Need Suggestion for DHS H3 NEO

Hridoy · May 13, 2016

Hello good people, I am Hridoy from Bangladesh. Currently my equipment setup is XIOM Stradivarius with DHS H3 Neo(FH) & XIOM Vega Pro(BH). The problem is when I try play close table forehand loop against chop or backspin, it's very difficult to play with the H3 Neo. On the other hand, when I play with the XIOM Vega Pro it's easy and smooth. I am an amature player & it's my first bat. Using the rubbers I see the Vega pro is faster and more spinny than H3 neo. In our country, most of the player using non chinese rubbers so they have no idea about the chinese rubbers.

What should I do now ? Please give me your valuable suggestions.

Thanks.

Boogar · May 13, 2016

Hridoy said:
Hello good people, I am Hridoy from Bangladesh. Currently my equipment setup is XIOM Stradivarius with DHS H3 Neo(FH) & XIOM Vega Pro(BH). The problem is when I try play close table forehand loop against chop or backspin, it's very difficult to play with the H3 Neo. On the other hand, when I play with the XIOM Vega Pro it's easy and smooth. I am an amature player & it's my first bat. Using the rubbers I see the Vega pro is faster and more spinny than H3 neo. In our country, most of the player using non chinese rubbers so they have no idea about the chinese rubbers.

What should I do now ? Please give me your valuable suggestions.

Thanks.

Hey there

I use the same setup as you except for the wood. I also have problems with close table forehands. However i think its a skill thing, you need to play faster and use more force generated from your hip and feet.

Aside from that i also think that Vega pro on the forehand is easier to play.
I am going to try out the rakza x soon and let you know how its feels

Cheers

thekleifheit13 · May 13, 2016

The H3N is actually disgustingly spinny once you learn how to take advantage of it. Boogar is spot on too, you need to generate upward force from your legs and rotate your shoulders. Once you do that it's very easy to lift underspin with it

NextLevel · May 13, 2016

Most people who use Chinese rubber on the forehand but don't train hard every day are making a big mistake. The advantages of boosted Chinese rubber subtly show up in advanced play. Most club players would do far better with an Euro rubber , whether regular or hard sponged. Tack actually reduces spin. It is its ability to grap the ball that makes it suited for close to the table play and the short game, but those are advanced play features and don't make up for the other times at the lower level when you need to hit a easy spinny loop past the opponent or at the opponent with less effort.

UpSideDownCarl · May 13, 2016

Yep. Listen to NextLevel. He has given the sane advice.

From my perspective, if you don't know how to boost H3 and you are having the issues you are having with it, and your technique is not pretty high level, then go get yourself a rubber you want on your FH. Just because the top CNT players use H3 does not mean what they are using is anything like what you are using because they boost the hell out of it. Vega Pro on both sides would work pretty well.

laistrogian · May 13, 2016

Just like what NextLevel said, chinese rubbers in general aren't easy to use and since you're probably starting up, unless you have a coach that could guide you, learning how to use hurricane can be quite frustrating. You could always get another vega pro if you like the rubber since in general european rubbers are easier to use when you're out of position

If you're someone who just started playing (less than 6 months), I'd suggest you to keep the stradivarius in shelf and probably get a slower 5 ply all wood blade. I really don't recommend arylate blade for beginners because it doesn't produce any feeling in touch games

anchorschmidt · May 13, 2016

I actually like semi-tacky rubbers like Palio Amigo for example. They are not as unforgiving as the Hurricane series and it's really easy to grip the ball. Looping anything over the table is quite easy and reliable. Blocking is also very easy.

However, half-distance play is much harder and smashing and flat-hitting is quite difficult.

Hridoy · May 13, 2016

Boogar said:
Hey there

I use the same setup as you except for the wood. I also have problems with close table forehands. However i think its a skill thing, you need to play faster and use more force generated from your hip and feet.

Aside from that i also think that Vega pro on the forehand is easier to play.
I am going to try out the rakza x soon and let you know how its feels

Cheers

Thanks for your opinion. I am also thinking I should go for Rakza 7 or Rakza 7 Soft. Please share your feels after using rakza x.

