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You said you understood, but you still think your reasoning still hold validity?
Okay, let me help you understand these numbers
2.15mm is the sponge
a 2.15mm sponge with top sheet is about 3.90mm
The moment the total rubber (sponge + top sheet) gets more than 4mm the player risk equipment test failure (for most amateurs, they will never understand what this means)
a Tenergy 05 at 2.1mm sponge is also about 3.90mm total rubber (sponge + top sheet)
Boosting of H3, yes, it may make it 0.1mm more/ So yes, the BS H3 could be marginal bigger than T05
Coming back to your if you statement: "expand to almost double", then I think you lost the plot totally
I'm reading you as, 2.15mm expanding to 4mm.....
Giant did try to explain, but seems like you still think sponge can become 4mm....
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I guess this is another one of ITTF's grey areas
If it is something ITTF can't measure, then players can get away with it - and a lot of players are getting away with it
BTW, factory boosting is allowed according to ITTF
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A rule which is not enforceable does not mean it's a grey area. It's not allowed, ITTF made it pretty clear, any physical treatment, for example boosting, is forbidden, there are also plenty of statements by ITTF and its officials where they say that.
but yes, it does not really make a difference since today's boosters are not detectable.
but yes, it does not really make a difference since today's boosters are not detectable.
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Ok I'll play your game of rudeness: Do you know how to read? These things have already been explained by people with more mature tone than yours. Did you incredibly enough just miss that part? Saying I "Understood" meant I retract the part about doubling the thickness since Giang explained it. STILL, the BS on Fzd's blade is thicker for obvious reasons you seem to have totally missed as well. Or are you telling the community that the Chinese don't boost their rubbers because they're afraid to get caught? Also, Ma Long (and perhaps others) sand their blade on the side where they measure the thickness to get away with thicker rubbers.
We have a saying in Sweden that translates to about "they way you ask is the way you will be responded to". I think you know what I mean.
We have a saying in Sweden that translates to about "they way you ask is the way you will be responded to". I think you know what I mean.
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haha, so now I am saying Chinese don't boost they rubbers?
I'm worried with your reading skills
those guys use 2.1mm sponge to boost more
no matter what, it is 4mm max
if you want to make a fuss that 4mm max is more than 3.95mm of tenegy 05, then sure, you win, the H3 is thicker than T05 by 0.05mm
happy?
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It is a grey area
As most of the pros boost, and ITTF knows that, but can't do anything about it
And just because it is "forbidden" doesn't mean the players just listens to ITTF
just look at the service rule too, those toss are all "forbidden"
ITTF rules have way too many grey areas - this is words coming from international umpires, not me
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I just thought I should comment on this
have you ever saw how umpires measure rubber thickness nowadays?
I'm not sure how sanding away would help - if you sand the area where it is measured, then 4mm will become 4mm+
Unless you are claiming that Ma Long sands away the area that the rubber goes on and risking an unbalanced blade
and how did you know Ma Long sands it, you got source or you just read it somewhere?
I saw FZD's blade, his one seems fine
The only ones I see sanding is Cpens, Wang Hao's blade is sanded for reasons nothing to do with tricking rubber measurement tools
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I didn't compare them for the near table suitability.
I think it is all depend on your own style. When near table, you do more like blocking or more like flipping (when you use more wrist and brush) it can all differs.
I think you'd better try anybody's viscaria to have a feeling yourself.
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My H3 BS is almost 4 mm boosted a year ago. Ma Longs is much thicker. Or are you suggesting that his rubbers are hardly boosted because the risk of getting caught?
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I think we are arguing over the term 'grey area' A grey area exists if the legal situation is unclear and up to interpretation.
This is not the case here at all. It is clearly forbidden. The fact that they can not prove that the players are boosting is something entirely different.
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That's why the seamoon claim itself as a solubility bond -- a glue.
if you are allowed to apply glue to your rubber, you can apply seamoon. and ITTF can't define what is glue and what isn't.
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Ma Longs rubbers are definitely thicker than 4 mm, compare them to the 6 mm thick blade.
My H3 BS is almost 4 mm boosted a year ago. Ma Longs is much thicker. Or are you suggesting that his rubbers are hardly boosted because the risk of getting caught?
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There are a lot of Chinese Provincial players sand down certain area of blade to pass the test using a thicker sponge.
