Daily Table Tennis Chit Chat

ttmonster said:

The only way to correctly judge the video of somebody elses level is to make a video of yourself and compare it to the other guys video without ego .... in general for every sport and more so table tennis , things look much more slower and less complicated in video than in real life ... and in table tennis most of the nuances are lost while viewing the video unless you have a very trained eye for watching videos ..

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Will do that video part sooner or later, but i feel it is not gonna tell the whole story or accurate judgement, i may show a video of me, someone will say i a not more than 1400 USATT ranking and someone else will put me in 2000-2200, so i feel video is sometimes is not the only judgement as well, i remember i said once that i played someone twice, first time he won me, and second time i crushed him, so does that mean i was better than him in that second time and he was better than me in first time? i can show a video of myself playing against someone few times, i win sometimes and i lose, so what will this gonna tell you?

I play a lot by my mood, and many times i only play for fun and just not serious, will this be a true judgement then?

Shuki said:

I think he's mixing me up with Carl. Carl posted quite a few videos explaining things to him. But yea you're 100% right, i don't know what level it is that players can see skill level better, or if it's a gradual change. But I noticed in recent thread "weird playing style", a LOT of people on this forum couldn't see how good the blocker was.

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about that "Weird style playing" i didn't judge or comment, but i also say he is a good blocker, at least he can direct most of his blocks or shots, not many can do that and it needs some degree of skills too, even if he lost it doesn't mean he is really bad, but the opponent was that good to figure out his way style and play better against him.

TareqPhoto said:

Will do that video part sooner or later, but i feel it is not gonna tell the whole story or accurate judgement, i may show a video of me, someone will say i a not more than 1400 USATT ranking and someone else will put me in 2000-2200, so i feel video is sometimes is not the only judgement as well, i remember i said once that i played someone twice, first time he won me, and second time i crushed him, so does that mean i was better than him in that second time and he was better than me in first time? i can show a video of myself playing against someone few times, i win sometimes and i lose, so what will this gonna tell you?

I play a lot by my mood, and many times i only play for fun and just not serious, will this be a true judgement then?

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Good players won't misjudge you severely. the ones that say you're something way off from what the good players say don't have the eyes to judge level as well.

Shuki said:

Good players won't misjudge you severely. the ones that say you're something way off from what the good players say don't have the eyes to judge level as well.

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Ah ok, good point.

I'm not sure i understand this

NextLevel said:

You should mostly attack hard to where he is going to play a forehand and push/block to where he is going to play a backhand. (...)

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Regarding chiquita: actually i can do it pretty well in training, the difficult is more about choosing the right ball. Also, so far, i can do it decently only against pendulum serves. Against reverse pendulum, i cannot manage to fight the sidespin. I managed to find a way to topspin it, but only in a straight line, (usually FH side) which is not ideal. Against leftie pendulum serves its even riskier to try to play BH there !

On the other hand, i totally suck at FH flick. i worked quite a lot with my coach ,he explained me the details, but i still don't execute well, the few times i land a good one look always like a small miracle.

As you (?) said, its easier to use wrist action on BH than FH....

Der_Echte said:

Carl, you are not getting the bat acceleration (and the spin) as you are trying to get the fast movement by moving your upper arm forward during the entire stroke. One cannot accelerate this way to well.

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NextLevel said:

It's all in Brett's video on efficient serve mechanics. Carl knows better with his drumstick motion on his hook serve, but for some reason, he isn't applying it here. MAybe it is because his attempt to hold the ball as long as possible is interfering with his mechanics. Holding the ball as long as possible is not the key, getting the right contact depth between ball and rubber/wood is what holds the ball longer. MAny spinny serves are just stabbing motions. You want the ball to be hit so hard that it goes into the wood but not so deep as in a looping motion.

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This is a good point. I can see that I am pretty tense here too. But I am going to have to film a bunch of my pendulum serves from this side angle. See if I can look at what I am doing in the serves that I know have more spin. I have a few motions for the pendulum.

But the hook serve, it really is just natural. I never worked on it. It just is loaded. And I have never been able to translate that much acceleration from my hook into my pendulum. And the hook is really that fast jab contact where the spin comes from how freakin' fast the racket is moving. It is really just the same action I would do on a symbol crash or a snare pop when playing the drums. So it was learned somewhere else and accidentally applied to table tennis.

