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  1. langel is offline
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    #1

    Martial Arts & TT

    How many of you have practiced, or do practice Martial Arts?
    And if you have, do you find yourself sometimes unconsciously using MA techniques - legs and body position, blocking and hitting moves etc?
    Do you find that helpfull?

    I was a Kyokushin fighter in my youth, my son was a Shotokan fighter - double National champion in Free Fighting /and twice disqualifyed in Kyokushin/ and when we play TT we often find ourselfs like using some parts of Martial Arts techniques.

    Do you think that Asian TT players may be so good because of the reason that Martial Arts are very popular in their schools?

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    #2
    They are good because of early access to coaching, infrastructure, and high level competition, in table tennis. That is a quite sufficient explanation.

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  3. UpSideDownCarl is online now
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    #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Baal
    They are good because of early access to coaching, infrastructure, and high level competition, in table tennis. That is a quite sufficient explanation.
    This is all that needs to be said.


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    #4
    Quote Originally Posted by langel
    How many of you have practiced, or do practice Martial Arts?
    And if you have, do you find yourself sometimes unconsciously using MA techniques - legs and body position, blocking and hitting moves etc?
    Do you find that helpfull?

    I was a Kyokushin fighter in my youth, my son was a Shotokan fighter - double National champion in Free Fighting /and twice disqualifyed in Kyokushin/ and when we play TT we often find ourselfs like using some parts of Martial Arts techniques.

    Do you think that Asian TT players may be so good because of the reason that Martial Arts are very popular in their schools?
    Still, part of Your hypothesis valid,

    We often got better understanding on TT from another sport / activities exercise.

    In my case, TT and Golf

    I predict in Carl case, TT and Yoga.

    Sent from my i5E using Tapatalk

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    #5
    Well, I even find many common between Jiu-Jitsu basics in reading energy direction and strength and answering with appropriate grip and swing, and the same in TT. TT footwork, anchor leg, spme of the forehand, but mostly backhand pushes, flips, blocks /especially active/, attacks and smashes , are very common with some general techniques in MA.

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    #6
    @OldSchoolPenholder might be able to shed some light on this topic. I have never practiced any martial arts but I have seen from close quarters at least two fellow club members who were into boxing and both of them have a different muscle memory during impact ... impact of table tennis and impact of hand to hand combat are fundamentally different and might interfere with each other , or I have seen them interfere on their techniques ... particularly there swings were stiffer and less fluent , with martial arts may be that would not be a problem ... just saying .. .

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  7. UpSideDownCarl is online now
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    #7

    Martial Arts & TT

    It is sort of true that there is crossover in sports and body movements.

    As a kid I was a skateboarder. I rode ramps on skateboards.

    As an adult I picked up inline skates and got really good at ramp from the previous skill 20 years earlier on a skateboard.

    When I was in the circus I went surfing and everyone told me it is really hard to get up and ride a wave. But I had no trouble. The skill is quite similar to what I did on ramps on both skateboards and inline skates.

    When I was in the circus I also went snowboarding for the first time. On my second day on a board I would still mess up and catch my edge. But I still was better in the snowboard half pipe than 75% of the people on the mountain even though I did not snowboard as well as they did.

    So crossover happens. But is not so applicable to a kid who was scouted for talent in TT at 4 years old and placed in a special school to train in TT 6 hours+ a day by the age of 6.

    So, at least in the case of the Provinvial and National CNT players, it has much more to do with the Chinese training regimen which definitely includes cross-training for certain skills. But my money says the cross-training is not martial arts. It is specific to TT even if it may have crossover for martial arts as well.


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    Last edited by UpSideDownCarl; 09-10-2017 at 06:42 PM.
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    #8
    I'd say boxing to table tennis is helping but not French Savate.

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    #9
    I use comparisons to taekwondo when trying to get someone to understand short area force generation, making max force at impact, and balance/ready start-finish. It is much easier to get someone to understand the force given with a short, but powerful strike for the TT situations requiring application of force in a short/small space and time.

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  10. UpSideDownCarl is online now
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    #10
    Quote Originally Posted by tropical
    I'd say boxing to table tennis is helping but not French Savate.
    It is true that when I show my shadow training drills to guys who box, they usually say how it looks like boxing. But I am not so sure that there is much skill crossover from boxing to TT. However, boxing training would increase your fitness level for TT.

    Quote Originally Posted by Der_Echte
    I use comparisons to taekwondo when trying to get someone to understand short area force generation, making max force at impact, and balance/ready start-finish. It is much easier to get someone to understand the force given with a short, but powerful strike for the TT situations requiring application of force in a short/small space and time.
    This is actually a really interesting and valuable point.

