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    Thread: Elbow Pain

    1. Top | #41
      tropical is offline
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      Quote Originally Posted by rogerino75 View Post
      OK. I will try to describe them. I have to correct myself first. You have to do this two times a day. 15 times, 3 reps each exercise. Use a table for both.

      Use so much weight that you feel it in the muscles afterward. Go down slowly like in the pics. If its very painful you have to reduce weight.

      Use your other arm to lift up the dumbbell after last pic on both exercises. Hope it helps
      Attachment 19147Attachment 19148
      Attachment 19149Attachment 19150


      I did try these exercises before. They can help strengthening your elbow and related muscles so it lessens the chance of getting tennis elbow. BUT it doesn't cure your pain. The pain can be cured mostly by resting so that the tear/damage to the tendon (ask your doctors) can heal. You still need to exercise a bit but should not play TT too much because it only makes the pain worse and longer to heal. Many people make mistakes for playing over and over and think these exercises can help only to make the pain more terrible. It of course will help if you play less frequently along with exercising, but takes much longer to heal compared to if you rest completely.
      Last edited by tropical; 05-19-2019 at 05:59 PM.

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    3. Top | #42
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      Quote Originally Posted by tropical View Post
      I did try these exercises before. They can help strengthening your elbow and related muscles so it lessens the chance of getting tennis elbow. BUT it doesn't cure your pain. The pain can be cured mostly by resting so that the tear/damage to the tendon (ask your doctors) can heal. You still need to exercise a bit but should not play TT too much because it only makes the pain worse and longer to heal. Many people make mistakes for playing over and over and think these exercises can help only to make the pain more terrible. It of course will help if you play less frequently along with exercising, but takes much longer to heal compared to if you rest completely.
      I had TE for over a year. Couldnt play TT for months because of the pain. Went to a physiotherapist and she confirmed tendonitis on the outside of the elbow. She then gave me these exercises and after 10-12 week the pain had nearly gone. I continued after 12 weeks and now its all fine. Have not had a problem with it since. It worked for me.

    4. Top | #43
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      thank you so much @rogerino75 and @tropical for sharing your experiences
      Lets go Spinny Looping !

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    6. Top | #44
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      Quote Originally Posted by ttmonster View Post
      thank you so much @rogerino75 and @tropical for sharing your experiences
      You are welcome. Good luck whatever you do.

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    8. Top | #45
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      I finally was able to get tid of tennis elbow due to exercises and massages...i also stopped using the brace. Thanks also to a good and patient physiotherapist

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    10. Top | #46
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      Actually, to add on what I already wrote. Playing through your injury is actually not very wise. I mean, try lefthand no problem (if it's just about playing) can wire some new circuits in your brain, actually a really fun experiment.
      Although it obviously will not help your right hand technuique and touch development so much.

      Second is, if you insist on playing with it, at least play less and try to avoid "tensing" your muscles to cause it, play relaxed and avoid playing the technuiqes that makes it hurt. (ex. if it's bh try stepping around more for fh, if it's fh... do the oposite) normally one type makes it ache more. This way you can heal while still playing. But even with these tips you should keep your workouts shorter than usual and not push your limits.
      Being stubborn about using the technuiqes that makes your elbow hurt will only prolong your suffering.
      NB: the pain that comes afterwards is the guideline, if you get it during you've already far overstepped it.

      best of luck again!
      "Despite that there are disadvantages of being a Penhold, there are more positive points from it. And in playing table tennis, we all need to diversify." ~Xu Xin - The Cloud Walker

    11. Top | #47
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      Tendinitis, like herniated discs and such, is a very individual thing. What works for one won't work for others. What worked for 100 may not work for you... it's fairly easy to tell what is causing your issues, if you are not blind to the truth (or stubborn...)!

