Uh oh, backhand rubber advice time

OhWell · Dec 13, 2017

I damaged the sponge of the Vega Pro I’ve been using on BH: it might need replacement earlier than planned. I love the spin and control I get from Vega pro on more aggressive shots. But on the more controlled, close to the table BH shots, where the sponge doesn’t get engaged much, VP feels less at home. It’s like there’s a pretty big jump in spin performance from low gears to higher gears.

Don’t get me wrong, it’s still great, and I believe that technique is the more important factor here. But since I need a new rubber anyway, I’d like to try something that doesn’t have as much of a gap in spin performance from low gears to high gears. Similarly to Vega pro, it should still: not be too bouncy/jumpy (for a tensor type rubber); have great spin, control and decent arc on more aggressive shots; and behave well both on passive and active blocks.

ATM Aurus Select and MX-S seem especially promising to me. I’m also curious about Karis M. (From my reading I’d expect KM to be less spinny than select and mx-s at low gears. But I could see how getting a more linear spin performance from low gears to high gears might also do the trick for me..)

NextLevel · Dec 13, 2017

For something that performs like Vega Pro but is more reliable - Tibhar Genius. If I didn't like to loop/hit topspin hard close to the table, this would be the ideal.

For entirely different animals with linear control, pushing blocking and great brushing spin but harder to obtain driving spin - MX-S, Karis, with MX-S being the more advanced option.

shinshiro · Dec 13, 2017

For people who tried Rakza 7, is it similar to Vega Pro? I didn't play with them but from what I read Rakza 7 is also spin oriented and medium hard sponge, so it sounded like more or less similar to Vega Pro. If someone could compare them I would be grateful, I also have interest on Vega Pro / Rakza 7

yoass · Dec 13, 2017

Rakza 7 is spinnier and much more explosive. Pretty demanding in the short game, nigh uncontollable in passive play. Very rewarding in active play, sometimes yielding unexpectedly high spin levels.

NextLevel · Dec 13, 2017

shinshiro said:
For people who tried Rakza 7, is it similar to Vega Pro? I didn't play with them but from what I read Rakza 7 is also spin oriented and medium hard sponge, so it sounded like more or less similar to Vega Pro. If someone could compare them I would be grateful, I also have interest on Vega Pro / Rakza 7

The first generation of ESN rubbers to compete with Tenergy were similar in many ways. They include Rakza 7 and Vega Pro, but more people think directly of the yellow sponges Germany distributed variants like Andro Hexer, Tibhar Genius, Donic Baracuda and Joola Xplode.

OhWell · Dec 13, 2017

NextLevel said:
For something that performs like Vega Pro but is more reliable - Tibhar Genius. If I didn't like to loop/hit topspin hard close to the table, this would be the ideal.

For entirely different animals with linear control, pushing blocking and great brushing spin but harder to obtain driving spin - MX-S, Karis, with MX-S being the more advanced option.

If it's between Karis and MX-S, what specifically is more technically demanding/advanced with MX-S?

shinshiro · Dec 13, 2017

yoass said:
Rakza 7 is spinnier and much more explosive. Pretty demanding in the short game, nigh uncontollable in passive play. Very rewarding in active play, sometimes yielding unexpectedly high spin levels.

When you say pretty demanding on short game did you mean that it is more bouncy/difficul to control right?
It seems that Vega Pro is a better option for a beginners tensor rubber since it looks to be more controlable?

My only concern on Vega Pro is due to sponge hardness... Will I loose much 'feel' for the ball when comparing to Rakza 7? (As you can see I don't have much experience with rubbers...)

I think I may be deviating a bit from the thread, I'm sorry OhWell...I will try to not post about it here anymore...

NextLevel · Dec 13, 2017

OhWell said:
If it's between Karis and MX-S, what specifically is more technically demanding/advanced with MX-S?

It's a harder sponge so you have to work a little harder to make it work with fuller and writer swings. It is also not quite as linear as Karis M. It's also heavier so that dampens some people's enthusiasm. But since I play with more spin than power it helps the way I play.

yoass · Dec 13, 2017

shinshiro said:
When you say pretty demanding on short game did you mean that it is more bouncy/difficul to control right?
It seems that Vega Pro is a better option for a beginners tensor rubber since it looks to be more controlable?