Cheers

Jabugo · May 13, 2016

Hridoy said:
Hello good people, I am Hridoy from Bangladesh. Currently my equipment setup is XIOM Stradivarius with DHS H3 Neo(FH) & XIOM Vega Pro(BH). The problem is when I try play close table forehand loop against chop or backspin, it's very difficult to play with the H3 Neo. On the other hand, when I play with the XIOM Vega Pro it's easy and smooth. I am an amature player & it's my first bat. Using the rubbers I see the Vega pro is faster and more spinny than H3 neo. In our country, most of the player using non chinese rubbers so they have no idea about the chinese rubbers.

What should I do now ? Please give me your valuable suggestions.

Thanks.

I agree to a certain extent with NextLevel, et al., because you mentioned that most of the players you are playing are not using Chinese rubber. Generally, when you are learning, it's better to be using similar equipment to the people you are learning from so that the strokes you learn translate properly.

But I do not agree that just any beginner should forego H3neo outright. My friend is getting coached by a Chinese coach at ICC (the same place Lily Zhang, US Olympian, is training at). He's a total beginner who just started last fall, and in his mid 50s (age), and he is doing very very well now with a solid forehand and backhand drive and push strokes. His loop drives are consistent and powerful from mid distance. He has played injury free for the past 6 months. His setup is a simple Joola Carbon blade with H3Neo 39 deg forehand and H3Neo 38 deg backhand (all provincial rubber) provided by his coach. When his coach is drilling for competition, she hits with incredible speed and spin and uses amazing footwork. I have tried my friend's blade, and I find it feels dead with little catapult compared to my own speed glued H3. So I believe it's possible to use H3neo (unboosted) effectively if you have the proper coach who also uses it, and teaches you the proper techniques.

Hridoy · May 13, 2016

Thanks NextLevel UpSideDownCarl laistrogian anchorschmidt & Jabugo.
Now I get it. As far as I know, there is no opportunity for boost rubbers in my country and no other players or coaches don't know how to deal with chinese rubbers. So, I think I should change my rubber. I want to go for Rakza 7 or Rakza 7 Soft. Is it too advance for me or I should go for another Vega Pro?

Nicolas Alvarez · May 13, 2016

If you are learning to play and developing the strokes h3 won't do any good to you, get a slow set up and develop your game first with medium or soft rubbers non-tacky which are more forgiving than H3

anchorschmidt · May 13, 2016

I'm actually using Vega Pro and Vega Japan at the moment and I really like the Vega Japan. A bit softer than the Pro and it is not as grippy as Tenergy, which means that it's not as unforgiving if you miscalculate the spin. If you are used to Pro, then you can keep on using it. I like it as well. It is probably too hard for a beginner's backhand though. I'm currently using it on my backhand and my backhand stroke is quite complete technique-wise but I cannot imagine using anything even slightly harder on my backhand.

NextLevel · May 13, 2016

Jabugo said:
I agree to a certain extent with NextLevel, et al., because you mentioned that most of the players you are playing are not using Chinese rubber. Generally, when you are learning, it's better to be using similar equipment to the people you are learning from so that the strokes you learn translate properly.

But I do not agree that just any beginner should forego H3neo outright. My friend is getting coached by a Chinese coach at ICC (the same place Lily Zhang, US Olympian, is training at). He's a total beginner who just started last fall, and in his mid 50s (age), and he is doing very very well now with a solid forehand and backhand drive and push strokes. His loop drives are consistent and powerful from mid distance. He has played injury free for the past 6 months. His setup is a simple Joola Carbon blade with H3Neo 39 deg forehand and H3Neo 38 deg backhand (all provincial rubber) provided by his coach. When his coach is drilling for competition, she hits with incredible speed and spin and uses amazing footwork. I have tried my friend's blade, and I find it feels dead with little catapult compared to my own speed glued H3. So I believe it's possible to use H3neo (unboosted) effectively if you have the proper coach who also uses it, and teaches you the proper techniques.

OP can use H3 Neo effectively. I can use H3 Neo effectively. 1200 Rated Knife (his nickname) has commented on how much he likes H3 Neo. And H3 Neo is not traditional Hurricane either.

Using it effectively is not the same thing as saying that it is what you should be using or it is optimal for you or that your preferred technique is suited for it, or there aren't other rubbers that can support such technique easily. Optimal is a dangerous word when speaking about TT equipment, but I would be very surprised if your friend, unless he developed a very strong short game with H3Neo, got to a higher level of play and didn't see the benefits in switching to something else. In TT, everything is trade offs, and the real strengths of H3 are high power strokes that do not bottom out and decent short game linearity. Neither of those things are very valuable to beginners. What is usually valuable to beginners is easy spin and speed and those things are easier with other rubbers.

