Daily Table Tennis Chit Chat

@Der/@monster,

Speedy and safe recovery, although speedy means not for you to be 80% recovered and get back into the thick of things! Fully recover please! monster, when you are fully recovered, I will then request 9 points handicap from you ;-)

@NL,

Congratulations Sir! A win is a win. Trust you analyzed your wins as well as your losses to see what needs tweaking besides the obvious physical challenges you face/endure.

"Success breeds confidence and confidence breeds success."

Keep at it!

@TWI,

Ack! Sorry Sir to hear about your poor performance.

No matter what, I do not let overconfidence enter my mindset. I treat every opponent the same, as someone better than me and I need to find ways to win points. I also play one point at a time, with my unstable skills during matchplay, it keeps me honest. I do not think of a preconceived outcome. Actually, sorry, I do. I presume I will lose all my games! It's up to me to prove myself wrong!!

I am a better player during practice than when it's gameplay mostly due to 2 weaknesses (footwork - older and slower - been concentrating on strokes more than footwork ... and reading spin which may or may not be from the need to wear glasses and yet I refuse to wear glasses during gameplay).

I believe tchooing is a huge part of your game from your games I've watched. Whatever routine you have/use, don't stray from it. It's like when people drink coffee in the morning, but then one day, they don't. They feel something is off but can't identify it. We are creatures of habit. Keep doing what you do when you are playing well. It's like neuro-lingustic programming (NLP) ... you get into a 'state' and you want to stay in that state. Recall your past winning experiences, visualize you doing everything perfectly and easily winning points. See it, feel it, do it... from tchooing to wiping your hands by the net, bouncing the ball a few times before serving, walking in a circle after a point to collect your thoughts, etc. Those are some of your gameplay mannerisms I recall seeing.

And it is always easy for anyone to advise you to relax and have fun, but they are not you and they are not playing that match. We are our worst enemies. Table tennis IMO is 75% (if not more) mental than physical. Just remember to actively breathe. Take a moment to calm your mind. Breathe. Only play when you are ready.

Glad you were able to reflect somewhat on the matches despite lack of videos. Better luck next time in all facets of your game!

thanks OSP for your kind advice.

its important to see what i did wrong as well, not to do it again I will be more honest next time. thats the good thing with TT. There is (hopefully) always a next time pretty quickly !!

I think We often know alot of tabletennis But is hard to feel What you are doing so it is good to film yourself. I am thinking about doing that everytime. Will try to so it next time. Little afraid that i Will find alot of things to change. Already have to much at the moment.

I played 2 matches tonight and didn't think of taking video of them. Lost both 3 straight, but I am playing a little better. Still rushing my shots here and there but also slowed down at times. My FH loop is somewhat back, lately been playing to force myself to FH loop. Also pushing more to set up the FH loop. My left knee is not 100% but I need to lose some weight I've gained from the winter hibernation LOL

I was practicing with a partner who is recovering from an injury. About 2 or 3 weeks ago, we practiced and our BH to BH was flowing well. Tonight it was a so-so practice unlike our previous session. After perhaps 10 mins, I recall video'ing our practice. Ugly practice session recorded to video.

I do not know why I started rushing myself. Perhaps it was because I know I'm on video LOL

Apologize for the bad angle. Phone was placed inside a locker. I'm wearing blue with my back to the phone/camera. Behind me is a row of lockers. Raw video of ~9 mins with one pause to switch angles of phone from FH to BH. FYI, to my left is the Olympic weight lifting area. Sometimes hard to concentrate during matchplay when the lifters drop their weight LOL


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K90H_dVU_GU


For the past year, I've been trying to meet the ball earlier with my FH. I see from this video, sometimes I am not doing this consistently yet. Although I am meeting the ball earlier compared to my FH stroke from 32 years ago but video doesn't lie, at least to my eyes.

0:00-4:30 FH flat hit, ~0:53 after 1-3 flat hits, I start looping

4:31-9:32 RPB - mostly RPB punches, some RPB blocks ... i started RPB looping towards the end before my friend said time's up.

(7:40 - RPB flat hit)

In hindsight, I was nervous because I knew I was on video LOL at me. Will do my best to remember to video some matches and relax when practicing if video'ing.

I welcome any comments. Thank you in advance.

~osph

OldschoolPenholder said:

I played 2 matches tonight and didn't think of taking video of them. Lost both 3 straight, but I am playing a little better. Still rushing my shots here and there but also slowed down at times. My FH loop is somewhat back, lately been playing to force myself to FH loop. Also pushing more to set up the FH loop. My left knee is not 100% but I need to lose some weight I've gained from the winter hibernation LOL

I was practicing with a partner who is recovering from an injury. About 2 or 3 weeks ago, we practiced and our BH to BH was flowing well. Tonight it was a so-so practice unlike our previous session. After perhaps 10 mins, I recall video'ing our practice. Ugly practice session recorded to video.

