Head light (balanced weight) 5 ply blades?

shinshiro · Feb 13, 2019

Hi guys

I don't like much head heavy blades because I find it compromises a bit manueverability close to the table. I feel a bit uncomfortable with it.
Then I was wondering what were the blades that felt the lightests (5 ply blades, all wood, no balsa) when playing.

Rubber weight affects the overall balance of the setup, but here I want to focus on blades.
Weight of rubbers are not much difficult to find out because is something that can be measured. Blade balance is a bit more complicated...you don't have numbers to rely.

So the question is:

Which 5 ply blades have you played that felt lighter than the actual weight may suggest?
Do you know one that stands out from the rest?
If you have experience with more than one, it would be interesting if you could make personal ranking too. It would be useful to get a better idea of how much "balanced" one blade is compared to other. Since we don't have any numbers to compare, a ranking could be very ilustrative.

Thank you very much

NextLevel · Feb 13, 2019

Yasaka Extra or Yasaka Allround. Relatively thin and small head and well balanced blade.

ttmonster · Feb 13, 2019

@Der_Echte : I think the public wants an encore on your beast mod !

PiZa · Feb 13, 2019

My current blade Tibhar Lebesson felt light due to its long handle and little smaller than normal head.

yoass · Feb 13, 2019

The custom blade that I now mainly use is much like its older sibling. It is a few grams heavier, mainly due to the use of heavier wood in the handle (Zebra).

It shifts the balance towards the handle. Comparing blade balance is relatively easy, done by actually balancing the blade on a finger.

Rubber weight matters, though, the more so the larger the blade head.

usualsuspect · Feb 13, 2019

IMO, any well balanced blades feel lighter than their actual weight, and any head-heavy blades feel heavier than actual weight. Nittaku Acoustic (LG handle) and Stiga Infinity feels very light.

Lightzy · Feb 13, 2019

Wood blades all tend to be head-heavy. Except for the most basic ones with no power.

But you can just try to make the handle heavier or something if that works for you. I know people who tried that.
I'm not sure which companies make blades with intentionally heavy handles for that purpose.

If you want the blade with the best balance that I think exists, try the Liu Shiwen ZLF. A bit expensive and possibly hard to find, but it's a fast innerforce type blade, extremely flexible and quite fast, spinny as all hell, balanced towards the handle (thanks to the ZLF it can be both a very thin head blade and yet a fast one. Anyone I know who tried it first of all comments about the balance of it, how it feels in the hand. It's really a unique piece.

dominus7 · Feb 20, 2019

A good and easy way to get heavier handle is filling the handle,donic waldner senso carbon have 2 holes that you can fill, I think every donic senso has holes handle exposed, so you can grab paper, or rubber, even metal to heavier the handle

Enviado desde mi Moto G (4) mediante Tapatalk

lVegita · Feb 20, 2019

Waldner Offensive "JO shape" may be something like that. Never tried it though.

https://www.lojadomesatenista.com.br/produto/donic-waldner-offensive/

Simas · Feb 20, 2019

my 5ply setup is well balanced and light

usualsuspect · Feb 20, 2019

lVegita said:
Waldner Offensive "JO shape" may be something like that. Never tried it though.

https://www.lojadomesatenista.com.br/produto/donic-waldner-offensive/

I might be wrong here, but isn't the JO teardrop shape longer and narrower than average blades?
If that's the case, wouldn't a longer blade be more head-heavy than a shorter blade?

yoass · Feb 20, 2019

usualsuspect said:
I might be wrong here, but isn't the JO teardrop shape longer and narrower than average blades?
If that's the case, wouldn't a longer blade be more head-heavy than a shorter blade?

The weight is proportional to the surface area enclosed in the shape, not so much the shape per se.

Add to that, it's in the end not just the weight - it's the weight in the balance, which determines the blade's moment. It's the center of gravity that determines the distance from your point of applying pressure.

I suspect that the JO shape's center of gravity is slightly more towards the handle than the classic egg shape. Which means less distance, which given the same mass would mean less moment.

usualsuspect · Feb 20, 2019

yoass said:
The weight is proportional to the surface area enclosed in the shape, not so much the shape per se.

Add to that, it's in the end not just the weight - it's the weight in the balance, which determines the blade's moment. It's the center of gravity that determines the distance from your point of applying pressure.

