In search of the perfect game ...

jawien · Mar 4, 2018

In search of the perfect game ... or how to "prolong rallies" in table tennis, in order to make the game more appealing for a general pubic and for the spectators, while at the same time still preserving its character.

[RATIONALE]
I dare to say out of the four main racket sports (Tennis, Badminton, Squash and Table Tennis) our sport has the highest number of active players and amateurs involved, yet it still does not translate into the bigger media presence, larger audiences at the events and higher level of professional support for the elite players.
The prize money in big events is not as big as in other sports.

[THE PERFECT GAME]
It is also important to realize what we think is the perfect game?

1. Maybe the current game is a perfect one for you, and needs only better promotion, better ways to televise it, better commentary (explaining its technical aspects)

2. Maybe it should be dominated by an all-around players (defensors included)?

3. Maybe it should be be hard to attack close to the table and rallies far away from the table should be dominant?

4. Maybe you think the third ball attack it the way to go?

5. Maybe hardb... ahh I didn't say it ; ) Well should it be less spin oriented?

[OPTIONS]
Of course there are some obvious options:
- adjusting the net height
- making changes to the surface of the table
- further adjustments to the ball (material, size color)

Less obvious are:
- to regulate serves in a way so that they will be less significant for the game.
- regulate rackets equipment in a way, so that they are not as fast etc.
- regulate rules in general.
- To put more effort on a "grass roots" coaching and developing small clubs.

So what do you think?

Baal · Mar 4, 2018

First technical changes to our sport will accomplish nothing except to probably make things worse.

For example, at the highest level of tbe sport players are already attacking all kinds of serves. The last time the serve was this small of a factor was the 1970s.
Everything the ITTF has done over the last 20 years to accomplish the aim of making the sport more "spectator friendly" has backfired from a player point of view, the latest of many changes being 40+ balls. Count the threads about "dumbing down" the sport.

I beg everyone, stop messing with the sport! Rules and equipment won't make it more popular. Table surface? Yes, let's force every small club and school to buy all new tables on some bet that it won't be terrible. Talk about a destructive change!

Bear in mind TT is very popular in Asia. So in theory it can be popular elsewhere.

The challenge is that every other sport that is not futbol or basketball etc. wonders the same thing, which is how to attract mass following! The sad reality is they never will.

The only thing that sometimes accomplishes this is when some once-in-a-lifetime player dominates the sport in an unprecedented way AND when this person has some sort of interesting life story. Tiger Woods (black golfer, and a prodigy, Asian mother, novel athletic approach to his sport etc.); Lance Armstrong (cancer survivor, American dominating a European sport, etc.) Without them those sports return to where they were before.

So that is what TT needs. The right superstar, and then just hope they don't have a Shakespearian fall from grace like Armstrong or Woods!

By the way, nobody since Barna has had the kind of success I am talking about in our sport.

And if you want Americans or Europeans to be attracted, this transcendent superstar really shouldn't be from Asia. Imagine if Timo Boll had won 4 straight WTTCs and a couple of Olympic golds. Or better yet, Kanac Jha! Now that would get people's attention. Nice kid, immigrant backgrand, from unlikely place to be a TT superstar.

Baal · Mar 4, 2018

By tbe way, I am not trying to pick on Jawien specifically. He is just posing the question. I get that. The problem is that the solutions attempted by ITTF all too often have had really bad unintended consequences. I want to simply state that the problem is in thinking that ANY technical change will change the sport's popularity. It won't.

ajtatosmano2 · Mar 4, 2018

Increase the number of pro players. For this the best solution would be building regional TT academies with lower costs. Here in Hungary I can count the number of clubs who actually own their halls on one hand.

Mimobrok · Mar 4, 2018

Lower speed, higher spin

Crazy curve balls are always fun to watch.

Xylit · Mar 4, 2018

Baal said:
Imagine if Timo Boll had won 4 straight WTTCs and a couple of Olympic golds.

I am convinced that this would not have changed anything.

TT tournaments should have more event character. Table tennis needs someone like Barry Hearn to bring it to a next level (like he is doing with clickball). T2APAC is a very good approach in my opinion. Table tennis needs more money. Someone has to be willing to invest into table tennis business without expecting any profit from it.

songdavid98 · Mar 4, 2018

Here are my thoughts:

I admit that there are problems with table tennis as a spectator sport, but I think the image of table tennis is a bigger issue, meaning it needs better promotion. It's casual unimpressiveness is what everybody will think of if they never see real competitive play.

I have written a paper on this topic for a writing class that I promised to share (but it slipped from my mind), so here it is:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1SEU-gWZB5P4cCb5vg-6ID33OWafKQYGE-gdOr8NaPY4/edit?usp=sharing

Long story short, there's a huge disconnect between what general public think of table tennis, and what is real table tennis.