My only concern on Vega Pro is due to sponge hardness... Will I loose much 'feel' for the ball when comparing to Rakza 7? (As you can see I don't have much experience with rubbers...)

I think I may be deviating a bit from the thread, I'm sorry OhWell...I will try to not post about it here anymore...

Yes, I think Vega Pro is probably the safer choice. I don’t know about beginners, Vega Pro is already a fast, spinny rubber with much to offer at mire advanced levels. Have a look at Lennart Wehking’s review on ‘tube to get a glimpse of that.

Personally, I like harder rubbers and I did not get the impression that VP was much harder sponged than Rakza 7. Both have a firm feel.

Garrison · Dec 13, 2017

If you get the chance I recommend to try out the Donic BlueFire JP 02. I picked some rubbers to test that were spinny with good control and surprisingly the JP felt the best.

6Finger · Dec 13, 2017

shinshiro said:
For people who tried Rakza 7, is it similar to Vega Pro? I didn't play with them but from what I read Rakza 7 is also spin oriented and medium hard sponge, so it sounded like more or less similar to Vega Pro. If someone could compare them I would be grateful, I also have interest on Vega Pro / Rakza 7

I found them very similar.

OhWell · Dec 14, 2017

Karis M incoming!

Der_Echte · Dec 14, 2017

OW...

I see your order, Can ship Friday AM. I am stuck like Chuck in a class on a San Diego at the moment in a Navy Base with no post office, lunch too short to visit off base post.

I will toss in another goodie to your shipment to make up for it. Will ship priority USPS.

OhWell · Dec 14, 2017

I’m afraid I can’t accept that description of the situation. Rather, it seems to me like you are prepping this sheet of Karis for out of the box hard work: by exposing it to what hard, off the TT court work can be like.

Der_Echte · Dec 14, 2017

Well, I can say Karis M is a boss of handling incoming topspin, and if you have the stroke, make your own, even if not, off the bounce quick you make your own and it is threatening. Everyone who uses it will say it lacks power... and it does, but you keep it on the table and if you have power, you can still hit hard and land it. That counts for a LOT, I have a much better middle game and touch game with it. If you just block, you will like it too. Many hate on me as they do not make the same spin I do with it, but for real, there isn't a lot of players who make my spin, I really make it a point of emphasis. Karis isn't the spinniest rubbers out there, but it is controllable, which I crave on BH.

There is no way I can get out of class to a post office Thursday by lunch to send your shipment, I will see if right at end of day if I can get it in. Otherwise, it is Friday, either way it will be USPS Priority.

Der_Echte · Dec 14, 2017

OW, since you are in the vicinity of Carl, you outta try to meet up with him or OSP or 42n Back-Pnz, or Ping Pong Holic or sum others in NYC area on the forums. You never know when and where you can fight the Goonies and win.

OhWell · Dec 14, 2017

No rush!

Yup, I live in goon town. I’ve been in touch with some of them on here, but I am looking forward to meeting.

Der_Echte · Dec 14, 2017

Ilia has been training BH and I hear is looking for victims, watch out. Most of NYC Goon Squad has had distractions, timing has never been better.

TableTennisTom · Dec 14, 2017

yoass said:
Rakza 7 is spinnier and much more explosive. Pretty demanding in the short game, nigh uncontollable in passive play. Very rewarding in active play, sometimes yielding unexpectedly high spin levels.

I agree with the 'unexpectedly high spin levels' comment. I have been using Rakza 7 on my backhand for the past year. I love it! It does everything well - low pushes, easy blocking, spinny topspins - and it has this surprising extra gear (if using correct technique), where you can really generate a lot of speed and spin. I started with max thickness, but found it a tad too lively for my game. I switch to 2.0 thickness and this to be just the right balance between speed and control.

jawien · Dec 14, 2017

OhWell said:
I’d like to try something that doesn’t have as much of a gap in spin performance from low gears to high gears. Similarly to Vega pro, it should still: not be too bouncy/jumpy (for a tensor type rubber); have great spin, control and decent arc on more aggressive shots; and behave well both on passive and active blocks.

Tibhar el-p? I believe it has no this "spin gap". I find it to be a nice combination for a control game and some offensive shots (every distance). Blocking is good, does not bother too much with opponent's spin. Mine is max and quite fast on alc but still controllable. I do prefer it over 05fx.

Uh oh, backhand rubber advice time

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