flexing your knees. e.g. watch Zhang Jike's footwork you will know what I mean. if you bend your legs, you will get more core stability and balance and its easier to switch between forehand and backhand and also less chances of a back injury.
3. Always remember that in table tennis you have generate more power from your legs and waist and weight transfer. This helps in faster recovery. So when you are starting out, its advisable to not use your wrist ( particularly on the forehand ) . You can add it later when you feel your weight transfer is already grooved in.
4. on your backhand , your wrist is nice and loose which is a great thing. but try to take it closer to your body and hold your tension in your core muscles.
5. Another good habit to build in while starting out is to skip/hop a little with your legs after you complete each stroke.

Hawsegawa
05-21-2014, 08:44 PM
Thanks everyone for the feedback so far, I will try and upload some match play when I can get some recorded. I have a lot to work on already, though! : D

Tony's Table Tennis
05-21-2014, 09:42 PM
Firstly, your robot frequency is set too high.
Slow it down!

As above, lower your stance, and make sure all your shots you are on your toe and and not your heal.
FH shot, when you finish the shot, make sure your centre of the body faces the direction you are hiting (you are facing the camera all the time)
Other than that, best to also take video from behind too. And do you have a coach?

ttmonster
05-22-2014, 01:22 AM
Thanks everyone for the feedback so far, I will try and upload some match play when I can get some recorded. I have a lot to work on already, though! : D Don't worry and stress over it. Everybody starts from zero. And table tennis is a lifetime sport. Unless you are planning to break into the England national team soon you have plenty of time to improve :) . All the best in your pursuit of excellence !!!

Hawsegawa
05-22-2014, 03:38 PM
Firstly, your robot frequency is set too high.
Slow it down!

As above, lower your stance, and make sure all your shots you are on your toe and and not your heal.
FH shot, when you finish the shot, make sure your centre of the body faces the direction you are hiting (you are facing the camera all the time)
Other than that, best to also take video from behind too. And do you have a coach?

Yes, we have a coach who runs some training sessions at the local club. He likes to focus on movement and consistency of shots, but it appears I need to focus more on my stance and weight transferring, strokes etc.. Back to the basics! From looking at the video again it looks as if i'm transferring my weight to the side, perhaps thats how I am generating all the sidespin? It feels really strange not using my wrist when playing a forehand, probably because i am so used to it. It's really effective for me, especially when i am looping but if i play a player who can return it, it comes back at such an awkward angle for me because of the sidespin.

ttmonster
05-22-2014, 06:13 PM
Yes, we have a coach who runs some training sessions at the local club. He likes to focus on movement and consistency of shots, but it appears I need to focus more on my stance and weight transferring, strokes etc.. Back to the basics! From looking at the video again it looks as if i'm transferring my weight to the side, perhaps thats how I am generating all the sidespin? It feels really strange not using my wrist when playing a forehand, probably because i am so used to it. It's really effective for me, especially when i am looping but if i play a player who can return it, it comes back at such an awkward angle for me because of the sidespin. yes , then you will have problems in building your game up, because it will get restricted to a max of one or two consecutive sidespin loops.

UpSideDownCarl
05-23-2014, 01:13 PM
By the way, the robot speed thing. I am not sure I agree 100% with the idea that you "need" to slow the robot down. The idea that you can hit pretty consistently at that speed is good. It means your reset is fast. It is worth working at many different speeds. If you can use a speed that fast and hit consistently, it means that when the pace gets quicker in real rallies, you are more likely going to be ready and used to that pace.

But, perhaps it is a hard pace at which to change fundamentals. So slower is ALSO good. :) Use many different ball frequency settings. If you can do the faster ones, you have to be doing something well. But you need to be able to work at speeds where you can consciously change fundamentals. I personally think you are doing pretty well.

Tony's Table Tennis
05-23-2014, 01:54 PM
By the way, the robot speed thing. I am not sure I agree 100% with the idea that you "need" to slow the robot down. The idea that you can hit pretty consistently at that speed is good. It means your reset is fast. It is worth working at many different speeds. If you can use a speed that fast and hit consistently, it means that when the pace gets quicker in real rallies, you are more likely going to be ready and used to that pace.

But, perhaps it is a hard pace at which to change fundamentals. So slower is ALSO good. :) Use many different ball frequency settings. If you can do the faster ones, you have to be doing something well. But you need to be able to work at speeds where you can consciously change fundamentals. I personally think you are doing pretty well.

I agree with what you say about fast and slow speed

But from OP's video, he has fundemental flaws in his stroke, and the main reason I see for that is because the robot is too quick.
I see this with some other coaches, and I also told them to slow it down a little bit and allow the student to do a proper full stroke - even if it is european style.

But no, they choose to do it fast, and it trains the kid to just hit the ball by using arm movement (like wacking a fly).
Nothing from feet, waist etc. no time for that.
A very good training to back the bad habit worse

Hawsegawa
05-23-2014, 10:50 PM
Hi all, got some match footage recorded. Few videos as I tried to get as many angles as possible


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vglCYhsG0uM

Hawsegawa
05-23-2014, 10:52 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m66EJP3CIAM

Seems I can only post 1 video at a time ):

ttmonster
05-24-2014, 01:57 AM
Simplest way for you to improve further is to atch Timo Boll's body positioning and technique and use it as a template to develop your game.
I feel you chose the wrong videos in your first post, Tony is right , the ball machine is too fast for your current speed , you are executing your strokes better in game than in that practice video.There is nothing wrong with your basics and except may be footwork , to improve which you would need multiball. You just need to work on your body positioning and movement. Try to learn from timo , how to use weight transfer to generate more spin , starting from service to any other shots he executes, how he stays low, how he does a "skip step" right at the moment he gets ready for the serve , these things will help you improve further and see if you can get somebody to run you to death by feeding multiball that should take care of your footwork issues.