Most people when they hear a sport like basketball will start talking about professional basketball, and the NBA. Same with football, and baseball. This is mostly because of the lack of American world class players to mention. More successes = more coverage = more attention = more interest in the sport.

*****

On a side note: I agree that the table tennis can be lacking for spectators. However, I think that can be alleviated with a closer, diagonal camera angle. Seeing table tennis up close is mind-blowing, and can leave people in awe. You can see the ball curve, how low the shots are, and see how fast it is really going. Like this video:

But, the angle from above trivializes the sport, making it look unimpressive. Yes, you can see the ball go left/right better, but the ball looks slower. You don't get to see the height of the ball, and you don't get to see the amount of topspin players put on the ball (and see the ball curve down).
I don't know about you guys, but I'd much rather watch 3:27 to 5:37 of this video than the rest of it.

Astorix · Mar 4, 2018

The Sport or the rules isn't the problem. Humans are.

Andy44 · Mar 4, 2018

Some sports are effortlessly telegenic, but not table tennis. Little white balls pinging back and forth for a few seconds at a time. Spin mostly invisible. Hyper-athletic feats of high-speed hand-eye coordination mostly invisible. Face it, it's a great sport for players to play, a good sport for players to watch (and could be better with superior camera work and production values), but fair to poor for non-players to watch. So if we want a sustainably bigger audience in the USA or elsewhere, we need more players. Building up from the grassroots, first of all with good local clubs, with local leagues, then regional leagues, and eventually when enough people are engaged, a national pro league and world tour events. There are no quick fixes.

brokenball · Mar 4, 2018

Play Liha.

Der_Echte · Mar 4, 2018

Der_Echte is not going to so nice and restrained as Baal when it comes to commenting on rule changes that are both silly and immediately/ultimately ineffective.

Suggestions for such rule changes can go stuck some where... and any suggestions to make clubs replace every table can get stuck there too since there is ample room.

Really? We gunna change every table since it is no longer the right size or surface? The ones making such suggestions would need to worry less about sarcastic remarks from those such as I, but be real concerned about the 60 yr old momma/grandma that is gunna get pissed off and on the warpath. Old people who don't care and have nothing to lose are real fearsome in a battle, look out.

I get the idea OP is trying to get at - to examine and discuss things to improve. That in itself is very responsible and rational... and doesn't deserve my sarcasm, so I support the OP in that regard.

Some common rule change suggestions and their effects...

You make it illegal to attack serve, then the pros will have a hay day on 3rd ball attack or whatever is the first ball they are authorized by rules to attack... opponent who must attack first is at a huge disadvantage... such a change will not have intended effect, but make it worse.

You make the ball even bigger and slower, then players will strain even more than they are now to attack all out to win point early... and injure themselves even more... and even more fat, overweight 40-60 year old males will try to whack it harder... and tear their rotator cuff more often... as it is more and more pros have injured hitting shoulders.

Everyone can get where I am going...

However, one thing possible to do without changing a ton of equipment or rules is to find a way to make the ball be more contrasting in real life and in vids... maybe no manufacturing process is yet developed to make the ball a neon pink/lime/orange whatever color and still have functional integrity... even one more variation is to have it neon with checkered pattern of high contrast... this allows spin to be seen on slo-mo replay and a little in real life. That makes it easier for pros to read the ball and less silly mistakes. There is a real possibility of some longer rallies this way. It is not a difficult idea to test out... and accept or reject.

That is about the only sane suggestion I could offer to the discussion. Any other suggestion I make deserves to be stored in the same place I suggested the others go.

mart1nandersson · Mar 4, 2018

It was quite easy to make it extremely popular in Sweden. Beat China with 5-0 in the WC team event. All of a sudden everyone (including myself) started playing organised in clubs. We were doing quite well into the 2000s until it faded out.

I guess that the difference between North America and Europe is that most countries in Europe have got a small but functioning club "infrastructure" that can pickup a sudden surge of youngsters and build from that. Club as in non-profit clubs.

jawien · Mar 4, 2018

"There are no quick fixes" as Andy mentioned and I think this would be even better title for the thread ...

Great point about the general public perception of table tennis Songdavid. If a regular guy was picked up from the street, I bet he would have a hard time differentiating between "World Championships of Ping Pong" and WTT(T)Cs. More than that, tt is generally perceived as a casual sport for those 40-60 years old ; ) Sport with no special needed for athleticism.

Also as Andy44 pointed out tt is hardly telegenic - so true. What is mostly regretful for me is that those "Hyper-athletic feats of high-speed hand-eye coordination are mostly invisible". Maybe the idea of a diagonal camera angle would really be beneficial? I wouldn't see it necessary as a replacement for the traditional centered view but for sure as a great supplement.

I must say I loved watching T2APAC too. The whole approach, and the way it was organized and filmed did catch some true character of tt, namely how social the game is. There was no fence between players and the audience. Sofas everywhere, making it feel like a casual event. I think they explained it also that their aim was to show players personalities. I'm looking forward for the next edition.

