Daily Table Tennis Chit Chat

Takkyu_wa_inochi said:

had a mini tournament. It wasn't a great result for me. Not surprising. I skipped my jogging twice in a row. played only on Tuesday so far this week and it was sh*t... won 2 lost 2, but one I lost 1-3, is the kind of game that I should be able to win whatever it takes, even on a so-so day to get to the next level. The guy played a good match, i had a bit of pressure as I was the slight favourite to win. I missed too many receives when under pressure, and I served badly throughout the match. Footwork was so-so given the lack of form. -8 +12 -6 -12 is the final score :-( i saved 2 match points and had 2 set points in the last game, but i blew it...

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Sorry to hear Sir, get them next time!

My new weapons of choice. $80 for blade,
$30 per rubber. Result is priceless.

Excellent choice

NextLevel said:

I tried the long 5. The problem is that the head is too big for what I am trying to do and it feels too soft as limba is too dwelly. Of course given I used d welly stuff for a long time, this is silly but I mean it. The bigger head is the real issue - I want something that lets me get more creative with wrist on my forehand as I have accepted that my stroke is always going to have relative issues because of my knees and I need to compensate with my hand and wrist action.

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Do you still prefer the Vega Pro blade over the Vega Euro if you’re looking to move away from limba?

OhWell said:

Do you still prefer the Vega Pro blade over the Vega Euro if you’re looking to move away from limba?

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Good question which we may never know the answer to since getting away from the larger head size of the Vega Series was a part of this switch.

I like the grip tape job... will provide better leverage and whip on strokes.

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Since I can't move, trying to build a stroke that takes the ball earlier. My recovery isn't good though that might be the drill speed. Comments welcome (don't worry, I won't defend myself, just looking to see if anything anyone recommends can help).

NL,

I think you have pretty much optimized what you can do for a FH hit or topspin without moving much. You have good consistency and decent power.

You have a wide stance and are tall, so you have a wide hitting zone.

I think you could take ball deeper in zone and still have power.

A few things you can still do for more power or variation of the ball is to...

1) Use more of a short hip. You are using some, but you could use the hips a little more to generate kinetic energy to later transfer force to the ball. You do this already and it is barely perceptable... the movement is a very short smooth saddened movement of his, almost a jerk, but smoother, still sudden.

2) Firm up grip right at impact after everything being loose. The firming will really add force multiplication factor to your impact, I suspect you do some of this already. You could also reduce grip pressure at impact to produce a slower ball. This is good for where you know you are about to hit it out... or for when you barely get to a ball.

3) Use some more shoulder. You keep shoulders loose, and before impact, you pull back your free arm like you are pulling a rip cord, but keep shoulder loose. This will cause shoulders to turn and hit ball to cross court. It will add 10% of power and some spin to your shot.

Der_Echte said:

2) Firm up grip right at impact after everything being loose. The firming will really add force multiplication factor to your impact, I suspect you do some of this already. You could also reduce grip pressure at impact to produce a slower ball. This is good for where you know you are about to hit it out... or for when you barely get to a ball.

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Hey Der Echte,

I have a question about firming up grip at impact. If done properly, how is this supposed to affect wrist movement during the stroke? Is the idea to firm up before, only at the beginning, or throughout the wrist snapping motion? When executed properly, is firming up the wrist supposed to help accelerate the wrist snap, or are they somewhat independent?

Thanks!

NextLevel said:

S just looking to see if anything anyone recommends can help).

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NL, I don't play at your level, but play penhold, at the table, so am always working on taking balls early. I note that top female players who play close carry their free hand higher than away from the table players, sometimes lifting more just at the moment of the hit. Your free hand hangs lower than most, so maybe exaggerate and experiment with holding it hand up from the elbow to see if that subtly impacts rotation and speed?

Looking good Sir!

Seeing this video reminded me of something in my SH stroking ... wasn't sure if it was the smaller racket or just my PH brain not grasping (pun intended) the SH grip... my index finger is more vertical than horizontal. Seeing NL's partner reminded me that this past weds when I hit for 1 hr, my SH grip - the index finger is finally more horizontal than vertical.

NextLevel said:

Since I can't move, trying to build a stroke that takes the ball earlier. My recovery isn't good though that might be the drill speed. Comments welcome (don't worry, I won't defend myself, just looking to see if anything anyone recommends can help).

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You might get better whip action by keeping your shoulder and elbow more relaxed at the beginning of the forward swing. I think you often tense up a moment earlier than necessary, so that you tend to push your forearm into the upward snap rather than whipping it.

OhWell said:

Hey Der Echte,

I have a question about firming up grip at impact. If done properly, how is this supposed to affect wrist movement during the stroke? Is the idea to firm up before, only at the beginning, or throughout the wrist snapping motion? When executed properly, is firming up the wrist supposed to help accelerate the wrist snap, or are they somewhat independent?

Thanks!

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Firming up the wrist right at impact is a way to deliver more rebound... and loosening it at impact will cause less rebound.

R. Dewitt on East Coast in USA is a Master at the latter during rallies... you see his arm move and think the ball will come sooner/harder, but it doesn't. Control of grip pressure at impact can affect how the ball rebounds, on both active shots and also on shots where you just get bat to the ball and no swing. Grip pressure is real important in blocking too, variations produce a different ball, sometimes you want soft when opponent is off the table, sometimes a firm grip to add speed without a visible stroke.

Grip pressure at impact is a very mis-understood often ignored, but very crucial part of impact dynamics.

