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  1. EvilOctopus is offline
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    #21
    I'm pretty sure it was just heavily boosted but even then its tough to get hold of legit national versions and the boosters. I was just trying to say that it's not as dead as a normal h3n and a fair bit easier to play but even then required completly different technique

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    #22
    I used to play a slow loop, very much brush contact and so when I recently got back into Table Tennis and knocked off the rust playing with Mark V I decided to try H3-50 and just didn't care for it. I even tried playing with Yasaka Rising and Shining Dragon as a transition (which you might want to give a shot) but still I do not care for the style of play you have to have to get the most out of H3 or any of the tacky linear rubbers. I have since added Gold Arc 8 to the other side of the bat I have H3-50 on and I actually like it. And it is different enough from Tenergy that it is interesting and may lead to me playing more like the chinese style. But I am with several of the others here. If you like the fast play of the European style then don't bother switching- its a lot of work with little sign of improvement for a long while until you catch on to it.

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    #23

    why did you go back to tenergy after a couple of years with H3?


  4. Der_Echte is online now
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    #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Sam Alender
    I am 2 years in to developing my table tennis abilities and am going to be competing in my first tournament this November. I have been using promarially euro rubbers (last 8 months using Sriver) and recently tried H3 because I wanted something with a bit more speed. I was ignorant and was not aware at the time that H3 required more arm speed while brushing the ball to actually produce the desired speed. I am struggling with this adjustment as I tend to still want to hit the ball rather than the desired brushing technique. So my question is should I transition back to a softer sponge euro rubber or should I just deal with the H3, adjust to it, and go from there?
    Hi Sam,

    You are facing an issue that every place faces early in their evolution: The enticement of other equipment and what to settle on... and what to stick with or should someone stick with something.

    The more experienced players and coaches will say pretty much the same thing in a different way. What they all pretty much say is to get equipment that will make it easy enough to learn the fundamentals... and STICK WITH IT until the fundamentals grow to a point (and the player figures out their impact and play preferences) and re-baseline at that point... maybe a couple re-baselines as growth happens.

    I saw someone say to stick with H3. If you are getting professional help, particularly on how to develop a foundational FH with a huge bat speed and a huge power transfer, then YES, a very excellent suggestion. If you are to develop into an allround control style of play... H3 is surprisingly appropriate for controlling an incoming ball if you use a stroke (and know how to adjust grip pressure).

    When I moved to California several years ago, I was already cracking into the top ten percent of players... but I wasn't (nor am I now) fully developed as a player. TTD member erm, who is the world's largest EJ and a former national youth player, had me try a gazillion equipments to see what was more suitable for my kind of stroke, impact, and play style. It turned out for my FH, softer rubbers worked better for me. I was more consistent. I continued to play vs and with erm and a few better players, of course I got better gradually.

    So, for a year or so, I used softer rubbers on FH and did well, improving tourney results. When MX-K rubber came out, I slapped MX-K 47 on FH... that was for oh, say 1.5 years... I adjusted to that rubber and now maybe a medium rubber was my center of mass. I again improve my tourney results to mid 2000s rating. When Etika came out 5-6 months ago, I started using 51 degree sponge on FH... now after that, I can now control the depth of impact on a firm rubber. I broke out a Nate custom blade I didn't use in a year (some alsaka wood outer blade) that had MX-K 47 on it... Now when I strike the ball with that blade and 47 MX-K, it sounds like I speed glued that sucker !!

    THAT (progressively moving up in sponge firmness when ready) is what got my current FH impact. It is a LOT better than 2-3 years ago when I really started to move up in level.

    There is no single correct answer in TT, but the experienced players and coaches have seen a lot and can tell you ways that will work. More than one of them will do it.
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  5. brokenball is offline
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    #25
    H3 commercial has has a high spin to speed ratio if you like brushing. H3 commercial is not fast. H3N is better. I played with my coaches H3 National. I was not impressed. It was yet another expensive rubber. Most of us are not pros and NEVER will be pros. Why spend a lot of money on rubbers when not matter how "good" the rubber is, you will always be the limiting factor. One doesn't need fast rubbers until they start play away from the table. Fast rubbers lower the spin to speed ratio.

