Uh oh, backhand rubber advice time

Garrison said:

If you get the chance I recommend to try out the Donic BlueFire JP 02. I picked some rubbers to test that were spinny with good control and surprisingly the JP felt the best.

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Yes, JP02 is a great rubber for BH. It's spinny and controllable, sponge is somewhere between soft and medium, so it's also nice playing close to the table. I have JP01 Turbo, which is faster and has a little bit harder sponge and my style is somewhat closer to the table and it's great.

I've mentioned it meny times - Asia DF versions, both of Omega and Vega family, work better close and over the table than Pro.
At longer distance they are comparable. Asia DF has more spin at any distance, Pro doesn't have DF version.
Many people think that as Asia is generally harder /which is not true, because the DF version is almost of the same hardness as the Pro/ it will be more difficult and will lack the touch and feel, but it's not the case at all. In fact I find Asia DF better than Pro in every aspect. I would not say that its just for me, because there are some people around me, who feel the same.
Of course it can't be a 100% true for everyone.

OW, your shipment should arrive Monday, so said USPS rep.

Tie a string to trigger of shotgun (blank charge) positioned on steps to safeguard your shipment from unauthorized opening inspection by Goon Squad.

Gears, gears, and more gears. No! Get MX-P !!!!!! If you want the highest levels of spin and speed on the backhand. If MX-P isn't too your liking, try Victas V-15 Extra for added control in all areas of play on the backhand. Not as dynamic as MX-P but it's less sensitive to incoming spin which adds a bit of control.

See, Mx-s is too dull and too heavy. It's got great potential but the weight isn't worth the tradeoff when it comes to perform. Tenergy 05 is good, actually better than good, but it's not as lively on the backhand as MX-P.

I do use 05 on the forehand for now. But both MX-P and Victas V15 Extra are both a very close second.

OhWell said:

Thanks for the input! As I mention above, I have already ordered the Karis M. The combination of very linear speed and spin behavior with a slightly softer sponge seems like what I'm looking for right now.. I'm looking forward to trying it!

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Will you do a review after using it for a while?

Overseer Kevin said:

Gears, gears, and more gears. No! Get MX-P !!!!!! If you want the highest levels of spin and speed on the backhand. If MX-P isn't too your liking, try Victas V-15 Extra for added control in all areas of play on the backhand. Not as dynamic as MX-P but it's less sensitive to incoming spin which adds a bit of control.

See, Mx-s is too dull and too heavy. It's got great potential but the weight isn't worth the tradeoff when it comes to perform. Tenergy 05 is good, actually better than good, but it's not as lively on the backhand as MX-P.

I do use 05 on the forehand for now. But both MX-P and Victas V15 Extra are both a very close second.

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Spin and speed on the backhand can be overrated and control can be heavily underrated. Curious, what's your USATT? It helps me put statements in context.

NextLevel said:

Spin and speed on the backhand can be overrated and control can be heavily underrated. Curious, what's your USATT? It helps me put statements in context.

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Ratings are underrated and context is overrated. I beat 2000 players often. But I suck in tournaments.

Overseer Kevin said:

Ratings are underrated and context is overrated. I beat 2000 players often. But I suck in tournaments.

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Anyone can beat players often when they are not playing their best game or when nothing is on the line or when they play the same people all the time - I beat a 2300 player in my club when he practices serving me stuff that he would not serve me in a tournament match so that he can practice his third balls and counters since I know his game. People who play him in tournaments would never give me a chance of beating him. In tournaments, people force you to use the strokes you don't like to use. In practice matches, people use the strokes they want to practice.

Yesterday, I Was down 2-0, 4-0 to a player in league match (and the 2 games were not even close). Then he ended up losing 9 straight points, I ended up losing 5 straight points, won the next two points, and then won the match in 5 games. Ratings get outdated too if people don't play often - I had a period where I was more 1900 than 2000 this year. PArtly because I was trying out faster equipment.

But maybe those Tenergy 05 shots that were going in when he was up 2-0 weren't so easy to perform when the match got tighter. Maybe those counters from 10 feet off the table were great, but the rubbers were exploited when he had to push the ball short. Maybe the reaction of his rubber to a short topspin serve would not have been as extreme. Or maybe he could have made a few more blocks under pressure.

NextLevel said:

Anyone can beat players often when they are not playing their best game or when nothing is on the line or when they play the same people all the time - I beat a 2300 player in my club when he practices serving me stuff that he would not serve me in a tournament match so that he can practice his third balls and counters since I know his game. People who play him in tournaments would never give me a chance of beating him. In tournaments, people force you to use the strokes you don't like to use. In practice matches, people use the strokes they want to practice.

Yesterday, I Was down 2-0, 4-0 to a player in league match (and the 2 games were not even close). Then he ended up losing 9 straight points, I ended up losing 5 straight points, won the next two points, and then won the match in 5 games. Ratings get outdated too if people don't play often - I had a period where I was more 1900 than 2000 this year. PArtly because I was trying out faster equipment.

But maybe those Tenergy 05 shots that were going in when he was up 2-0 weren't so easy to perform when the match got tighter. Maybe those counters from 10 feet off the table were great, but the rubbers were exploited when he had to push the ball short. Maybe the reaction of his rubber to a short topspin serve would not have been as extreme. Or maybe he could have made a few more blocks under pressure.

