BH/FH rubbers around 42° hardness

Wister · Dec 4, 2018

Hello everybody

Sadly i'm back on the road for a new rubber..

I play Andro Rasanter R42 2mm on my FH and rakza 7 soft 2mm on my BH. I need to change my BH and initially thought to put R42 on my BH but finally i'm not very convinced with R42

Especially i feel like it lack grip and take the dust very quickly. Now i even need to clean it twice per session (at the beginning and around the middle). Is it only me or anyone got the same kind of feeling/feedback ? The rubbers is 2 months old and i play 4 days/week

Otherwise i was pretty much satisfied with even if i felt a lot less control than when i had rakza 7 soft on my FH.

I'd like something
- Around 41 - 43° hardness
- With good grip
- Pretty forgiving (my technics is good, i can do + 10 loops in a row but i really don't like when the ball is not griped and the spin is not imparted on the ball then the ball go out or net. I hope you see what i mean)
- Don't care too much about speed, i can impart a lot myself
- if possible in 2mm. (P.S : Is there a big difference between 2mm and 2.1mm ? Sometimes the rubbers are only sold in 1.9 and 2.1..)

I was mainly thinking for FH and BH :
- Bluestom Z3
- Bluefire JP 03
- Bluefire bigslam
- Stiga Mantra S
- Tibhar Aurus soft

Do you have any suggestions ? Thanks a lot !

langel · Dec 4, 2018

Xiom vega Europe is 42.5

Wister · Dec 4, 2018

Thanks for the new idea

I looked deeper into the mantra S and i've especially noticed that Yogi Bear says it's very grippy and a bit slower than Fx-p. It sounds like a good answer to what i look for ?

I played a bit with H3N and i really liked the grip effect i felt with so to have something grippy is a bit important, i feel

Also again, if i go to 2.1mm instead of my usual 2mm, is it same same ?

Lightzy · Dec 5, 2018

Sounds to me like what you're missing is that feeling of 'bite' on the ball that the old rubbers like rakza 7 have.
Isn't the rakza7 about 43-44 degrees? Why not just use that if you're used to it and want that kind of grip?

Chinese tacky rubbers have a completely different feeling and you won't find one as soft as that anyway so I wouldn't recommend.

And yeah you won't get that 'bite' with Rasanters etc. I personally found the rasanters to be shitty for the same reason. No bite to the topsheet, completely sponge-reliant, which feels as if it's limiting shot variation, spin variation. And also it tries to be a fast rubber at the same time... Something about it is just totally off, in my estimation.

Lightzy · Dec 5, 2018

Sounds to me like what you're missing is that feeling of 'bite' on the ball that the old rubbers like rakza 7 have.
Isn't the rakza7 about 43-44 degrees? Why not just use that if you're used to it and want that kind of grip?

That said, the Z3 is a good choice I think, of all the rubbers you mentioned.
Or actually even a markV can be great according to your description. A rubber with great bite on the ball, you can create excellent spin with it if power, as you say, is no issue.

And yeah you won't get that 'bite' with Rasanters etc. I personally found the rasanters to be crappy for the same reason. No bite to the topsheet, completely sponge-reliant, which feels as if it's limiting shot variation, spin variation. And also it tries to be a fast rubber at the same time... Something about it is just totally off in my estimation.

Wister · Dec 5, 2018

Lightzy said:
Sounds to me like what you're missing is that feeling of 'bite' on the ball that the old rubbers like rakza 7 have.
Isn't the rakza7 about 43-44 degrees? Why not just use that if you're used to it and want that kind of grip?

That said, the Z3 is a good choice I think, of all the rubbers you mentioned.
Or actually even a markV can be great according to your description. A rubber with great bite on the ball, you can create excellent spin with it if power, as you say, is no issue.

And yeah you won't get that 'bite' with Rasanters etc. I personally found the rasanters to be crappy for the same reason. No bite to the topsheet, completely sponge-reliant, which feels as if it's limiting shot variation, spin variation. And also it tries to be a fast rubber at the same time... Something about it is just totally off in my estimation.

Yes that's it, i felt a kind of bite with rakza. I was not aware about the evolution of rubbers about it, is it for all new rubbers ? Why is it so ?

About playing with rakza, the 7 non soft is more around 47° i think and i tried it and it's a bit too fast for me. And the soft version was very good but it's only 40° and i've heard that it's a bit too soft and it bottom out too quickly, that's why i'm looking for something a bit harder

You think Z3 have a better grip ? It's the one i hesitate the more with mantra S

Happy to hear you got the same feeling as me with R42

Airoc · Dec 5, 2018

Wister said:
I looked deeper into the mantra S and i've especially noticed that Yogi Bear says it's very grippy and a bit slower than Fx-p. It sounds like a good answer to what i look for ?

It is a marvellous rubber. Quite a shame that in my country people shy away from Stiga now, because of the quality issues they had with some rubbers.
"Japanese" feeling as close to tenergy series as it gets, yet a little more affordable.

Wister said:
Also again, if i go to 2.1mm instead of my usual 2mm, is it same same ?