When we coach, we often coach for how we want the student to play when their game is complete, not how they play today. So yes, even kids can use H3 as they are being trained for their tomorrow game. But if someone asked me where to go with their game given my experiences and knowledge, at the levels most of us play, there is no real benefit in H3 other than personal preference once a person has solid strokes.

TT4Life · May 13, 2016

U PUT IN WHAT YOU PUT OUT, SO PUT IN AS MUCH AS YOU CAN

IMPOSSIBLE IS NOTHING LOLZ

Jabugo · May 13, 2016

NextLevel said:
OP can use H3 Neo effectively. I can use H3 Neo effectively. 1200 Rated Knife (his nickname) has commented on how much he likes H3 Neo. And H3 Neo is not traditional Hurricane either.

Using it effectively is not the same thing as saying that it is what you should be using or it is optimal for you or that your preferred technique is suited for it, or there aren't other rubbers that can support such technique easily. Optimal is a dangerous word when speaking about TT equipment, but I would be very surprised if your friend, unless he developed a very strong short game with H3Neo, got to a higher level of play and didn't see the benefits in switching to something else. In TT, everything is trade offs, and the real strengths of H3 are high power strokes that do not bottom out and decent short game linearity. Neither of those things are very valuable to beginners. What is usually valuable to beginners is easy spin and speed and those things are easier with other rubbers.

When we coach, we often coach for how we want the student to play when their game is complete, not how they play today. So yes, even kids can use H3 as they are being trained for their tomorrow game. But if someone asked me where to go with their game given my experiences and knowledge, at the levels most of us play, there is no real benefit in H3 other than personal preference once a person has solid strokes.

I see what you're saying. My friend's coach and her colleagues do play with very high powered strokes where as you say H3 neo works well for their style. But for my friend, it may not be the case for him since he's a beginner. It might benefit him to explore some other types of rubber that might facilitate his learning more easily. In other words, he might be at an even higher level now if not hindered by H3 neo. Thank you for your insight.

laistrogian · May 14, 2016

Hridoy said:
Thanks NextLevel UpSideDownCarl laistrogian anchorschmidt & Jabugo.
Now I get it. As far as I know, there is no opportunity for boost rubbers in my country and no other players or coaches don't know how to deal with chinese rubbers. So, I think I should change my rubber. I want to go for Rakza 7 or Rakza 7 Soft. Is it too advance for me or I should go for another Vega Pro?

I've never really tried R7 or R7 Soft but you could always go with another vega pro. I probably could recommend evolution MX-P but given the fact stradivarius is a touch-and-go blade, I don't know if you will like a setup that fast

NextLevel · May 14, 2016

Jabugo said:
I see what you're saying. My friend's coach and her colleagues do play with very high powered strokes where as you say H3 neo works well for their style. But for my friend, it may not be the case for him since he's a beginner. It might benefit him to explore some other types of rubber that might facilitate his learning more easily. In other words, he might be at an even higher level now if not hindered by H3 neo. Thank you for your insight.

Yes. You are also 100% correct that a coach will teach a beginner to use it well, and in general, it will support certain good habits but it will always make it harder to get spin and speed but the control compensates. Many coaches just teach students how they were taught, BTW.

The most important thing is that your friend is getting good coaching. I used tacky stuff and I liked some things it did for my stroke discipline. But once you have good technique, you have to decide whether you like to swing all the time or not. And even if you do, there are some compromises (I think the rubber I use is one of them, and there are others with harder sponges like Omega V Asia or MX-S or M1 Turbo) that may make your life easier if you are willing to give up some control for easier spin and speed. Of course, I personally would not use them on a Joola Carbon but everryone is different.

NextLevel · May 14, 2016

Hridoy said:
Thanks NextLevel UpSideDownCarl laistrogian anchorschmidt & Jabugo.
Now I get it. As far as I know, there is no opportunity for boost rubbers in my country and no other players or coaches don't know how to deal with chinese rubbers. So, I think I should change my rubber. I want to go for Rakza 7 or Rakza 7 Soft. Is it too advance for me or I should go for another Vega Pro?

They are all in the same class but using the same rubber on both sides has done advantages as you will understand your stroke and contact depth on both sides easily so I would recommend that.

Need Suggestion for DHS H3 NEO

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