Why doesn't Tim boll's FH and BH drives look attractive and effective in matches?

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I looked some videos of Boll training at Borussia Dortmund. The amount of power and spin produced during each stroke was so overwhelming to me. No wonder, he has been in the top for over a decade. But, when he plays in a real tournament, I feel his strokes aren't that powerful and spinny as it seems in the training videos. Is it because he plays mostly chinese with higher athletic superiority or is he just that fluid in the game which makes his play look so effortless. This thought has been running in my mind for quite a while, would like to know your opinon!
 
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I looked some videos of Boll training at Borussia Dortmund. The amount of power and spin produced during each stroke was so overwhelming to me. No wonder, he has been in the top for over a decade. But, when he plays in a real tournament, I feel his strokes aren't that powerful and spinny as it seems in the training videos. Is it because he plays mostly chinese with higher athletic superiority or is he just that fluid in the game which makes his play look so effortless. This thought has been running in my mind for quite a while, would like to know your opinon!

I really don't understand this at all. Can you give examples of where his strokes are not effective? Timo Boll tends to crush pretty much every one he plays who has not been a top 10 player before with a few exceptions. If you are saying that his strokes are so powerful that no one should ever return them, that is not how table tennis works - no matter how powerful your strokes are, they can be returned by people who stay at the right distance from the table and who have time to read your stroke unless you have set them up and made them produce a weak ball that you can attack with good power and placement.

Moreover, all things being equal, Timo Boll's spin is more impressive than his raw power - for raw power, look at players like Ovtcharov or Fan Zhendong, all other things being equal.
 
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I don't quite understand this comment for a different reason. People never look as good in matches as they do in training since they are being pressured by the opponent and don't know where the ball is going, so why the poster would be surprised that this is true for Timo Boll also beats me. This is true at every level from the top down. Also, he is not quite as young as he was before.
 
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You should watch him live. It completely changed my perception of him. Youtube TT is 2 dimensional compared to live table tennis. This video captures it a little but Timo was in bad form (by his standards) in this world cup (2013). I watched him in 2014 against ZJK and in a friendly tournament against Persson and Aruna in 2015.

 
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You should watch him live. It completely changed my perception of him. Youtube TT is 2 dimensional compared to live table tennis. This video captures it a little but Timo was in bad form (by his standards) in this world cup (2013). I watched him in 2014 against ZJK and in a friendly tournament against Persson and Aruna in 2015.



That was war my friend, I checked the channel, it was uploaded by Butterfly. It is indeed true from what I see now is most of the 2d kind of perspective limits the vision and color what the true level of play is.

Very nice and interesting vidoe. What I see is his skill to spin and speed is so unmmatched for his long stay in the tall ladder of world rankings!

Disclaimer :Ineffective was not I meant, I used the wrong word in context
 
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Hey Next level, Inefficient was a wrong usage in the context while posting, sorry for confusing everyone.
Moreover, all things being equal, Timo Boll's spin is more impressive than his raw power - for raw power, look at players like Ovtcharov or Fan Zhendong, all other things being equal.

I share the same perception and this is the main reason why I made this post. It is like he is so technical and he doesn't need the raw power like Ovtcharov to score points.

Also, I have no qualms for his backhand. But, his forehand drive and Mizutani's drive are complete offbeat in my view. This is why I felt there is something differnent to What you see in chinese and other top asian Players
 
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Hey Next level, Inefficient was a wrong usage in the context while posting, sorry for confusing everyone.


I share the same perception and this is the main reason why I made this post. It is like he is so technical and he doesn't need the raw power like Ovtcharov to score points.

Also, I have no qualms for his backhand. But, his forehand drive and Mizutani's drive are complete offbeat in my view. This is why I felt there is something differnent to What you see in chinese and other top asian Players

There are a lot of different forehand techniques out there. Even in the CNT, ZJK and Ma Long have completely different techniques. I find ZJK's forehand more suitable for learning. Ma Long's speciality is using this huge powerful half-distance forehand from close to the table but you need great anticipation and footwork for that.