IMO if a person is asking for help from people, free help at that, via an Internet forum ... then don't come across as a troll first of all ... you will not be taken seriously, and get ignored ... it may take time for the people to forgive you and turn around to help you

Secondly, if people are willing to help and all they ask for is video, not money, and nothing in return other than the sastisfaction of helping a fellow player out ... then by all means supply video ... especially if you, the one asking for help, is not in the same part of the world of the one who is willing to help

Other members have travelled to meet up other members ... but for those asking for help and aren't able to travel to meet the members that are willing to help, it should be a no brainer

To go on about how one is a very, very high-level player and would beat many of those that did post video of themselves, well, I for one would understand how the ones willing to help will ignore that one asking for help

Props and Respect to Carl, Suga D, and Shuki for helping a recent member where others have already pegged him as a troll and on ignore

Props and Respect to NextLevel, Der_Echte, Carl, Suga D, Shuki, Takkyu_wa_inochi and others who continually help others out with nothing I return other than heartfelt appreciation.

Shuki said:

Tareq, I also want to apologize. If you feel I've been making fun of you that's completely my fault and I should have been more conscious as to how what I said would make you feel. In my head it was playful teasing, but a bully never considers themselves a bully.

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Sometimes, my friend, you can't and shouldn't stop the darkness.

UpSideDownCarl said:

This is a good point. I can see that I am pretty tense here too. But I am going to have to film a bunch of my pendulum serves from this side angle. See if I can look at what I am doing in the serves that I know have more spin. I have a few motions for the pendulum.

But the hook serve, it really is just natural. I never worked on it. It just is loaded. And I have never been able to translate that much acceleration from my hook into my pendulum. And the hook is really that fast jab contact where the spin comes from how freakin' fast the racket is moving. It is really just the same action I would do on a symbol crash or a snare pop when playing the drums. So it was learned somewhere else and accidentally applied to table tennis.

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Then turn your arm upside down and do the hook serve and that is your pendulum serve.

Takkyu_wa_inochi said:

I'm not sure i understand this



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Regarding chiquita: actually i can do it pretty well in training, the difficult is more about choosing the right ball. Also, so far, i can do it decently only against pendulum serves. Against reverse pendulum, i cannot manage to fight the sidespin. I managed to find a way to topspin it, but only in a straight line, (usually FH side) which is not ideal. Against leftie pendulum serves its even riskier to try to play BH there !

On the other hand, i totally suck at FH flick. i worked quite a lot with my coach ,he explained me the details, but i still don't execute well, the few times i land a good one look always like a small miracle.

As you (?) said, its easier to use wrist action on BH than FH....

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The opponent has a consistent forehand opener and no backhand opener though he has an okay backhand block. In that case, usually I recommend that one should push to the backhand and go with power to the forehand as the forehand is usually a stroke for such players that requires a wind up to play. You know him better than we all do obviously, but his lack of a backhand opener is what you should build your strategy around for now until he fixes it as all you had to do on many points to win was to make a good block to the wide forehand after he opened from the backhand side with his forehand. But maybe he has a backhand opener which he did not show in the video. He counterlooped one forehand off a slow ball in position but that was about it.

Yah, reverse is tough to chiquita, but you can send it back to the backhand side if you contact the left side of the ball and finish towards the right side of the table almost as if you are going round the front of the ball - it is almost like a chiquita - you start with your racket almost parallel to the left side of the table. IT's one of those things you just keep trying until your brain accepts what has to be done. Sometimes, I can find it hard to track the ball and time it. But usually, when I have a rubber with some control, I do it pretty easily.

As for the wrist action, I was speaking about your loops in general, but maybe your chiquita has more wrist action than your loops showed in the video. For the forehand flick for me, it is baby steps - it is a relatively flat stroke unless you want to play it with some sidespin or light topspin so it is not easy unless you read the ball well. I play the TTEdge app and the guy I like the best in the app for his forehand flick is Trevor Brown so that is the one I copy. I usually flick like a snail, but what I have realized is that the most important thing is to have the form correct. It has gotten better slowly and it is going to continue to get better. But in general, I just use whip mechanics there. What I meant is that you have good body usage but you don't apply whip mechanics on your forehand loop. It could easily be a higher quality shot with far less effort.

For me , I just have better ball feeling on inside out serves than pendulum , I honestly don't know for sure but some how my guess is that it has to do with the way we toss the ball and rotate into the serve , its all in the same direction , in pedulum serve actually the motion is away from the ball / rotation of the body and we are sort of forcing it to align , thats why even in pendulum when I try to go under the ball and pull up much like how schlager shows it I have better feeling ... than the regular way that is taught in serve basics ...

UpSideDownCarl said:

This is a good point. I can see that I am pretty tense here too. But I am going to have to film a bunch of my pendulum serves from this side angle. See if I can look at what I am doing in the serves that I know have more spin. I have a few motions for the pendulum.