I do not know why I started rushing myself. Perhaps it was because I know I'm on video LOL

Apologize for the bad angle. Phone was placed inside a locker. I'm wearing blue with my back to the phone/camera. Behind me is a row of lockers. Raw video of ~9 mins with one pause to switch angles of phone from FH to BH. FYI, to my left is the Olympic weight lifting area. Sometimes hard to concentrate during matchplay when the lifters drop their weight LOL


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K90H_dVU_GU

For the past year, I've been trying to meet the ball earlier with my FH. I see from this video, sometimes I am not doing this consistently yet. Although I am meeting the ball earlier compared to my FH stroke from 32 years ago but video doesn't lie, at least to my eyes.

0:00-4:30 FH flat hit, ~0:53 after 1-3 flat hits, I start looping

4:21-9:32 RPB - mostly RPB punches, some RPB blocks ... i started RPB looping towards the end before my friend said time's up.

(7:40 - RPB flat hit)

In hindsight, I was nervous because I knew I was on video LOL at me. Will do my best to remember to video some matches and relax when practicing if video'ing.

I welcome any comments. Thank you in advance.

~osph

Click to expand...

I rarely ever analyze anything other than footwork and body rotation from the back. Hard to make serious comments about your technique from this camera angle.

NextLevel said:

I rarely ever analyze anything other than footwork and body rotation from the back. Hard to make serious comments about your technique from this camera angle.

Click to expand...

Totally understand Sir. My friend left for the night and I didn't think to video earlier when she was still there.

I would incorporate some relaxing "pre" motions before serve and receive to get the nervous energy out of the system ...
e.g before receiving serve do something like He Zhiwen does where he a quick on the spot waddling motion ( for want of a better description ) to get his legs moving and shakes his hand to relax the forearm and may be focus on breathing .... and something similar before serving .. this might help you to get out of the "rushing" habit .. .

OldschoolPenholder said:

Totally understand Sir. My friend left for the night and I didn't think to video earlier when she was still there.

Click to expand...

@OSP
like NL said the angle is not very good

I'll just make one point from that video:
Please count how many times you miss with your FH when you see your RIGHT foot finishing forward after the swing
When you finish the swing you should have your weight on your left foot which is not possible if your right foot goes forward.

It means your FH swing is too much forward. while it should finish more like 11 - 11:30 o'clock.
To help you try to think about finishing your swing with only the toes of your left foot (lifting your heel) touching the soil, and bending a little bit forward your left knee, and think about finishing not forward but 11.

also I think open a little bit more your wrist when you play FH

So I had my last 2 coaching sessions before the school I go to shuts down.

Famous Sakamoto last words to me: (as I remember them)
"TT is NOT about power, its about technique and timing. With good timing you can do anything. Be relaxed."

Coach K from same school:
"to get better at TT, you have to practice and practice regularly. There is no secret"

I have some thought about blocking. Our chinese coach told me that when i block passive i want to take the ball before the highest point, at the bounce otherwise the ball will be to high and soft. But when i am aggressive and do a harder block i can take the ball at the highest point. This is very logically but i have not thought about it before, proably because i always have been pretty aggressive. Now i tried to just block and try to take it at the bounce(uppstuds in swedish).

But how do i do it?

I have tried to have the racket higher all the time when i am blocking, because i do not need to drop the racket down because it is already power and spin in the ball, and i will loose alot of time. I think this works well. But when i have the racket higher the ball get to bounce higher before i block so it becomes higher. I think the best option is to angle down and push the ball down more but it will still not be very low i think. The ball will be the lowest if i take it at the bounce, but then i either have the racket lower and i think this is bad, loose time and harder to go over the ball or stand closer to the table but i think i am to tall for this so i need to jump back and that is not really an option.

So what do you guys think? have the racket somewhere inbetween and try to push the ball down more and get it low?

No one is gunna catch Der_Echte advising Lula who is several levels better player... and the question Lula posing is for 2400+ level loops. Those have a lot more energy than the ones most of us experience.

I can add some input about blocking though. Right off the bounce, the ball has the maximum vertical energy, so only pretty much needing forward energy for aggressive block. Soft hand, off bounce, tiny forward stroke gives the faster block, which is really a small counter loop.

So many ways to block. They are all easier off the bounce.

I see a lot of high level players in training block the way Lula describes... allow ball to come higher than net, punch down and forward. That produces the kind of block you see in training continuous bang loops/block drill. That isn't much of a match shot though.


Experiment with your grip (loose) and get close to the bounce as you can, this offers easier control with a positive tiny stroke. Covering the ball and making the loose grip tiny stroke forward keeps the ball down more than trying CPR to keep the ball down.

