Table Tennis arm and shoulder injury - Allwood vs Composite

Hi all,

I've changed in December to a quality allwood blade, AVX BT777, and changed to chinese rubber on BH, an attempt to trying to improve my BH technique, before I try SP on BH, as in match play I hit more than loop on BH and the bouncy nature of tensors/Tenergies makes me go far from the table lobbing. So, I love the feel of this blade, enough flex and still solid, I can make good receives and super spinny loops. About BH rubber, it is so pleasant to practice with, I can handle easier chinese rubber on BH, easier receives, can loop underspin and can loop more consistently(while praticing). But I've noticed that(in match play):

- I need to hit much harder both in BH and FH;
- It's harder to put pressure to opponent, maybe because I was used to faster blades;
- They easily counterattack or block my loops, as they got spinnier and easier to make full swing loop, but they got slower, and the effort is bigger;
- My BH in matchplay isn't that good, because I play too FH oriented and I have to play more active with my BH with this rubber, because neither hit or lob are the strengths of this rubber.

That was my last attempt to change to SP on BH. It was the most pleasant rubber to pratice with, but it seems in match play, without the right amount of praticing hours needed, it will be difficult to change the way I play, as I'm only loosing points, because hit isn't strong and can't lob. So as I've posted on another thread, I'll focus on my strong points. I'm not hoping a quick fix, I'll have to endure some losses until I can play better with SP.

Unfortunately, as this equipment forced me to do much more effort on my strokes, it caused pain in my shoulder and in my arm, that forced me to stop as I stopped playing for now until it gets worse. I'll go to doctor to see how much time I need to stop from TT until I fully recover from my arm and shoulder.

So, I'm not asking for a new blade or so. The reason I've changed to allwood was mainly because my poor BH, because I could do strong hit's and lobs, but the loop was weak and the receives also(couldn't handle the spin sensivity). But with SP thats not a reason to stick with allwood, as my FH technique is solid and I can adapt easily to any blade, plus I'm thin and fit right now. And I'm afraid that the pain comes back if I mantain the BT777, as I need to make big effort, so I was asking if in this case it would be better to return to composite.

Best Regards,
Eduardo

Lula said:

I have a hard time seeing that you have gotten an injury because of the slower all wood blade, and i do not think the difference in speed is so big between composite and all wood that this will do much difference. Maybe you just have trained to much. I can imagine that if you went from inverted to short pimples that you have changed your technique and stroke a little and this have been a strain for your arm and shoulder because they are not used to the motion. In my opinion, if you play correctly with a short pimple you need short contact with the ball so you need to tense a little to stop the motion. Maybe this can be a reason. Hard to answer this.

My sister used to be a physiotherapist and she recommend rubber band training alot for shoulder problems. Maybe you can try that.

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Thank you for the answer! I didn't changed yet, but I've already ordered them to change, as I think that I'll benefit more from SP! I got the injury with the inverted. But with chinese in BH I need to make much effort on my BH stroke, and my injury started on BH.

But maybe you're right. I've been praticing in one of my clubs and mostly I play there with players that are lower level than my and the praticing consistency are not so good, the number of balls we hit is not too much, but in the last two weeks I was on vacation after college exams and praticed more frequently on my other club and multiball drill with my chinese coach and where the players are equal and better level than me, so the pratice was more physical demanding than I was used to, as I wasn't used to practice so well since some time ago. Probably could be that, so maybe I could give a change with SP on my allwood and if the pain comeback I could change to a composite then. Because I have nothing against my BT777, it's a great blade and I like the allwood feel with 7 ply solidness(I always said I hate allwood, but I had only tried 5 ply, never 7 ply).

I was asking that because I know a player that play in my league that changed from a Korbel to a Viscaria because he had a back injury. With his Viscaria, the strokes would be less physical demanding, less body rotation, etc.

I could try that, I have rubber bands in my house so! Maybe I need some rest first and then I'll try it, thanks once again!

mart1nandersson said:

Why not ask your coach if SP is a good idea for your? He being Chinese would for sure know as it used to be a quite common type of rubber there (if he's old enough).

As for rubber bands - that's the only type of advice you will ever get from a physio And some stretching exercises.

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He's 59 or 60 right now, he was a former CNT player, he told me his story. He quitted CNT after the rule change fo colors of the rubbers, '85 I think. He was a anti-spin chopper, but afther that rule, his coach made I'm to try long pimples on BH but he couldn't get used to it.