Statistically, you may have already played with 2.1 mm.
What lands in the packaging as "2.0" pretty much goes all the way from "1.8x" to "2.1x", considering 2.0 sits between 1.8 and "max".
You shouldn´t worry.

yogi_bear · Dec 5, 2018

Stiga Calibra LT Sound is a soft rubber awesome for bh.

Wister · Dec 5, 2018

Thanks Airoc, it encourages me toward the mantra S

Yogi Bear, i think i will use the same on my FH and BH so the calibra LT looks a bit too soft i think (35° ?)

I'm wondering, what do we mean by 'japanese feeling' rubbers ? What is the overall difference ?
Also Lightzy talked about the new rubbers having less 'feeling of bite'. Is it a general trend and is there a reason behind that ?

Lightzy · Dec 5, 2018

I don't know mantra. I know it's a ****ING FAST rubber, but that's not first hand experience.

My first hand experience with Z3 was very good. Awesomely spinny.

Also it's not all new rubbers that don't have the same bite on the ball. The Rasanter certainly doesn't. I don't know all the others but I suspect they're the same style. But that said it's also not 'all' new rubbers. There are a lot of new rubbers that are meant to evolve the old bitey style of topsheet, like the new hexer etc.

Suga D · Dec 5, 2018

Well, both Rasanter R/V and Bluestorm Z1/2/3 series are from the newest ESN generation same as Gewo Nexxus series or Joola Rhyzer series.
But as you can imagine every company has their own recipe to bake a cake, and everyone will taste a little different, if you get what I'm meaning.
ESN produces to the likes and needs of their customers. Some of them might emphasize more on speed while others might prefer and choose other things.
Saying every ESN rubber is the same is just like saying all Sunflex rubbers are the same. (they are oem-producing for many other companies just like ESN does).

Lightzy · Dec 5, 2018

btw what is actually the hardness of rakza 7?
Can anyone confirm for sure?

On their website they have a hardness rating of 1-5, where markV 30 (practically replacing the sponge with a half full water baloon) is rated 2+ (???) and Rakza 7 is rated 4.
For all I know their "hardness 4 out of 5" can be 40 but I remember the Rakza7 feeling kind of like Tibhar Genius etc, something like 42-44

langel · Dec 5, 2018

The hardness of Rakza 7 is absolutely impossble "to be cofirmed".
It varies between 45-50, but I'm sure its range is wider.

trumpet_guy · Dec 5, 2018

Gewo Nexxus EL Pro 43 is a fine choice, and I use it in 2.1mm thickness. This should be a close match to Bluestorm Z3.

Lightzy · Dec 5, 2018

langel said:
The hardness of Rakza 7 is absolutely impossble "to be cofirmed".
It varies between 45-50, but I'm sure its range is wider.

varies between 45-50?! wtf

Wister · Dec 5, 2018

One of the main supplier in France (Wack sport) note rakza 7 as 47.5° and i find them to be accurate (never found another hardness specified somewhere else than what they told)

http://www.wsport.com/catalogue/?todo=aff_revs

Lightzy · Dec 5, 2018

Wister said:
One of the main supplier in France (Wack sport) note rakza 7 as 47.5° and i find them to be accurate (never found another hardness specified somewhere else than what they told)

http://www.wsport.com/catalogue/?todo=aff_revs

I have some doubts because Yasaka use a 1-5 rating where Rakza7 is 4. They have rubbers that are 4+, so what would that be? 50? They have no rubber that's even close to that hard really (and the rakza9/rakzaX are supposed to be 4+), and there's even a 5 on the scale.

I'm going back to my bet that the 7 is somwhere around 43-45, but I suppose that, ****, who knows.

Wister · Dec 5, 2018

Personally i found this one their website (amazingly bad looking website btw.. ahah). Rakza 7 around 45 - 50°

shinshiro · Dec 5, 2018

Lightzy said:
I have some doubts because Yasaka use a 1-5 rating where Rakza7 is 4. They have rubbers that are 4+, so what would that be? 50? They have no rubber that's even close to that hard really (and the rakza9/rakzaX are supposed to be 4+), and there's even a 5 on the scale.

I'm going back to my bet that the 7 is somwhere around 43-45, but I suppose that, ****, who knows.

Wister said:
Personally i found this one their website (amazingly bad looking website btw.. ahah). Rakza 7 around 45 - 50°

Wister is right, I have just checked Yasaka Japan website (I can't read in japanese, but I'm almost sure that these numbers indicates sponge hardness...)
https://www.yasakajp.com/items/rakza_7/

Rakza 7 = 45~50
Rakza 7 Soft = 37~42

Rakza 9 = 40~45

Rakza X = 45~50
Rakza X Soft = 40~45

Shining Dragon = 45~50
Rising Dragon = 47~52

If you can read japanese, here is a comparison chart between all Yasaka rubbers:
https://www.yasakajp.com/performance_rubber/

Lightzy · Dec 6, 2018

Great thanks.
Strange that the 7 will be rated 4 hardness, the 9 is rated 4+, but they both have the same hardness according to the other site.

ALSO wtf how can they be so terribly inconsistent?
Shit, even Palio with their $10 rubbers have a more consistent process (within like 2 degrees)

BH/FH rubbers around 42° hardness

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