      The real question is, can you live with not utilizing the thing causing it? I've had it in 2 spots, and for me, the only thing that worked each time was changing my technique/style. Even after 1.5 years of resting the trouble spot and not using the technique causing my pain, and doing various exercises/stretches throughout, just using the old technique for even 15 minutes currently will result in a flare up. So for me, I've not found anything to really remedy the damage, other than not doing the technique that caused it. Kind of a crappy experience when you've been playing a certain way for a number of years...

    12. Top | #48
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      Quote Originally Posted by LordPippington View Post
      Tendinitis, like herniated discs and such, is a very individual thing. What works for one won't work for others. What worked for 100 may not work for you... it's fairly easy to tell what is causing your issues, if you are not blind to the truth (or stubborn...)!

      The real question is, can you live with not utilizing the thing causing it? I've had it in 2 spots, and for me, the only thing that worked each time was changing my technique/style. Even after 1.5 years of resting the trouble spot and not using the technique causing my pain, and doing various exercises/stretches throughout, just using the old technique for even 15 minutes currently will result in a flare up. So for me, I've not found anything to really remedy the damage, other than not doing the technique that caused it. Kind of a crappy experience when you've been playing a certain way for a number of years...
      Have you tried ice after playing? That really worked for me and it soothed the part where it hurt the most..actually since i got this pain in 2016 i have seen quite a few physiotherapists and i was told to stop playing until the injury subsided which i did and today i am really glad that i did

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    13. Top | #49
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      Exact same exercises my physiotherapist gave me
      Also if it trauma happened not too long ago, you should use some cream with anti inflammatory drug like ibuprofen or diclofenac (ask a pharmacist), apply some cold after the trauma... if it's an old trauma - some heat...

    14. Top | #50
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      Quote Originally Posted by d3ss3n View Post
      Have you tried ice after playing? That really worked for me and it soothed the part where it hurt the most..actually since i got this pain in 2016 i have seen quite a few physiotherapists and i was told to stop playing until the injury subsided which i did and today i am really glad that i did

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      Yeah I used to use ice, but eventually went the route of stopping entirely. I changed styles so I could play without aggravating anything. And even doing that, over a year later with zero pain or symptoms, they all return almost immediately after going back to the old ways

    15. Top | #51
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      Quote Originally Posted by Simas View Post
      Also if it trauma happened not too long ago, you should use some cream with anti inflammatory drug like ibuprofen or diclofenac (ask a pharmacist), apply some cold after the trauma... if it's an old trauma - some heat...
      My body doesn't react to well on Ibuprofen so instead I've been using CBD oil and have had some very good results with it.

      And since even the WADA (World anti doping agency) has officially removed CBD from their list of prohibited substances no need to worry anymore.

      https://www.wada-ama.org/en/content/...n/cannabinoids

      I've also had a sore infalammated elbow.
      But I've also had a chiropractical adjustment.
      Now some might wonder how adjusting dislocated parts in the spine is related to the elbow, and I would have to admit that I don't know, but since everything in the body is somehow connected i found out that this rather holistic approach has helped me get rid of my pain.

      The adjustment looked a little something like this:



      If you want to do yourself a favour let the pain be treated as soon as possible. Don't wait as long as I did.

      Before I went to the chiropractor i went to my usual doctor and after about a year of resultless treatment i spoke to a friend. And he told me that he used to have the same pain [every time i wanted to hit a fh topspin it felt like someone stabbed a hot knife into my elbow] and told me about the chiropractor. So without having much to lose i gave it a go and since then no more pain.

      But meanwhile i stopped practicing but didn't want to let my teammates hang so I kept playing league matches, which looking back wasn't too smart, because i adapted my game and been mostly serve and kill or blocking.
      So after the pain was gone, my brain had to re-learn to loop without pain which took quite a while and a few unnecessary losses...

      https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/for...d-vs-Composite

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    17. Top | #52
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      Thanks for sharing your experience, I also saw these videos on Youtube where neck adjustments solve the elbow pain so I will explore this option.
      Quote Originally Posted by Suga D View Post
      My body doesn't react to well on Ibuprofen so instead I've been using CBD oil and have had some very good results with it.