But the hook serve, it really is just natural. I never worked on it. It just is loaded. And I have never been able to translate that much acceleration from my hook into my pendulum. And the hook is really that fast jab contact where the spin comes from how freakin' fast the racket is moving. It is really just the same action I would do on a symbol crash or a snare pop when playing the drums. So it was learned somewhere else and accidentally applied to table tennis.

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@NextLevel

I guess you mean to say that it's better to learn the right way now instead of learning the wrong way then unlearning it.

unlearning is a much more difficult proposition in a reflex/reaction/feeling based sport like table tennis ...

Archosaurus said:

@NextLevel

I guess you mean to say that it's better to learn the right way now instead of learning the wrong way then unlearning it.

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My coach describes teaching as this:

You're drawing a player on a piece of paper, you don't draw it all at once. Now players that don't get coaching aren't drawn right. so you have to keep erasing and trying to make the drawing the way it's supposed to look.

would you rather draw a table tennis player from scratch, or draw a on a piece of paper that's already been drawn on. one where you have to erase the original drawing bit by bit as you draw what you'd like.

OldschoolPenholder said:

IMO if a person is asking for help from people, free help at that, via an Internet forum ... then don't come across as a troll first of all ... you will not be taken seriously, and get ignored ... it may take time for the people to forgive you and turn around to help you

Secondly, if people are willing to help and all they ask for is video, not money, and nothing in return other than the sastisfaction of helping a fellow player out ... then by all means supply video ... especially if you, the one asking for help, is not in the same part of the world of the one who is willing to help

Other members have travelled to meet up other members ... but for those asking for help and aren't able to travel to meet the members that are willing to help, it should be a no brainer

To go on about how one is a very, very high-level player and would beat many of those that did post video of themselves, well, I for one would understand how the ones willing to help will ignore that one asking for help

Props and Respect to Carl, Suga D, and Shuki for helping a recent member where others have already pegged him as a troll and on ignore

Props and Respect to NextLevel, Der_Echte, Carl, Suga D, Shuki, Takkyu_wa_inochi and others who continually help others out with nothing I return other than heartfelt appreciation.

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That are some touching words, Sir.
Thank you for the acknowledgement.
Actually I'm just trying to give back what has been given to me...

But i guess a video or two of me are long overdue.
I have to work on that.

Did I actually already mention how much i love being part of this forum?

Christopher Wallace aka the Notorious B.I.G. aka Biggie Smalls said:

Well if you don't know, know you know

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Boogar said:

Very interesting posts!

I also have problems against reverse pendulum or tomahawk serves into the backhand. I never geg good contact with the chiquita, as the spin lets the ball brake away from the blade into the body.
The only measure i have is to do a strawberry flick into his FH. Strangely i could only do the starwberry flip before i learned the chiquita. So what could i do to counter this serve? My idea would be to bursh more over the top and hit the ball into the wide BH. What do you do?

@NL do you mean the strawberry flip with your explanation? Where you go from left to right behind the ball with the bat head pointing upwards?

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No, I meant brush more over the ball from the left front and put the ball into the wide backhand - it might not get there but at least it is the safer option with power as there is more table. Reverse serve into the backhand with heavy spin is designed to be hard to spin to the wide forehand with power which is why backhand players like it - putting it into the forehand tends to pop up the ball. They limit the table that way. Pivoters or forehand players tend to prefer the pendulum.

Played a bit today then came home early. Was too tired to even properly bend my knees, so I am not gonna waste time ingraining bad footwork habits.



I've been following that one table tennis anime I posted here months ago. Yeah that one.

Looks like they're using pro games as reference in some shots. I just can't help but feel that this looks so funny.


https://s1.webmshare.com/aD7Og.webm

You need to copy this into the URL box btw, seems like they have anti-hotlink protection.

My primary wide lens camera is damaged - I took it to the repair shop and they told me they could not fix it this week so I have to make do with my backup which has a narrower view of the table and needs more distance from the table to capture anything.

I finally switched to Nexy Karis 100%, though I have one T80 set up still built together - I am playing mostly with the M+ version but I have also set up the M version on a flare handle yesterday and will see which I prefer. If you want to understand what Karis was designed to achieve, you can read some Nexy articles on rubber history. What I like is the consistency of the feel and how it supports my brush looping mindset in both hard and soft sponge. All of a sudden, my over the table backhand topspins are back. Maybe if BH Man sponsors[SUP]bribes[/SUP] me, I can use Nexy Gear.

Working on adjusting to the Butterfly G40+ ball ahead of Friday.

Suga D said:

That are some touching words, Sir.
Thank you for the acknowledgement.
Actually I'm just trying to give back what has been given to me...

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But i guess a video or two of me are long overdue.
I have to work on that.

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Anxiously awaiting your video so i may ask for a 9 pts handicap from you too ;-)