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    #11
    Muay thai helped me to bend and have a wide stance because of the thigh and leg strength. Arnis helped me strengthen my wrist.

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  12. UpSideDownCarl is online now
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    #12
    Quote Originally Posted by yogi_bear
    Muay thai helped me to bend and have a wide stance because of the thigh and leg strength. Arnis helped me strengthen my wrist.
    So, if the premise of the thread was, is there crossover between martial arts and TT that could help people be better players, then the answer would be yes.

    But in the OP there is this paragraph.

    Quote Originally Posted by langel
    Do you think that Asian TT players may be so good because of the reason that Martial Arts are very popular in their schools?
    And I think Baal gave the actual answer to that question.


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  13. Baal is offline
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    #13
    Martial arts could be useful in this TT situation, though.

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    Last edited by Baal; 09-11-2017 at 01:18 AM.

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    #14
    A friend of mine was a cricket player, and he thought there was lots of crossover of skills, especially in reading spin.

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    #15
    Notice also when executi.g a roundhouse kick and doing forehand smash, drive or loop follows the same principle in generating power through the use of the waist.

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    #16
    Thank you, very good implementation.



    Well, I think you can find some common to TT concepts even in Wushu and Ti Chi.
    I wathched a match of one the top choppers /forgot his name, I'm really afraid of choppers/, who moves like in an old monkey style Kung Fu movie, amazing player.


    What I find as crossover points between MA and TT:
    - great concentration and fast reaction
    - reading the oponent's behaviour, tactics and strategy, his body language
    - footwork - fast and dynamic near the ground, stable anchorage
    - swings - from the feet all through the body to the weapon
    - hits - You have to hit. In both defence and attack have some very similar structure concept and moves.
    - breathe technique - I find breathe technique very important in TT and it has the exactly same concept as in MA.
    - weapon - know how and why to choose a perticular kind, know what is capable to do and what is not, get the best synergy with it and use it the best way.


    May be others....

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  17. langel is offline
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    #17
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    So, if the premise of the thread was, is there crossover between martial arts and TT that could help people be better players, then the answer would be yes.

    But in the OP there is this paragraph.
    "Do you think that Asian TT players may be so good because of the reason that Martial Arts are very popular in their schools?"



    And I think Baal gave the actual answer to that question.


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    Ok, I really don't think that coaches advise players to practise MA, and of course good TT training is the most importante.
    And I'm not speaking only for top and pro players, but for TT players generally. As far I know MA are very popular and are part of the school program in many schools in China and Japan. So a lot of the their TT players /may be/ would have some MA basics.

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    #18
    Table tennis is a sport. Therefore the foremost requirement to playing well is general flexibility and fitness.
    So a sportsman from any sport will do well at TT given enough practice. Those sportsmen will also carry with them any attributes they picked up in other sports. Eg
    Player with the fastest footwork that I've seen was also a street/break dancer. He also had the most complicated footwork
    One of the hardest bh puncher/hitter I've seen was also a boxer
    One of the fittest player I've seen was also a tri-athlete. He was over 50yo yet could still outlast the young players when doing multiball.

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  19. Baal is offline
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    #19
    I suspect that lots of crosstraining activities could improve TT in various different ways, but whatever it is has to be fun enough that you will actually do it. I can see how some might like a martial art. I've never tried it beyond wrestling for two years in junior high school. I quit that because it got in the way of TT (and less fun).

    For me it is road cycling. My legs are stronger and more equal, I lost all my extra weight, and my resting heart rate is about 51 bpm. So my TT footwork is vastly improved and less muscle/joint strain from playing. For me that is most important (the rest of my TT technique is reasonably well honed since I was a kid).

    I wouldn't get any benefits if I didn't like it because I wouldn't do it. Some or most people probably have more discipline than me but this is still a key factor.

    It has to be fun.

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    Last edited by Baal; 09-11-2017 at 12:44 PM.

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    #20
    Yes, Baal, cycling is good for legs' strength.
    And it remind me a case with a friend and a TT partner. He is a returning TT player with previous 12 years of good training, a chopper //. He is a very good long distance cycler, addicted to cycling and spending thousands of dollars for custom bikes.
    He bikes more than 150 km weekly. But two years ago, the next day after our first TT session, when I returned him to TT, he cryed to me that he has got strong pains in some muscles under the but at the inner side of the legs //.

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