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    #26
    I recently tried putting H3Neo on a thicker carbon blade, to correct for its inherent slowness. Indeed, on the thicker blade, H3Neo doesnt feel slow at all. It actually feels fast. The issue now though, is that the dwell time is lower so its hard to generate as much spin. Loops have a tendency to go out.Â

  7. Dominikk85 is offline
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    #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Der_Echte
    Hi Sam,You are facing an issue that every place faces early in their evolution: The enticement of other equipment and what to settle on... and what to stick with or should someone stick with something.The more experienced players and coaches will say pretty much the same thing in a different way. What they all pretty much say is to get equipment that will make it easy enough to learn the fundamentals... and STICK WITH IT until the fundamentals grow to a point (and the player figures out their impact and play preferences) and re-baseline at that point... maybe a couple re-baselines as growth happens.I saw someone say to stick with H3. If you are getting professional help, particularly on how to develop a foundational FH with a huge bat speed and a huge power transfer, then YES, a very excellent suggestion. If you are to develop into an allround control style of play... H3 is surprisingly appropriate for controlling an incoming ball if you use a stroke (and know how to adjust grip pressure).When I moved to California several years ago, I was already cracking into the top ten percent of players... but I wasn't (nor am I now) fully developed as a player. TTD member erm, who is the world's largest EJ and a former national youth player, had me try a gazillion equipments to see what was more suitable for my kind of stroke, impact, and play style. It turned out for my FH, softer rubbers worked better for me. I was more consistent. I continued to play vs and with erm and a few better players, of course I got better gradually.So, for a year or so, I used softer rubbers on FH and did well, improving tourney results. When MX-K rubber came out, I slapped MX-K 47 on FH... that was for oh, say 1.5 years... I adjusted to that rubber and now maybe a medium rubber was my center of mass. I again improve my tourney results to mid 2000s rating. When Etika came out 5-6 months ago, I started using 51 degree sponge on FH... now after that, I can now control the depth of impact on a firm rubber. I broke out a Nate custom blade I didn't use in a year (some alsaka wood outer blade) that had MX-K 47 on it... Now when I strike the ball with that blade and 47 MX-K, it sounds like I speed glued that sucker !!THAT (progressively moving up in sponge firmness when ready) is what got my current FH impact. It is a LOT better than 2-3 years ago when I really started to move up in level.There is no single correct answer in TT, but the experienced players and coaches have seen a lot and can tell you ways that will work. More than one of them will do it.

    Timo also said he started with soft rubbers and gradually moved to harder ones, so that is probably a pretty common transition.Video is in German unfortunately with no English subs though
    https://youtu.be/DimngFxZPoc

    Rough Translation:
    -first I didn't care about it and just played what my father bought me-as I got better and got better coaches I started thinking more about equipment
    - then I started to use very soft rubbers. Advantage is you feel like the the ball is longer on the racket and ball goes deeper into the sponge so it it easier to control
    -also today modern softer rubbers have like a catapult effect so you can compensate for weaker physical strength as the rubber is helping you-the better I got the harder rubbers I played, especially forehand I now play extremely hard​​​​​
    -I now need less support and harder rubbers have less catapult. The harder rubber thus helps less but it gives you a very true feedback and does exactly what you put in if you have good technique-harder rubber also helps if you are rushed as ball tends to throw a little higher, with soft rubber ball can die a little if you just manage to touch it and fall down into the net
    -softer rubbers allow for more power from far behind the table, then you have to decide if you play closer or farther back
    -boll said kreanga played very soft rubbers with a very fast blade and I play closer with a more medium paced blade

    Obv Timo is not a physicist and describes more feel so I don't know if this is 100% correct based of physics but still interesting

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    Last edited by Dominikk85; 10-29-2021 at 08:27 AM.

  8. Der_Echte is online now
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    #28
    On the H3, I saw a 2300ish level player use that rubber as a controlled counter, controlled offensive player with some allround tendencies who did NOT have the prototypical offensive power game. He used the slowness and the tackiness to softly sidespin counter many kinds of shots.

    Of course, his reading of oppoent, aility to get there in position on time, his feel and touch, especially grip change, along with his tactical shot selection made him real trouble on the table vs offensive players.

    He did not play an outright defensive game, but that slow, normal H3 rubber and his skillset/inclinations allowed him to easily control incoming spin and slow it down with sidespin... that gave FITS to many offensive players and disrupted them in several ways.
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    #29
    Couple of weeks ago I tried someone's H3 (neo?)prov BS UNboosted, on a X5 and was truly impressed. Ispired by it I BOOOOsted a new H3Neo Prov OS and glued it on mine rather fastish(kinda a flexible) Andro NovacellOff/S. Although it isn't slow I was expecting more feel, at least the same as with the above mentioned X5.

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  10. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Der_Echte
    Hi Sam,You are facing an issue that every place faces early in their evolution: The enticement of other equipment and what to settle on... and what to stick with or should someone stick with something.

    Der, how did you get sucked into commenting on a post in a thread from 3+ years ago as though this thread is current?

    Last edited by UpSideDownCarl; 4 Weeks Ago at 01:34 PM.
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  11. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #31
    Quote Originally Posted by timcable

    why did you go back to tenergy after a couple of years with H3?

    timcable, what caused you to wake up this 3+ year old thread and confuse all these people who are now trying to help someone who asked a question years ago?

    I would be interested to know if Sam is still playing TT. The last post he made on this forum was in August 2018.

    It is worth reading dates of previous posts guys.