      And since even the WADA (World anti doping agency) has officially removed CBD from their list of prohibited substances no need to worry anymore.

      https://www.wada-ama.org/en/content/...n/cannabinoids

      I've also had a sore infalammated elbow.
      But I've also had a chiropractical adjustment.
      Now some might wonder how adjusting dislocated parts in the spine is related to the elbow, and I would have to admit that I don't know, but since everything in the body is somehow connected i found out that this rather holistic approach has helped me get rid of my pain.

      The adjustment looked a little something like this:



      If you want to do yourself a favour let the pain be treated as soon as possible. Don't wait as long as I did.

      Before I went to the chiropractor i went to my usual doctor and after about a year of resultless treatment i spoke to a friend. And he told me that he used to have the same pain [every time i wanted to hit a fh topspin it felt like someone stabbed a hot knife into my elbow] and told me about the chiropractor. So without having much to lose i gave it a go and since then no more pain.

      But meanwhile i stopped practicing but didn't want to let my teammates hang so I kept playing league matches, which looking back wasn't too smart, because i adapted my game and been mostly serve and kill or blocking.
      So after the pain was gone, my brain had to re-learn to loop without pain which took quite a while and a few unnecessary losses...

      https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/for...d-vs-Composite

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    19. Top | #53
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      Quote Originally Posted by Suga D View Post
      My body doesn't react to well on Ibuprofen so instead I've been using CBD oil and have had some very good results with it.

      And since even the WADA (World anti doping agency) has officially removed CBD from their list of prohibited substances no need to worry anymore.

      https://www.wada-ama.org/en/content/...n/cannabinoids

      I've also had a sore infalammated elbow.
      But I've also had a chiropractical adjustment.
      Now some might wonder how adjusting dislocated parts in the spine is related to the elbow, and I would have to admit that I don't know, but since everything in the body is somehow connected i found out that this rather holistic approach has helped me get rid of my pain.

      The adjustment looked a little something like this:



      If you want to do yourself a favour let the pain be treated as soon as possible. Don't wait as long as I did.

      Before I went to the chiropractor i went to my usual doctor and after about a year of resultless treatment i spoke to a friend. And he told me that he used to have the same pain [every time i wanted to hit a fh topspin it felt like someone stabbed a hot knife into my elbow] and told me about the chiropractor. So without having much to lose i gave it a go and since then no more pain.

      But meanwhile i stopped practicing but didn't want to let my teammates hang so I kept playing league matches, which looking back wasn't too smart, because i adapted my game and been mostly serve and kill or blocking.
      So after the pain was gone, my brain had to re-learn to loop without pain which took quite a while and a few unnecessary losses...

      https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/for...d-vs-Composite
      Quote Originally Posted by ttmonster View Post
      Thanks for sharing your experience, I also saw these videos on Youtube where neck adjustments solve the elbow pain so I will explore this option.
      Since all physical sensations, pain or otherwise, actually come from nerve impulses, there are frequently times when pain in a limb is referred pain from a nerve impingement. For the arm, that could be nerve impingement from the spin or even nerve impingement from how the nerves go through the shoulder girdle into the arm.

      This is a story I give to some of my clients when I am working with them and they are insisting that they have pain in an area like their knee or down their leg and it has become clear to me that the issue is in their spin and not in their leg; which is actually quite common.

      So, this is a story of this woman who is a dancer. It is a true story. She was performing. And she was wearing an outfit with white tights. The performance was a fairly big to do. And in the middle of this performance with this large audience and all these dancers on the stage she felt something tear and felt blood running down her leg. It was close to the end of the performance. And she resolved not to look because she did not want to freak out. She figured, the performance was almost over and she would take care of this nasty gash after. And as she was performing she felt the blood running down her leg. She felt the blood in her dance shoe. She was astonished as the dancers took their bows that nobody in the audience seemed to have noticed because, surely the blood would show up exceptionally on the white tights.

      When she got off stage, there was no blood. There was no cut. She had actually injured her lower back, not her leg.