This seems a common practice as I have seen many blade in second hand market with the description saying: the blade surface is sanded a bit in order to pass the rubber thickness test....
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I'm suggesting you are making way too many claims
BTW players are worried they equipment gets disqualified
CNT has a testing personal to test equipment for players before they give it to ITTF racket control table
I just doubled your photo and use photo shop to draw a box to see what is the height of both rubbers (sponge + topsheet)
with my 500% zoom, it is +/- the same height
2.15mm can be boosted to just 4mm
or 2.1mm is easier
I'm not sure what the fuss is about
4mm is the max, or risk not able to use the equipment
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I have seen some blade surface cleaned
it is hardly 0.01mm sanded
The top ply is also very thin - it is stupid to sand the top ply off for booster space
Also - there are many photos on forums of CNT blade - show me one that is sanded
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Well I have a pic I received before showing Ma Longs blade sanded down, digging through the phone and will present it when I find it.
There is no fuss except the one you've created most unnecessary. Bored or something? If you wanna believe that no top player ever cross any lines with their equipment I'm not gonna waste time stopping you. Everyone knows that the rubbers ITTF have approved can have factory tuning so there is no grey area there at all. And all other boosting is forbidden, also no grey area. What it boils down to is if the rules are enforced. And most of the time they're not. Like with your service example.
There is no fuss except the one you've created most unnecessary. Bored or something? If you wanna believe that no top player ever cross any lines with their equipment I'm not gonna waste time stopping you. Everyone knows that the rubbers ITTF have approved can have factory tuning so there is no grey area there at all. And all other boosting is forbidden, also no grey area. What it boils down to is if the rules are enforced. And most of the time they're not. Like with your service example.
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The top ply is normally at least 0.5mm.. to sand down 0.1mm is a 0.1mm advantage in sponge thickness. For pro players, 4.1mm and 4.0mm may be a notable difference in shot quality.
For pictures, this blade is claimed that it was used by Mu Zi
So is this one used by a provincial player
The lower half was sand down. you can see the difference in colour.
For provincial games, the test is not very strict.
For national games, it is quite strict.
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Details:
If
H3BS = 2.15
before booster and
T05 Sponge = 2.1
Before booster:
Then H3 BS does start thicker.
I am sure FZD is boosting both rubbers. T05 is much more reactive to booster than H3 so less boost will get more expansion. So, probably those guys use the right amount of boost for each separate rubber.
And the thing is, if T05 2.1 is 3.9 when you measure sponge and topsheet, and H3BS 2.15 is 3.9, then the H3 topsheet and pimples are thinner than the T05 topsheet and pimples and the H3BS is thicker.
But then there is one last detail: sometimes the color of something makes it look even thicker, or thinner.
The blue sponge next to the Black topsheet, it is harder to see when the topsheet stops and the sponge begins. And with T05 the line between orange sponge and red topsheet is very well delineated and completely clear to see.
So, the BS will look thicker to the naked eye and the orange sponge will look thinner.
This is how color combinations work.
So, in spite of RidTheKid being right that the BS is thicker, it is not as much thicker as the naked eye tricks us into thinking.
I hope that makes sense.
Sent from The Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy
If
H3BS = 2.15
before booster and
T05 Sponge = 2.1
Before booster:
Then H3 BS does start thicker.
I am sure FZD is boosting both rubbers. T05 is much more reactive to booster than H3 so less boost will get more expansion. So, probably those guys use the right amount of boost for each separate rubber.
And the thing is, if T05 2.1 is 3.9 when you measure sponge and topsheet, and H3BS 2.15 is 3.9, then the H3 topsheet and pimples are thinner than the T05 topsheet and pimples and the H3BS is thicker.
But then there is one last detail: sometimes the color of something makes it look even thicker, or thinner.
The blue sponge next to the Black topsheet, it is harder to see when the topsheet stops and the sponge begins. And with T05 the line between orange sponge and red topsheet is very well delineated and completely clear to see.
So, the BS will look thicker to the naked eye and the orange sponge will look thinner.
This is how color combinations work.
So, in spite of RidTheKid being right that the BS is thicker, it is not as much thicker as the naked eye tricks us into thinking.
I hope that makes sense.
Sent from The Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy
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