I think everyone can give advice to everyone. Not about the playing level. I tried some today, i think the best option is to have the racket high, push down more and maybe try to close the angle of the racket more. I agree that holding loosely is important.

I am almost more of a coach nowdays compared to being a player. I try to be as fair as possible and give everyone a chance. I have come to the conclusions that you need to have luck to have the possiblity to become really good. Need to have a good coach. A coach that know some stuff and are motivated to help everyone.

I have also through my tabletennisjourney notice that everyone do not get the same chance, and i do not find that fair, and sometimes even a bit disgusting. I had one coach that mostly helped his son and did almost not care about anyone else. In another club i trained in had one of the biggest swedish stars right now, but at the moment he was young and not so good. But his father was the president in the club so he only trained with much much better players. I have a hard time for this behaviour, help the ones you know at the cost of other. And nobody did anything!

How should players, parents and other coaches act if this happens for them? I do not think this stuff is fair, and i am happy that they become so good players, but it was very wrong against us other that even was better players but did not get the same treatment. Like i said, as a coach i try to be as fair as possible, but maybe your answers can help other young players that are to afraid at saying anything to adult in a power position.

Maybe no one cares about this, but i have a very hard time when things get unfair so i had to get this out of the system.

Me and mart1nandersson had a little session on Friday. This drill's setup is Martin would make 3 loops then get the ball to his bh and chop, and then open play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bal8hzwPa3Q&feature=youtu.be

RidTheKid said:

Me and mart1nandersson had a little session on Friday. This drill's setup is Martin would make 3 loops then get the ball to his bh and chop, and then open play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bal8hzwPa3Q&feature=youtu.be

Click to expand...

Funny that you guys play together! Did not realise that you guys knew eachother. So Martin si the defender and you the other Guy?

I Will watch this while eating breakfast.

It's a strange coincidence, we live in the same area without knowing Yes, he has LP (red) on his bh.

Lula said:

Funny that you guys play together! Did not realise that you guys knew eachother. So Martin si the defender and you the other Guy?

I Will watch this while eating breakfast.

Click to expand...

Lula said:

I think everyone can give advice to everyone. Not about the playing level. I tried some today, i think the best option is to have the racket high, push down more and maybe try to close the angle of the racket more. I agree that holding loosely is important.

I am almost more of a coach nowdays compared to being a player. I try to be as fair as possible and give everyone a chance. I have come to the conclusions that you need to have luck to have the possiblity to become really good. Need to have a good coach. A coach that know some stuff and are motivated to help everyone.

I have also through my tabletennisjourney notice that everyone do not get the same chance, and i do not find that fair, and sometimes even a bit disgusting. I had one coach that mostly helped his son and did almost not care about anyone else. In another club i trained in had one of the biggest swedish stars right now, but at the moment he was young and not so good. But his father was the president in the club so he only trained with much much better players. I have a hard time for this behaviour, help the ones you know at the cost of other. And nobody did anything!

How should players, parents and other coaches act if this happens for them? I do not think this stuff is fair, and i am happy that they become so good players, but it was very wrong against us other that even was better players but did not get the same treatment. Like i said, as a coach i try to be as fair as possible, but maybe your answers can help other young players that are to afraid at saying anything to adult in a power position.

Maybe no one cares about this, but i have a very hard time when things get unfair so i had to get this out of the system.

Click to expand...

If it's supposed to be a group coaching sessions, then I agree that everyone should get equal treatment.

But, I'd argue that the way to overcome your scenario is through 1 to 1 coaching. I don't think anyone gets to a very high level without this, and if you are having 1 to 1 coaching, you don't need to worry about the other players.

In pretty much every club I've ever played in, the better players generally play with each other - Very rarely will you see a much lower player play with a high level player - In part, because the gap in ability is just too large, and people want to maximise their time (training with good players).

In group situations, the best way to be fair (in my opinion), is just to let the kids play with each other, and don't get involved in that side of things.

Show them the drills, advise them when you see something wrong, and walk around everyone.

To me, that is the perfect "group" coach.

If you spend too long with one individual, it ruins it for the others (as you've said).

NDH said:

If it's supposed to be a group coaching sessions, then I agree that everyone should get equal treatment.

But, I'd argue that the way to overcome your scenario is through 1 to 1 coaching. I don't think anyone gets to a very high level without this, and if you are having 1 to 1 coaching, you don't need to worry about the other players.

In pretty much every club I've ever played in, the better players generally play with each other - Very rarely will you see a much lower player play with a high level player - In part, because the gap in ability is just too large, and people want to maximise their time (training with good players).

In group situations, the best way to be fair (in my opinion), is just to let the kids play with each other, and don't get involved in that side of things.

Show them the drills, advise them when you see something wrong, and walk around everyone.