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That reminds me of one of our newbies who always keeps telling me who he has beaten in practice matches but hasn't scored once in a competitive match.
NL that was excellent, but wayyyy too serious.
[Emoji2]

Overseer Kevin said:

Ratings are underrated and context is overrated. I beat 2000 players often. But I suck in tournaments.

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Hmmmh, i rather think tournaments are overrated and delivering results when it counts is also overrated!
[Emoji6]

On a more serious note: I think NL has summed it up perfectly.

I'm currently using the Rakza 7 on the forehand after using Vega Pro for a very long time. Will post an in depth comparison in a week or two.

As a summary:

Rakza 7 has a less lively sponge on hard impact but for low to medium impact speeds, both sponges are similar (perhaps the Rakza 7 is just a touch more lively)

Rakza 7 has a fine-pored sponge with a thicker but softer and slighty less grippier topsheet. Vega Pro's topsheet is harder and grippier (among the grippiest I've ever used). For me, Rakza 7 is easier to handle in the short game (receives, pushes, better angle play possible as you can go against the spin). You need to respect the spin a bit more with the Vega Pro but I think serves have a touch more spin but this doesn't make a difference to me as I can serve well with both rubbers.

Vega Pro's sponge has larger pores and therefore you can hit very fast topspins after opening up. In terms of spin, it's very difficult to say but I think that the Rakza's spin was a bit more surprising for me and for my opponents. If you can engage the sponge, you can play some very spinny balls. Vega Pro has high spin on all shots.

In the beginning, I had problems with the Rakza 7 as I was used to contacting the ball very thinly with the Vega Pro. The same did not yield great results with the R7 but once I started to engage the sponge more, I had very good results.

R7 is easier to block with compared to the Vega Pro. The throw angle is a touch lower on all strokes. However, I wouldn't classify them both as blocking rubbers. Active play is rewarded more.

R7 was much better for me for short and long pushes. With VP, the ball would rise (also documented on tt-news.com) but this was not a problem with the R7.

In general, I find the R7 a bit slower and you have to put a bit more effort into it but I'm also using a slower blade. It is not a drastic difference though.

Both rubbers played on an OSP Virtuoso- 89g

Please feel free to ask if there are any more questions

OhWell said:

Sure, would be happy to! Anything in particular you're curious about?

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Whether it helps you keep the ball on the table, or has you making odd errors frequently. Whether it creates danger, helps you put pressure on the opponent, or just makes you provide easy kills.

Whether it offers a wide or a narrow spectrum of techniques well, direct and spin-oriented, offensive and defensive, near and further away from the table.

And if there’s something you miss or find lacking.

NextLevel said:

Anyone can beat players often when they are not playing their best game or when nothing is on the line or when they play the same people all the time - I beat a 2300 player in my club when he practices serving me stuff that he would not serve me in a tournament match so that he can practice his third balls and counters since I know his game. People who play him in tournaments would never give me a chance of beating him. In tournaments, people force you to use the strokes you don't like to use. In practice matches, people use the strokes they want to practice.

Yesterday, I Was down 2-0, 4-0 to a player in league match (and the 2 games were not even close). Then he ended up losing 9 straight points, I ended up losing 5 straight points, won the next two points, and then won the match in 5 games. Ratings get outdated too if people don't play often - I had a period where I was more 1900 than 2000 this year. PArtly because I was trying out faster equipment.

But maybe those Tenergy 05 shots that were going in when he was up 2-0 weren't so easy to perform when the match got tighter. Maybe those counters from 10 feet off the table were great, but the rubbers were exploited when he had to push the ball short. Maybe the reaction of his rubber to a short topspin serve would not have been as extreme. Or maybe he could have made a few more blocks under pressure.

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Haha... lol All the "maybe". I was just explaining that same concept of practice verses real match play to someone else earlier. My best win is beating a 2100 who was he'll bent on beating me 3-0. But, he forgot I was playing too. My best tournament win was a 1900 player, got a couple 1800's a well. My club says i play consistently 1800 with flashes of 2000+ if only i were consistent. My rating would be higher if it weren't for those dag on pips players. Oh yeah, and maybe buying a blade and new rubber the day of the tournament, not the smartest thing. But that dag on EJ in me.

But that's solved now. T05 and MX-P on the Hao 3. Absolutely nothing like it. The Arnold Classic is in for it this year

Suga D said:

That reminds me of one of our newbies who always keeps telling me who he has beaten in practice matches but hasn't scored once in a competitive match.
NL that was excellent, but wayyyy too serious.
[Emoji2]



Hmmmh, i rather think tournaments are overrated and delivering results when it counts is also overrated!
[Emoji6]

On a more serious note: I think NL has summed it up perfectly.

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Come on you know I am serious about my table tennis. As my Rastafari brother would scream in the club when playing, "Come on man, this ain't no Scooby Doo!"

I take that as acknowledgement of successful delivery.

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Good valid comments, MANY players buy Karis from me as they see my spin, but don't get that level, yet, the control is up. Yet, players want it all and look forever.

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