Advice for training blade- Xiom Musa Asia vs. Yasaka Sweden Extra?

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Hi all, this is my first time posting on this forum, but I’ve been reading for a while. I’m a relatively new player, but I’m athletic with good hand eye coordination. playing with a Bty Hadraw VK, T05 on fh, T05fx on the bh. When I keep good form, my hard loops are hard for more intermediate players to return, as they kick hard off the table, and carry good sidespin in addition to the topspin. However, I think the T05/Hadraw vk is a little to quick for my form just yet. I send a fair number of fh topspin shots long. They’re either really good, nice shots, or they miss badly. There doesn’t seem to be much middle ground. It’s frustrating. I’m thinking about getting a slower set up to work on my form with, based on various posts around the forum. Those two blades were mentioned. I’ve got a set of mark V rubbers ready to go, based upon recommendations from better players at my club. I figure I can work on my form with the mark V’s, then experiment with some speed glue with them after I’ve moved back to my main set up— just for fun. Anyway, it seems like a more controlled blade with a more forgiving rubber would allow me to work on my form more easily, Thoughts? Other blades I should consider? I’d like to keep the cost under $75. The less the better. Thanks in advance guys!
 
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First things first, you can try the Mark Vs you've bought on the VK, and see how that goes.
Otherwise yes, most 5-ply all+/off- blades on the market would do nicely and Sweden Extra is a popular choice (with good reason). Donic Appelgren has a very good feeling too, a tad softer than the Extra if I recall correctly and I like it better than Stiga Allround Classic (personal preference, really) which is the other obvious go to blade in your situation.



Also, welcome to the forum!
 
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I think you may be one of the few people that actually is wise enough to go from a faster to a slower setup. I think this will be good for your technique. But going from tenergy to Mark V will be alot slower, and i agree with the above that you could try them on your current faster blade. Many of my players play with the Extra and it seems to be a good blade. I think it is not really that slow and feels quite bouncy.

I also think you should try thinking about the technique and shot selection. If you miss something have gone wrong with the motion compared when the ball hits the table. Try thinking what have happened and correct this. A fast way to become safe is to try to do the same shot/motion all the time and move the legs instead. If you miss at the same way all the time you need to change something, can not do the same mistake all the time. I also think that it is important that you play hard on the right type of balls, this may be a reason why you miss.
 
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I think you may be one of the few people that actually is wise enough to go from a faster to a slower setup. I think this will be good for your technique. But going from tenergy to Mark V will be alot slower, and i agree with the above that you could try them on your current faster blade. Many of my players play with the Extra and it seems to be a good blade. I think it is not really that slow and feels quite bouncy.

I also think you should try thinking about the technique and shot selection. If you miss something have gone wrong with the motion compared when the ball hits the table. Try thinking what have happened and correct this. A fast way to become safe is to try to do the same shot/motion all the time and move the legs instead. If you miss at the same way all the time you need to change something, can not do the same mistake all the time. I also think that it is important that you play hard on the right type of balls, this may be a reason why you miss.


I think you’re right about technique/shot selection, I may be misreading the amount of spin on the incoming ball, and blowing the return. That, and sometimes I just flat out hit the ball instead of brushing it by mistake- usually because I’m out of position. That doesn’t usually work out well with the 05 on my fh lol. How much slower should I expect the Mark V’s to be on the Vk than the Tenergy? The blade’s speed is supposed to comparable to the Korbel. I’ll give it a shot for sure. Thanks for all the feed back guys!


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It is hard to say. Going from faster to slower is often a hard adjustment for people. The first experience is dissatisfaction with the slower setup. It is an adjustment that is worth taking the time (at least a few months) to fully get used to. Ultimately, if you play solely with the slower setup and really fully get used to it, your mechanics will improve and you will find how to get the power from your strokes rather than from the equipment. So it is worth sticking it out. Because it will help your mechanics improve in ways many people would not understand or think of.

With a fast setup, you can have mediocre form and the setup will do a lot of the work for you and you can end up not realizing your form needs to improve.

With a slower setup, you have to do a lot more right, your form has to improve, for you to get the power into your shots. And when that happens, you can get more out of any setup.

I actually would recommend slightly different stuff. Truthfully, Mark V and either blade you are thinking of would be fine. But I think, perhaps, using more modern rubbers with a slightly slower blade (so, faster spinnier rubbers, slower blade = same overall setup speed) would make more sense.

Mark V are good. But they are a totally different breed of rubbers than the ones you are used to and eventually you are probably going to go back to modern rubbers. So, I say you could stick with modern rubbers and go down to a slightly slower blade than the ones listed above.

Something like:

1) Appelgren Allplay with the rubbers you already are using.
2) Appelgren Allplay with Xiom Vega Pro (a rubber with a little more control than Tenergy but still a similar class of rubber).

If you wanted a blade that was slightly faster thant he Appelgren Allplay at a certain point, a step up in speed with a similar quality of control, feel and dwell time would be a Primorac Off-.

