Quick Rule question.

Shuki · Mar 18, 2016

I know you can't talk in a rally. ESPECIALLY during your opponents stroke because it could distract them. But what if you mishit the ball, causing a weak return, are you then allowed to say something like "oh crap" if it's really just a reaction to your own shot?

Xylit · Mar 18, 2016

The referee has to decide whether it was too distracting and therefore cancel the ball or ignore it. Ovtcharov's moaning for example is tolerated. If the referee stops the ball he has to warn the player by the first time (ball is replayed) and for the next stops he can give points to the opponent.

Edit:
As this case is not explicit mentioned in the rules I can't be 100% sure with my answer. But this should be as exactly as possible according to rules.

Shuki · Mar 18, 2016

ovtcharov's grunts are during his stroke though, me saying "oh shit" is right before the opponents shot.

Der_Echte · Mar 18, 2016

You will, and rightfully so, get different responses as different nations' rules may be different.

IN USA, the rules (Laws of TT) do not specifically address this exact (or every) situation. USATT rules you at best are looking at calling a let when there is no umpire and be outta luck if there is an umpire if he/she doesn't call it.

2.9.2.4 because the conditions of play are disturbed in a way which could affect the outcome of the rally.

ITTF Rules are similar. You could look at it as a let situation.

2.9.2.4 because the conditions of play are disturbed in a way which could affect the
outcome of the rally.

My judgment does not make an "Oh Crap" a SERIOUS violation of MISBEHAVIOR like in the rules.

On a personal level, I find someone grunting loudly on serves very distracting.

As an umpire, (if I was umpiring) I would stop play and warn the server he/she is grunting loudly and that is distracting enough to disturb the outcome of the point.

Shuki · Mar 18, 2016

Der_Echte said:
My judgment does not make an "Oh Crap" a SERIOUS violation of MISBEHAVIOR like in the rules.

On a personal level, I find someone grunting loudly on serves very distracting.

As an umpire, (if I was umpiring) I would stop play and warn the server he/she is grunting loudly and that is distracting enough to disturb the outcome of the point.

Grunting on a serve is distracting to you? On my backhand serves I stomp my foot pretty hard as just part of my motion. I've been in some gymnasiums where it's actually pretty loud and players say it's pretty distracting.

NDH · Mar 18, 2016

Shuki said:
Grunting on a serve is distracting to you? On my backhand serves I stomp my foot pretty hard as just part of my motion. I've been in some gymnasiums where it's actually pretty loud and players say it's pretty distracting.

I love a good foot stomp on service! It can help with masking the spin at times.

As for the "oh shit" after you've played a bad shot, and they have had time to hit the ball, personally, I think that's wrong.

If they then miss the easy kill, you just open yourself to the possibility of the opponent complaining and replaying the point!

Put it like this, in the 2 situations of you either saying something, or not saying something - if you DONT say anything, nothing can possibly go wrong (you'll probably lose the point if you've set them up, but that's just because youve played a bad shot).

If if you say something, they will still probably win the point with the easy kill, but you open yourself to that possibility of a complaint (or a referee intervention).

That's just my two cents

Shuki · Mar 19, 2016

Oh yes, I agree that not doing it would simply be better. But it's a reaction saying it, hard to stop unless I practice messing up on purpose and then focus on not saying it.

What a waste of practice time this would be. Putting my focus toward anything else would surely be better. I just wanted to know if it was illegal.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

NDH · Mar 19, 2016

Shuki said:
Oh yes, I agree that not doing it would simply be better. But it's a reaction saying it, hard to stop unless I practice messing up on purpose and then focus on not saying it.

What a waste of practice time this would be. Putting my focus toward anything else would surely be better. I just wanted to know if it was illegal.

Sent from m using Tapatalk

ITTF Rule 3.05.02.01 - Players and coaches or other advisers shall refrain from behaviour that may unfairly affect an opponent, offend spectators or bring the sport into disrepute, such as abusive language, deliberately breaking the ball or hitting it out of the playing area, kicking the table or surrounds and disrespect of match officials.
ITTF Rule 3.05.02.03 - Except as provided in 3.5.2.2 and 3.5.2.5, if a player who has been warned commits a second offence in the same individual match or team match, the umpire shall award 1 point to the offender's opponent and for a further offence he or she shall award 2 points, each time holding up a yellow and a red card together.

At the end of the day, you'd have to come across a bit of a picky opponent if they pulled you up on it!

Shuki · Mar 19, 2016

NDH said:
ITTF Rule 3.05.02.01 - Players and coaches or other advisers shall refrain from behaviour that may unfairly affect an opponent, offend spectators or bring the sport into disrepute, such as abusive language, deliberately breaking the ball or hitting it out of the playing area, kicking the table or surrounds and disrespect of match officials.
ITTF Rule 3.05.02.03 - Except as provided in 3.5.2.2 and 3.5.2.5, if a player who has been warned commits a second offence in the same individual match or team match, the umpire shall award 1 point to the offender's opponent and for a further offence he or she shall award 2 points, each time holding up a yellow and a red card together.

At the end of the day, you'd have to come across a bit of a picky opponent if they pulled you up on it!

Great find in the rules! But I'm looking for USATT rules, I should have specified, I'll never have an ITTF rating

Der_Echte · Mar 20, 2016

Although not covered in the USATT rules specifically, foot stomping is currently allowed. There is even a question about it on your Umpire Written Examination.

In an older time, the foot stomp was illegal. Currently, it is allowed to stomp on the serve, even if it is much more distracting loud and shaking the venue floor than a loud grunt on serve.

In a sanctioned match, during the OPEN final, I made a shot that hit the net and dribbled out, I raised hand and said sorry, but opponent barely got to the ball and almost saved it. Opponent wasn't happy I said sorry, but the referee himself was umpiring the match and allowed the point to stand. I see where my opponent was coming from, but my reaction came from concern of good sportsmanship, so I think that aspect was under consideration in the umpire's thinking.

On a different note, in the same Open Finals match on game two, captured by someone on MyTT, my opponent hit a very fast loopdrive by me. I went to the wall, picked up the ball, moved back my shirt sleeve to reveal my bicep, flexed it, and gave a thumbs up to my younger opponent.

Tinykin · Mar 20, 2016

Der_Echte said:
Although not covered in the USATT rules specifically, foot stomping is currently allowed. There is even a question about it on your Umpire Written Examination.

In an older time, the foot stomp was illegal. Currently, it is allowed to stomp on the serve, even if it is much more distracting loud and shaking the venue floor than a loud grunt on serve.

In a sanctioned match, during the OPEN final, I made a shot that hit the net and dribbled out, I raised hand and said sorry, but opponent barely got to the ball and almost saved it. Opponent wasn't happy I said sorry, but the referee himself was umpiring the match and allowed the point to stand. I see where my opponent was coming from, but my reaction came from concern of good sportsmanship, so I think that aspect was under consideration in the umpire's thinking.

On a different note, in the same Open Finals match on game two, captured by someone on MyTT, my opponent hit a very fast loopdrive by me. I went to the wall, picked up the ball, moved back my shirt sleeve to reveal my bicep, flexed it, and gave a thumbs up to my younger opponent.

This answers the OP question. It's the same situation.

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