To me, that is the perfect "group" coach.

If you spend too long with one individual, it ruins it for the others (as you've said).

Click to expand...

Do not like doing private sessions. Feels like it is only guys with money that can become better then. But it would be really good for me to earn some more money.

Yes i try to do that, i go table from table. But i have started doing a little that the guys that do not listen well, focus or figth well i will give less attention.

I think i am doing a very good job to be fair, maybe because i am "injuried" from this since i was a player. I was thining more how the club, players and parents should treat this kind of problem when a person in a power position treat the guys that are family better at others expense. I feel a bit grumpy when i watch good young players. Many have worked hard but i also think many times they got unfair advantages due to a parent that is suppose to treat everyone alike as a coach or a president.

RidTheKid said:

Me and mart1nandersson had a little session on Friday. This drill's setup is Martin would make 3 loops then get the ball to his bh and chop, and then open play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bal8hzwPa3Q&feature=youtu.be

Click to expand...

Seems to be a good drill! you guys had good focus and worked hard! I was worried about the health of the defender at the end, he looked tired haha.

I feel a bit like a besserwisser when i comment on peoples technique, but it mostly that i want to help people and that i am interesting in technique.

I think the defender should try to accelerate more, snap with his forearm, now his is almost pushing the arm forward so he is not getting the benefit from forearm. He will get more power, and especially spin if he uses the forearm more. Try to have it almost extended and loose then snap it together.

He could also try when he swing the arm back to rotate at the same time with the stomach and move the weight of the feet. The kids i coach do not like this explanation but i think it is excellent. It is almost like a door with three hinges, when you open the door the hinges move all togehter. The hinge at the top is the arm, then the stomach and at last the legs. He will get more controll because the stroke will get "bigger", harder to have control and do the same stroke all the time if you just move the arm. He will also have a better possiblity to loop harder since he get power from the body.

I do not know soo much about chopping but i have played a pretty good defender for over ten years so i know something. From the sound of it, i think he have a long pimple without grip and without sponge. He should try another long pimple if he wants to play that far away from the table. I also think, like with the forehand, he should try to use the body more and doing a longer swing with the arm. The longer the stroke is with the body and arm, the longer contact you will have with the ball and the more controll. To hard to do the same stroke and have controll with the short stroke he have now without body. When he miss it is also i think not due to the stroke being terrible wrong, it is more about that he do not move well enough. If he do the correct stroke but stand wrong he will miss. You need very good footwork as a defender. The guy i am training with have problem with that if the ball comes shorter he do not move well enough, and reach for the ball and chop, this will cause the ball to be high.

For the offensive guy, he did not really do much haha. But he had nice placement when he tried to kill the ball. Maybe he do not need to play hard every ball either when it is free. When you play a better defender it is almost better for them if you play the ball hard because then they do not need to move so much.

Keep on posting videos! Glad påsk!

Thanks for the feedback Lula!

I’ve actually tried to shorten the FH swing after getting feedback from Robban at Spårvägen.

I’m pretty much clueless when it comes to LP. I’m using Grass Dtecs 0.6mm. I tried a grippy LP (Feint Long 3) but it was soooo slow. It was close to impossible to do any kind of offensive strokes like BH smashing / hitting / side swiping. I’m quite happy with the LP progress as I only started using 1-2 months ago.

Lula said:

I have some thought about blocking. Our chinese coach told me that when i block passive i want to take the ball before the highest point, at the bounce otherwise the ball will be to high and soft. But when i am aggressive and do a harder block i can take the ball at the highest point. This is very logically but i have not thought about it before, proably because i always have been pretty aggressive. Now i tried to just block and try to take it at the bounce(uppstuds in swedish).

But how do i do it?

I have tried to have the racket higher all the time when i am blocking, because i do not need to drop the racket down because it is already power and spin in the ball, and i will loose alot of time. I think this works well. But when i have the racket higher the ball get to bounce higher before i block so it becomes higher. I think the best option is to angle down and push the ball down more but it will still not be very low i think. The ball will be the lowest if i take it at the bounce, but then i either have the racket lower and i think this is bad, loose time and harder to go over the ball or stand closer to the table but i think i am to tall for this so i need to jump back and that is not really an option.

So what do you guys think? have the racket somewhere inbetween and try to push the ball down more and get it low?

Click to expand...

I don't believe there is anything like passive blocking especially with modern equipment. There is soft blocking and there is hard blocking and both involve fairly active strokes. To block very passively, you need soft rubber and a guarantee that the ball will compress the sponge which only happens if the loop has the right quality. But even them because of spin, most good players will push into the ball a little even if you can't see it. If you take it at the bounce, you will usually be playing a semi-topspin block because being passive and flat will be very risky. This is my opinion and I can be wrong of course.