The reason I am recommending Allplay is, the ply construction:

Limba-Limba-Ayous-Limba-Limba

Primorac Off- has the same ply construction. The Limba-Limba top and middle ply combination is excellent for helping a player develop their strokes. Whereas the harder top ply of a blade like the Sweden Extra, actually requires a little more precision from the player despite the speed class.

In the end, any of the choices you were thinking of without my input would be fine. I just think slightly slower blade and same rubbers or smaller change in rubbers may be more useful for you based on the description of your play.
 
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It is hard to say. Going from faster to slower is often a hard adjustment for people. The first experience is dissatisfaction with the slower setup. It is an adjustment that is worth taking the time (at least a few months) to fully get used to. Ultimately, if you play solely with the slower setup and really fully get used to it, your mechanics will improve and you will find how to get the power from your strokes rather than from the equipment. So it is worth sticking it out. Because it will help your mechanics improve in ways many people would not understand or think of.

With a fast setup, you can have mediocre form and the setup will do a lot of the work for you and you can end up not realizing your form needs to improve.

With a slower setup, you have to do a lot more right, your form has to improve, for you to get the power into your shots. And when that happens, you can get more out of any setup.

I actually would recommend slightly different stuff. Truthfully, Mark V and either blade you are thinking of would be fine. But I think, perhaps, using more modern rubbers with a slightly slower blade (so, faster spinnier rubbers, slower blade = same overall setup speed) would make more sense.

Mark V are good. But they are a totally different breed of rubbers than the ones you are used to and eventually you are probably going to go back to modern rubbers. So, I say you could stick with modern rubbers and go down to a slightly slower blade than the ones listed above.

Something like:

1) Appelgren Allplay with the rubbers you already are using.
2) Appelgren Allplay with Xiom Vega Pro (a rubber with a little more control than Tenergy but still a similar class of rubber).

If you wanted a blade that was slightly faster thant he Appelgren Allplay at a certain point, a step up in speed with a similar quality of control, feel and dwell time would be a Primorac Off-.

The reason I am recommending Allplay is, the ply construction:

Limba-Limba-Ayous-Limba-Limba

Primorac Off- has the same ply construction. The Limba-Limba top and middle ply combination is excellent for helping a player develop their strokes. Whereas the harder top ply of a blade like the Sweden Extra, actually requires a little more precision from the player despite the speed class.

In the end, any of the choices you were thinking of without my input would be fine. I just think slightly slower blade and same rubbers or smaller change in rubbers may be more useful for you based on the description of your play.

Thank you for your response! I’ll check out the Applegren Allplay. Anyone have a used one they want to sell? Haha


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Just out of curiosity, does anyone have an opinion on the Xiom Musa Asia?

I haven't played with that blade personally but local Xiom distributor praised it highly and compared it to Xiom Offensive S which is similar to Korbel so probably a bit faster then Yasaka Extra.

Its peculiarity is jointless limba as outer layer - not sure if this actually does something or is just a marketing gimmick but so far it has good reviews on tabletennis11
 
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says Spin and more spin.
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I haven't played with that blade personally but local Xiom distributor praised it highly and compared it to Xiom Offensive S which is similar to Korbel so probably a bit faster then Yasaka Extra.

Its peculiarity is jointless limba as outer layer - not sure if this actually does something or is just a marketing gimmick but so far it has good reviews on tabletennis11

That is not a peculiarity. That is just awkward wording. What they are saying is, they won't make the outer ply out of more than one piece of wood. Sometimes when you look at certain mass produced blades, some of the plies are made from two separate pieces of wood that are joined in the process of laminating the plies. This happens when smaller pieces for individual blades are cut from giant pieces made to produce several blades.

joined plies.jpg

In the photo of this large piece of plywood, the top ply has 6 seams and 7 separate pieces. The piece all the way to the left and all the way to the right are partial segments. The others are seem to be complete segments. Further, in that photo you can see that the joined segments are from a thicker block of wood that was cut into thinner layers. There are several grain characteristics that are present in each of the segments that show this. The segments were laid side by side to form the top layer of the piece of plywood when they laminated it.

I believe the phrase "Jointless Limba Outer Ply" refers to the idea that Xiom is saying they will only use complete pieces of wood for the top ply. No joints, no seams, as in the photo above.

One unfortunate thing about the wording is, it sounds like they are okay with using joined layers for middle and core plies. Regardless of which ply, joined plies make for slightly less consistent playing characteristics. This practice does affect quality.

Higher quality blades only use whole pieces for all plies.

However, the amount it affects quality is not really enough for it to matter for most players. For a mid level player or lower, it would not really make much of a difference. The slightly lower quality makes for a blade that will cost less. This is totally fine for a beginner to intermediate level player. If you were an elite amateur, you may not want that. But you also may not care. It is a little fussy to care about this. But TT company marketing is often quite odd. :)
 
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