I already asked to him, he said that wouldn't be good to me, because I'm used to the inverted stroke and my BH hits would end on the net, and he said SP is not good when players are playing tense and nervous. But I wan't to try, as I was always afraid to try chinese rubber on FH since I play, and after I regret didn't tried it before(not saying that I got better, but my FH got pleasant to play), so I think I really have to try to find if I like or not, without disrespecting the knowledge of my coach, ofc.

mart1nandersson said:

No harm in trying. It's great fun to BH punch backspin balls that are a bit too high with SP. The issue I found is that it's quite hard to get to those balls in match play. It's also quite hard to fish with SP and blocking is completely different. It's similar to LP in the sense that it's fun to mess around with but will it truly win you matches? You would probably need a coach that knows SP quite well to make the transition. But then again a 8€ for a sheet of 802-40 from AliExpress is not a major investment if you just want to try it out.

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Yeah, the change to chinese rubber was much easier because of him(how to play, right way to boost and glue, etc). Yeah I prefer to find for myself, as I like to watch Tan Ruiwu and Wang Tao(not like so much Tang Peng) and I believe that I'm making the right choice right now, and with the coach the change will be easier.

Note that my intention to use pips is not to play "destructive", to "destroy" opponents game, it's just because I think it will be good change to me, as feels more natural to hit/block no BH in match play and I'll take advantage of the less spin sentivity of sp. Ofc I wan't also to continue to pratice my inverted technique, as I like to be a complete pratice partner.

Yeah I ordered two sheets of 802-40 to start!

Lula said:

Almost cheating to play with anti and two red rubbers haha. I would be good with that too. Must be frustrating to play against. Maybe i read to bad But why are you reason to change to short pimple on the backhand? I Do not think having a bad backhand is a good reason. Are you bad at doing spin and are better at punching and smashing with your backhand?

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He used chinese tacky in one side, and anti in other You may know it from champions league, he's the Sporting CP head coach, Chen Shi Shao. It's a pretty nice coach, he knows a lot! I can loop while praticing, better after changing to chinese rubber on BH, feel that produces a better quality shot, despite the effort I need to make. But in match play things are not like that, because I feel it's more natural to hit/punch with my backhand. And after tried chinese on BH because I'm too forehand oriented, so I thought that changing to SP could be an advantage.

mart1nandersson said:

Don't forget: Joga Bonito is important. LP, MP and SP is not going to achieve that

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Ahahah I thought much like that some time ago and only played behind the table. Was nice and I usually did some nice lobbing shots and that, but that made me inconsistent, because I was almost always in disadvantage. So I've been working to play much closer to the table(one of the reasons that I've changed to allwood 7-ply too), and close to table I only punch/hit with backhand, so I think would be better, because now I mainly foccused not in giving show But to be more effective and playing closer to the table!

yogi_bear said:

I am seeing probably a rotator cuff injury due to overswinging and using less rotation of the torso which leads to the strain on your arms and shoulder.

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My coach always correcting my BH stroke, every time that I did multiball drills with him. So my technique can be causing me the injury like you saying

yogi_bear said:

There are controllable rubbers like 2.0 vega pro that can actually give some power and reduce the effort. Why not go with that path. Too much effort also will give you strain.

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I used a 1.8 Bluefire M2 on BH before, and I felt good control, despite it was a bit thin. Maybe I'll buy a 2.0 control rubber like Vega Pro/Barracuda/Genius if SP don't suit me. But maybe SP will suit me as it will force me to play closer to table(even if I change to inverted in the future), as chinese rubber helped me play more active, with Tenergy I used the rubber catapult to play to passively when I should play more active, as I had a solid forehand loop

yogi_bear said:

Let me. Add i am talking both bh and fh swi gs mostly fh that causes this injury. Maybe you are doing that during gameplays and not during multiball practice.

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Maybe you're right. I know that I need much more effort on my BH than I'm used too, and most of the pain at the start of the injury came when I play BH, only after my FH swing started to hurt, but maybe this started with a FH swing. So after I get better the pain returns I'll try to move to a faster blade to try to reduce effort on shots

Lula said:

Maybe you have played to much multiball. It is great training But i think it is easier to get injuried this way because you repeat one shot so many Times all the time. Important to be wanted up and in good shape if you should Do a Lot of multiball.

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I'll have more care now, it's true in last two weeks the intensity of pratice was much bigger, plus the rhythm of multiball drills! I'll have to increase praticing intensity gradually and that I did the opposite