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    #32
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl

    timcable, what caused you to wake up this 3+ year old thread and confuse all these people who are now trying to help someone who asked a question years ago?

    I would be interested to know if Sam is still playing TT. The last post he made on this forum was in August 2018.

    It is worth reading dates of previous posts guys.

    Hi Carl,
    Hope you're well today.
    In timcable's defence he's new to TTD (only 2 posts I see) and so won't yet be on top of the 'etiquette' of the forum.
    Timcable is possibly wondering about the choice between Chinese-style and Euro/Jap-style rubbers himself (as many of us are!), saw that there's a thread along those lines, and posted his question there. It's an understandable thing given that, as members, we're also discouraged from starting new threads if there's an existing one that addresses the same issue.
    No harm done 👍!
    Have a great weekend!


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    #33
    There is a couple of reasons people don't use H3:

    1-DHS quality control isn't enough consistent to sell you always the same quality, it's the same you buy Provincial or National also checked are real DHS products at DHS web verification code.

    2-It's more easy to generate topspin with Euro/Japanese rubbers than H3, with H3 you need your body very low, your knees completely bent and when you are going up turn the hip.

    Mine opinion, I got several rubbers and only one very good, this one was so excellent that no one Euro or Japanese rubber can generate the same amount of spin, also the spin generated was a lot of dangerous because the low throw.

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  14. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Manto76

    Hi Carl,
    Hope you're well today.
    In timcable's defence he's new to TTD (only 2 posts I see) and so won't yet be on top of the 'etiquette' of the forum.
    Timcable is possibly wondering about the choice between Chinese-style and Euro/Jap-style rubbers himself (as many of us are!), saw that there's a thread along those lines, and posted his question there. It's an understandable thing given that, as members, we're also discouraged from starting new threads if there's an existing one that addresses the same issue.
    No harm done !
    Have a great weekend!

    Oh, I was just seeing if I could get him to make another comment.

    I don’t really care if a thread like this is woken up. There can be benefits as long as people don’t think they are trying to help someone who hasn’t been on the forum in a while (Der_Echte) and are making posts for people still interested in the subject.

    People who have been on the forum for a while should know to look at dates of posts. But still, comments like Der’s still have good quality educational value.

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    #35
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    ... comments like Der’s still have good quality educational value.
    Indeed they do! As a fairly recent returnee to the sport I've learnt a lot (and saved myself a lot of money!) by sifting through the discussions on this forum. 👍

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    #36
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl

    Der, how did you get sucked into commenting on a post in a thread from 3+ years ago as though this thread is current?

    Beacause what I said needed to be said.

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    #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Der_Echte

    ... TTD member erm, who is the world's largest EJ and a former national youth player, had me try a gazillion equipments to see what was more suitable for my kind of stroke, impact, and play style. It turned out for my FH, softer rubbers worked better for me. I was more consistent. I continued to play vs and with erm and a few better players, of course I got better gradually.


    So, for a year or so, I used softer rubbers on FH and did well, improving tourney results.

    Hi Der,
    Hope you're having a nice weekend.
    You mention that you spent some time with soft rubbers on the FH; a couple of questions in that regard if I may:


    1. Did you also use soft rubbers on the BH? And, if not, why not?
    2. By "softer" do you mean around 43-degrees? (I think I recall from somewhere else on the forum that you used Evolution FX-S, is that correct?)

    Many thanks!


  18. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Manto76

    Hi Der,
    Hope you're having a nice weekend.
    You mention that you spent some time with soft rubbers on the FH; a couple of questions in that regard if I may:


    1. Did you also use soft rubbers on the BH? And, if not, why not?
    2. By "softer" do you mean around 43-degrees? (I think I recall from somewhere else on the forum that you used Evolution FX-S, is that correct?)

    Many thanks!

    Years ago, Der used to use Aurus Soft on FH. That was back before FXS existed.

    Der has amazing touch on both FH and BH and has more power than most, even several levels higher than him on his BH.

    I remember seeing him use H3 (commercial, brick hard, unboosted, 3 years old, dead as a doornail on his BH without any loss of power or performance when we were goofing around maybe 7-8 years ago. I told him it had the playing characteristics of a soggy banana peel. But he made some amazing shots with that rubber because his BH is pretty darn powerful.

    Last edited by UpSideDownCarl; 4 Weeks Ago at 01:30 AM.
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  19. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Der_Echte

    Beacause what I said needed to be said.

    It is true. What you said was good for the forum. It would have been even more useful if your post had started with: "I know this is an old dead thread. But this is what I would have told Sam 3 years ago, if I had seen the thread back when Sam was actually on the forum."

    hahahahaha.

    Now the goon squad is definitely going to come after me.

    Say, is that Seo Hyo Won over there? Gotta go!
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    #40
    Carl, you gotta saything negative about her makeup to get the Goonies after you.
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