      And that is how the nervous system works. When you have pain, it usually does indicate that something is going wrong. But where the pain is may or may not be where things have gone wrong.

      But, if there is an issue in the neck that is causing the pain in the elbow, if the pain in the elbow causes the forearm to get tight, which also usually happens, those stretches for the forearm will still be useful even if they don't address the central condition.
      Last edited by UpSideDownCarl; 05-22-2019 at 02:59 AM.
      Spin Everything.

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    21. Top | #54
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      @Carl : Most of my issues are linked to muscle conditions from feedback i have received, mostly because long hours on the computer and sleeping posture ... do you recommend any stretches/yoga poses that can fix the neck issues without going to the chiropractor and getting neck adjustments ?
      Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl View Post
      Since all physical sensations, pain or otherwise, actually come from nerve impulses, there are frequently times when pain in a limb is referred pain from a nerve impingement. For the arm, that could be nerve impingement from the spin or even nerve impingement from how the nerves go through the shoulder girdle into the arm.

      This is a story I give to some of my clients when I am working with them and they are insisting that they have pain in an area like their knee or down their leg and it has become clear to me that the issue is in their spin and not in their leg; which is actually quite common.

      So, this is a story of this woman who is a dancer. It is a true story. She was performing. And she was wearing an outfit with white tights. The performance was a fairly big to do. And in the middle of this performance with this large audience and all these dancers on the stage she felt something tear and felt blood running down her leg. It was close to the end of the performance. And she resolved not to look because she did not want to freak out. She figured, the performance was almost over and she would take care of this nasty gash after. And as she was performing she felt the blood running down her leg. She felt the blood in her dance shoe. She was astonished as the dancers took their bows that nobody in the audience seemed to have noticed because, surely the blood would show up exceptionally on the white tights.

      When she got off stage, there was no blood. There was no cut. She had actually injured her lower back, not her leg.

      And that is how the nervous system works. When you have pain, it usually does indicate that something is going wrong. But where the pain is may or may not be where things have gone wrong.

      But, if there is an issue in the neck that is causing the pain in the elbow, if the pain in the elbow causes the forearm to get tight, which also usually happens, those stretches for the forearm will still be useful even if they don't address the central condition.

    22. Top | #55
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      Quote Originally Posted by ttmonster View Post
      @Carl : Most of my issues are linked to muscle conditions from feedback i have received, mostly because long hours on the computer and sleeping posture ... do you recommend any stretches/yoga poses that can fix the neck issues without going to the chiropractor and getting neck adjustments ?
      If the issue is the neck, a good chiropractor can be amazing for that.

      There are of course lots of directions for stretching your neck. Like, turning your head to one side, then the other. Tilting the head to one side or another. Letting the head drop and the chin drop towards your chest. Lying face up with your shoulders near the edge of a bed and letting your head drop back, off the bed.

      But to advise someone with a neck problem what ways of stretching the neck would be good for them, I would never do that over the internet because I cannot give a proper assessment of the direction or directions of stretch that might be useful to whatever is going on with your neck and, more importantly, if any specific directions of stretch might be damaging instead of useful.
      Last edited by UpSideDownCarl; 05-22-2019 at 06:12 AM.

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    24. Top | #56
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      I know ... I was just asking if its possible without going for neck adjustments ... because in the past I have noticed the adjustments last temporarily and I have to go back for it again ... but thanks for all the insight
      Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl View Post
      If the issue is the neck, a good chiropractor can be amazing for that.

      There are of course lots of directions for stretching your neck. Like, turning your head to one side, then the other. Tilting the head to one side or another. Letting the head drop and the chin drop towards your chest. Lying face up with your shoulders near the edge of a bed and letting your head drop back, off the bed.

      But to advise someone with a neck problem what ways of stretching the neck would be good for them, I would never do that over the internet because I cannot give a proper assessment of the direction or directions of stretch that might be useful to whatever is going on with your neck and, more importantly, if any specific directions of stretch might be damaging instead of useful.