I suspect that the JO shape's center of gravity is slightly more towards the handle than the classic egg shape. Which means less distance, which given the same mass would mean less moment.

Ok, I guess that makes sense. I was assuming the JO shape and regular version would share the exact same materials. If the JO shape's handle is somehow heavier (different wood or bigger handle?) than the regular version, then that changes everything.

yoass · Feb 20, 2019

usualsuspect said:
Ok, I guess that makes sense. I was assuming the JO shape and regular version would share the exact same materials. If the JO shape's handle is somehow heavier (different wood or bigger handle?) than the regular version, then that changes everything.

Why assume difference in the rest of the constuction?

Same area with same handle and same rubbers etc., but a more teardrop than egg shaped (you might say, a pointier egg) means that more material is closer to the handle. Hence, more balanced towards the handle at the same weight.

But I don’t know the exact dimensions of the JO shaped Donic blades. They might have a bigger or smaller surface area, that would certainly affect weight. And balance, depending on the rubber weight somewhat.

mart1nandersson · Feb 20, 2019

I played with the Donic Offensive JO shape for about 2-3 weeks and it felt extremely head heavy with the rubbers on (Tibhar K1 + Stiga Mantra S). Very nice finish and ST handle. It's a quite fast blade (maybe a few notches faster than a Korbel).

The shape really takes some getting used to. I had an absolutely orgy of edge hits for the first half hour. Slightly off topic but anyways...

usualsuspect · Feb 20, 2019

mart1nandersson said:
I played with the Donic Offensive JO shape for about 2-3 weeks and it felt extremely head heavy with the rubbers on (Tibhar K1 + Stiga Mantra S). Very nice finish and ST handle. It's a quite fast blade (maybe a few notches faster than a Korbel).

Ok, thank you for verifying my suspicion. I thought the JO shape might be head heavy.

lVegita · Feb 21, 2019

mart1nandersson said:
I played with the Donic Offensive JO shape for about 2-3 weeks and it felt extremely head heavy with the rubbers on (Tibhar K1 + Stiga Mantra S). Very nice finish and ST handle. It's a quite fast blade (maybe a few notches faster than a Korbel).

The shape really takes some getting used to. I had an absolutely orgy of edge hits for the first half hour. Slightly off topic but anyways...

Oh really? I thought it had a smaller head size, and along with the longer handle it would be lighter on the head.
My mistake.

yoass · Feb 21, 2019

I don't think this has been expressed, but head heaviness does have something to do with blade construction, but in the end it's the weight of the rubbers that dominates. A blade that is head heavy with a hard and heavy rubber like (say) H3, T05H, MX-S and such will certainly be less so (if at all) with a softer and ligher rubber like Palio AK47 blue, Rakza 7 Soft, T05 FX.

usualsuspect · Feb 21, 2019

yoass said:
I don't think this has been expressed, but head heaviness does have something to do with blade construction, but in the end it's the weight of the rubbers that dominates. A blade that is head heavy with a hard and heavy rubber like (say) H3, T05H, MX-S and such will certainly be less so (if at all) with a softer and ligher rubber like Palio AK47 blue, Rakza 7 Soft, T05 FX.

Ok, there seems to be a misconception about H3 being heavy. H3 (2.1mm) is average weight. I think an uncut sheet is below 70g, which is lighter than Xiom Vega Pro 2mm. Yinhe Jupiter II and Big Dipper (2.1mm) rubbers are also below 70g uncut. We probably shouldn't automatically assume Chinese tacky rubbers as being heavy, it really depends on which rubbers we are talking about.

yoass · Feb 21, 2019

usualsuspect said:
Ok, there seems to be a misconception about H3 being heavy. H3 (2.1mm) is average weight. I think an uncut sheet is below 70g, which is lighter than Xiom Vega Pro 2mm. Yinhe Jupiter II and Big Dipper (2.1mm) rubbers are also below 70g uncut. We probably shouldn't automatically assume Chinese tacky rubbers as being heavy, it really depends on which rubbers we are talking about.

True, but I didn’t contrast H3 with other mid/heavyweights. I pitted it against light rubbers. 70g uncut isn’t light, but you’re right heavier rubbers exist.

Head light (balanced weight) 5 ply blades?

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