Even then, players even have different techniques while they are in different situations. ZJK uses his full arm against choppers. Ma Long has a smaller movement while counterlooping a ball close to the table.

Boll's forehand is mostly a very short movement as he uses it to gaina time-advantage when he is playing counter attacks close to the table. He uses his wrist and accelerates very fast, which is why his forehand is so spinny.

Even I don't know how Mizutani got to the top 10 in the world with that forehand :D. I think he just has phenomenal ball control and a very good serve and receive strategy, which is sufficient against most of the non-Chinese players.
 
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You put those words very well. This was exactly what I was trying to express. But due to my limited technial knowledge couldn't do so
Boll's forehand is mostly a very short movement as he uses it to gaina time-advantage when he is playing counter attacks close to the table. He uses his wrist and accelerates very fast, which is why his forehand is so spinny.

That summarises most of my feeling.

Xu xin and Jun Mizutani can't be assessed with normal standards.

ZJK uses his full arm against choppers

That was a very subtle observation. I too was explaining this to my friend that zJK extend his arm fully sometimes like xU Xin while looping and driving. He has a complete unique FH skill set. Sometimes, smaller movements. In case of choppers, longer arm extension. He also does it to increase power near the table. This also explains his incredible forehand flicks, to externd FH in forward direction.
 
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You put those words very well. This was exactly what I was trying to express. But due to my limited technial knowledge couldn't do so


That summarises most of my feeling.

Xu xin and Jun Mizutani can't be assessed with normal standards.



That was a very subtle observation. I too was explaining this to my friend that zJK extend his arm fully sometimes like xU Xin while looping and driving. He has a complete unique FH skill set. Sometimes, smaller movements. In case of choppers, longer arm extension. He also does it to increase power near the table. This also explains his incredible forehand flicks, to externd FH in forward direction.

Timo Boll also subtly changes the length and size of his movement but not as much as others given his focus on spin. He is predominantly a spin player and developed his style in the era of the 38mm ball. The feature of his style that translated to the 40mm ball era was the close to the table play and consistency. The larger ball hurt his spin.

The thing is that there is significant diversity in European countries for style of play and technique. While there is diversity on the CNT, my sense is that certain things are also discouraged if you don't fit into a certain mould (players who finish their stroke as far across the body as Boll, Maze and Mizutani would probably draw some funny stares from coaches at the Provincial level and would not even be allowed to try out for CNT unless they beat everyone 11-0 - you get my drift).

In any case, technique is something you develop in youth and winning is what it is - at this point, you should just celebrate Boll for what he is. While you may think otherwise, in terms of strengths, both Boll's and Mizutani's forehands are their strengths in terms of rally play, as much as they both have decent BH loops. IMO, Boll's looping technique is fine, but he is unable to counterattack aggressively with his backhand close to the table so the Chinese feel safe looping to his backhand as he needs to pivot to get a strong counterattack and that opens up the table. When you compare this to Ma Long or Zhang Jike who will just give you more resistance with fast blocks and counterloops at the table, you can see what Boll's real issue is.

His consistency and spin more than make up for any technical deficiencies. It's the inability to counterattack very aggressively on the BH vs. CNT level pace that is the issue.
 
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Boll's strokes are not effective? I think he vladi and maze are the epitomy of the european table tennis technique . He is not explosive as the chinese are yes but he doesnt even want to train like the chinese do.

Boll is one of the few players that can add pace to the ball or use his opponent's pace to crush him. In terms of total understanding of the game, I think he is still even better than Dima despite their recent results. He is dominating Europe for the past 15 years with a few breaks (maze samsonov)
 
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You should watch him live. It completely changed my perception of him. Youtube TT is 2 dimensional compared to live table tennis. This video captures it a little but Timo was in bad form (by his standards) in this world cup (2013). I watched him in 2014 against ZJK and in a friendly tournament against Persson and Aruna in 2015.



I love this video angle! It is just so much more "real". I envy people in Europe who have easy access to watch elite players.
 
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