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    26. Top | #57
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      Quote Originally Posted by jus10savestheday View Post
      I tried stretches, icing, rest, ibuprofen, braces, etc. nothing worked until I bought a flex bar. Flex bar got rid of my tennis elbow within weeks after having it for months. I bought the green one.
      I just got the green one. After 3 days of doing 3 sets of 15 reps, the pain started getting worse and even extended down to my hand. I've cut back to 1 set per day. Hopefully it's only a matter of "it'll get worse before it'll get better".

    27. Top | #58
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      Quote Originally Posted by delerious View Post
      I just got the green one. After 3 days of doing 3 sets of 15 reps, the pain started getting worse and even extended down to my hand. I've cut back to 1 set per day. Hopefully it's only a matter of "it'll get worse before it'll get better".
      Please read through Baal's post.

      Quote Originally Posted by Baal View Post
      I teach at a medical school and have kept up to date on tendon issues because I have experienced them at some points.

      The stretches might help, they won't hurt if you are reasonable. The literature says, though, that it doesn't work for everybody. And steroid injections have in some patients made the problem worse, not better.

      One thing for sure, you need to take enough time off and "playing through it" is absolutely terrible advice. You may need to take a couple additional weeks. Make no mistake about it, the repetitive use of the tendon in a certain way is inducing a degenerative process and the cells in the tendon (tenocytes) are changing. Tendon is living dynamic tissue. In the worst cases, tennis elbow (or wrist) can become quite chronic so that it hurts all the time and hampers daily life. The tendon will regenerate if you give it a chance. But that means you need to stop doing the things that are breaking it down and that means you have to take enough time off, as much as it sucks to not play.

      Once you start again, you need to do something different or the tendonopathy will simply recur. There is a lot of mechanical stress at on particular point along the tendon that happens on some subset of shots you are hitting (often from the backhand if you are like a lot of people I know). It may not need to be a huge change to reduce this. Something that could work is to get a blade with a quite different handle shape that forces you to change your grip. Grip changes while playing can be enough to solve this, and a handle shape change may make it happen naturally, although it may not be necessary. Maybe a slightly lighter setup, or a faster rubber on the side of the stroke that is causing your problems. Maybe to not hold the handle so tight, or to relax your entire upper body more when playing. It is hard to know without seeing you play or knowing exactly where and when it hurts.
      If you have not given the elbow time to rest, working it when the issue is a repetitive stress issue makes no sense. After there has been a few weeks/months of rest, then those exercises may be useful.

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    29. Top | #59
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      Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl View Post
      Please read through Baal's post.



      If you have not given the elbow time to rest, working it when the issue is a repetitive stress issue makes no sense. After there has been a few weeks/months of rest, then those exercises may be useful.
      I heard that soreness when starting a new exercise is normal, as your muscles aren't used to being exerted in that way. But yeah, I can stop the exercises until the pain goes away. It's the flexbar that's been painful recently. I haven't noticed much pain during games recently.
      Last edited by delerious; 05-30-2019 at 07:49 AM.

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      Quote Originally Posted by delerious View Post
      I heard that soreness when starting a new exercise is normal, as your muscles aren't used to being exerted in that way. But yeah, I can stop the exercises until the pain goes away. It's the flexbar that's been painful recently. I haven't noticed much pain during games recently.
      Do you have tennis elbow? Is the pain in your elbow or do you just have muscle soreness from exercise? Like, if a muscle, like your bicep is sore, that is not a big deal. If you feel pain in your elbow, that is not muscle soreness from exercise. I mean, the two cannot and should not be confused. And your elbow joint has no muscles. Your forearm, yes. Your upper arm, yes. There are no muscles in your elbow.

      Tennis elbow is a Repetitive Stress condition. It won't feel anything like soreness from working muscles.
      Last edited by UpSideDownCarl; 05-30-2019 at 08:22 AM.

    31. The Following 3 Users Like UpSideDownCarl's Post:

      Baal (1 Week Ago),Suga D (05-30-2019),ttmonster (05-30-2019)

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