Baal and Der expressed their concerns and I will agree that no move is much better that a stupid move. Specially when you can not possibly fully predict the consequences. Not only that, a stability is also something the community of players is expecting.
Baal maybe you are right, maybe tt is genuinely a niche sport (unless you live in China) and from time to time it can have its 5 minutes if the right star was born ... who knows.

Well talking about the changes, the Soccer here in Europe is seen as a very conservative sport. But there were some changes introduced to the rules, quite significant. Like a field player can not make a pass anymore to the goalkeeper while in the penalty area. The ball itself was specially redesigned to be faster and have more unpredictable trajectory.

Talking about the table surface. I borrowed the idea actually from Jorgen Persson (check his podcast with Dan). If you think about it, it is nothing special i.e. in Tennis. Moreover it is almost inherent to the game. Tennis season starts with AO, then there is a ground season ending with Rolland Garros, grass season - Wimbledon and back again to hard courts at the US Open. Surfaces are totally different and there is a reason why Nadal won 10 almost consecutive French Open titles, while only six of other Grand slams.
Why couldn't it be the case in tt? ITTF might introduce some events with slower surfaces. Like a "slow surface" season. Other players specially those vicious 50-60 years old could play their very same tables. No problem right? : )

Lightzy · Mar 4, 2018

Begone foul ITTF demon!
This is almost like the rationale and solution behind socialism rofl.
Make everything worse for everyone and make everyone poor and miserable. UTOPIA ACHIEVED!

I mean yeah I understand what you're saying but surely you understand how abhorrent this garbage is.

jawien · Mar 4, 2018

Lightzy said:
Begone foul ITTF demon!
This is almost like the rationale and solution behind socialism rofl.
Make everything worse for everyone and make everyone poor and miserable. UTOPIA ACHIEVED!

I mean yeah I understand what you're saying but surely you understand how abhorrent this garbage is.

Maybe it is more like a frontier ...
; )

@Regrading to the ball color Der wrote about, I think they tried it in China SL. Can't cite the exact reasons but as far as I know they stopped it.

Lightzy · Mar 5, 2018

I think the 'perfect game' the ittf meddlers have devised is called TTX or something and is of course played by no one.
Unless that was some april fools joke and i wasnt looking at the calander

LordPippington · Mar 5, 2018

Table tennis players are mostly nerds, so I think getting more hot women into the clubs would help attract more players -- right?

Baal · Mar 5, 2018

mart1nandersson said:
It was quite easy to make it extremely popular in Sweden. Beat China with 5-0 in the WC team event. All of a sudden everyone (including myself) started playing organised in clubs. We were doing quite well into the 2000s until it faded out.

I guess that the difference between North America and Europe is that most countries in Europe have got a small but functioning club "infrastructure" that can pickup a sudden surge of youngsters and build from that. Club as in non-profit clubs.

My point exactly.

By the way, there was a noticeable increase in the sport's popularity in the US after "ping pong diplomacy" in 1972. It lasted a few years but the momentum was not sustained. That was when we needed an American good enough to at least be a threat to be a world champion. Alas.....

rainneverever · Mar 5, 2018

I think local stars/heroes, are as important as, if not more important than, national/world stars, to promote a sport locally. People want to see world stars, but maybe once a year. It is local heroes that make them proud.
You may know soccer is very popular, maybe the most popular sport in China. You may think USA men's TT is not good, #38 in ITTF Mar 2018 ranking. Let me tell you, China men's soccer team is way much worse, a laughable #68 in FIFA ranking Feb 2018. But it does not matter at all. China soccer Super league (another super league) has a huuuuuuuuuuuuuuge market. There are foreign players and foreign coaches; but not the most famous ones or not at their prime. Big cities have their own teams, best stadiums and tons of crazy local supporters; of course, there will be "wars" between certain cities. It is not only about stars or levels of performance. There are attachments and pride that local people find in their home team. Without that, the team/sponsor cannot make profit and cannot sustain.
In contrast, many teams in CTTSL do not stay in the same city or the same stadium each season. Some teams even changed home city several times and asked for bidding for certain matches during the past season. Plus, some CTTSL home cities are small cities, without convenient transportation, and stadiums without good ACs. It does not help the growth of local supporters at all. And some tight matches are more thrilling and appealing to spectators, played not by the top stars. You don't really need world champions to make that kind of show.

rainneverever · Mar 5, 2018

BTW, CTTA just held a team tournament in Shanghai mixing CNT, provincial and amateur players in order to "promote" TT. The fixture is 7 sets of bo3, MS1/XD/MS2 (30-39 amateur players)/MD/MS3/WS/MS4(40-49 amateur players). It is said there will be a tour of this team tournament. Will it work out?
http://sports.sina.com.cn/others/pingpang/2018-03-04/doc-ifwnpcnt8674828.shtml

In search of the perfect game ...

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