I know you are all crazy about the world cup now, but I got this nice footage from our 1st league (2nd best), where I caught this great rally at 16:44 or so, where after around the net shot the player comes up with a swap hand!

Der_Echte said:

Firming up the wrist right at impact is a way to deliver more rebound... and loosening it at impact will cause less rebound.

R. Dewitt on East Coast in USA is a Master at the latter during rallies... you see his arm move and think the ball will come sooner/harder, but it doesn't. Control of grip pressure at impact can affect how the ball rebounds, on both active shots and also on shots where you just get bat to the ball and no swing. Grip pressure is real important in blocking too, variations produce a different ball, sometimes you want soft when opponent is off the table, sometimes a firm grip to add speed without a visible stroke.

Grip pressure at impact is a very mis-understood often ignored, but very crucial part of impact dynamics.

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Thanks! Will look into Dewitt!

@Oh Well...

I say the firming is at impact, so it doesn't stop the wrist from its proper movement.

A loose grip and muscles throughout the chain sequence of tiny explosions is vital. Tightening up too early stops this efficiency. It will sap power and spin. It will lower your quality. It will lower landing percentage. It will lower lethality of your shot. It will also put you in a wheelchair early.

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this is me playing last week.

i'm not happy at all about my performance. I think i played at my average or slightly below my average. I wasn't in very good physical form but I was fighting. Obviously I'm very nervous, and serve/receive is particularly bad compared to usual. Also, I realize i still cannot correct what i think is my major problem: my upper body is too upright. I KNOW i have to do something about it, but there is no progress at all. I would also like to use counter on wide FH more often than just blocking. I've taken bad habits recently (I used to use counter more often)

The other guy is performing well. But I would like to be able to beat this kind of guys whatever it takes even on a bad day.

TWI,

He wins as he manages the game better than you, and he has better shots and overall skill level.

You get some points from your athleticism that surprises him. but most of the match, you pissed away points like old beer and made his job very easy.

On serve receive, throughout the match, you tried some very over-aggressive, poor biomechanic form low percentage rip returns - you missed nearly every one of them. Until you learn to see the ball better (the spin and its bounce - AND use a shorter stroke) you will continue to needlessly give away precious points on receive. I am not saying pushing, but be SMARTER and more tactically intelligent about your receives.

So, if one does not attack, what can one do? A lot. If you change location on pushes and push deep primarily to where opponent will begin to piss away points, that is better. Look at what you did at 24:38 of the vid late in game 4... even though your return quality was very poor (high, not very spinny) the placement was golden. Opponent was slow like Snorlax to move around the ball - have attacked and missed horribly - he gave you a free point... and you didn't have to work very hard for it.

This kind of seeing what opponent does and not does is important, so is noticing foot position and tendencies.

Your opening topspin is not very good quality - you do not whip very well or at least not very consistently in a match. You commit, but are out of time, off zone, or too stiff. You gave away so many points this way. Still, some of your topspins showed you can do it. Look at 15:42 - you move to position, stop, stay loose, and explode upwards and forward - result was a quality topspin that won you the point. You step around and topspin shot emphasizing spin was also successful, even if it was off balance out of zone.

I believe your coach is telling you the right way (rather AN EFFECTIIVE way - there is no ONE right way) He emphasizes spin production and consistency/placement. That is very important at your level.

As for seeing results in a match... not everything you do will show up in a match right away, it can take many months for it to show and be productive in a match.

However, the ability to read an opponent's game, make sound tactical choices, and learn what things to adjust during a match can be applied almost immediately with good effect.

You showed some of that, but not enough vs this opponent. You showed us, that although the opponent is better in almost every way (as measured by strokes and sequences), you showed us that some fight and some wise play can affect this opponent. The times you played it to cause opponent to go for low percentage, you turned the tables on him.

Just got back from a weekend of league as an out of town trouble maker...

We lost our team vs team matchus, but we fought and fought... without or top players.

I lost a singles match 8-10 a better player in 5th set on Sat.

Today, I lost a singles match 1-3 vs a player prolly 3-4 levels better than me, but I fought out a great set to get one. This match would decide which team wins. Lots of hard fought rallies in 3rd game, nothing was dry on me, I was a dripping sweat form of humanity.

What was remarkable was our doubles performance. Due to an acute shortage of players, TT Monster played a singles (vs a player 6 levels better and achieved 7 points in a game) and Monster also teamed up with the team's default doubles player... some trouble maker named Der_Echte. (at least the days he shows up)

We teamed up vs a very unconventional player who nearly won vs our no 1 player, other player was the ex-2300 level player I lost to in singles. We prompty lost the first two games. All opponents did was push ball on return and smash a loose ball if we gave it to them. We pissed away points on serve receive and my oddly poor BH attacking. We vowed in game 3 to correct those two areas and be more consistent. We did.

As game 3 went on, we got more consistent, stop giving away points, and made them work. We also landed better quality attacks. Game 4 I grumbled to go HEAVY on 3rd ball or 4th ball if I could push and get a push back. Monster went full heavy hardly missing any attacks. He baited the other team no 1 to attack to where I was ready to fast block for winner. I also baited the weaker player to go for cross court BH corner when I was parked in FH corner.. I did 2-3 3-4 meter reverse cross-over step quickly to get to ball and pound it BH for winners... all without a visible stroke.

Basically, Monster got real solid as match went on and didn't give up. He was big-time consistent later and steady.

We didn't win the matchup, but we took a match from them to give us a chance to be there. Doubles was epic today. We made the coach of that team want to crap in his shorts.... after we went up 5-0 in game 5 at changeover.