Spin is better than Speed - I am a believer now.

The Omega Man · Apr 22, 2019

usualsuspect said:
I have to say I agree with OP on spin vs. speed. For us non-professionals, having strong spin is much more effective than having speed.
Akbar Bahmani's style reminds me of Nima Alamian. This style is much harder to succeed on professional scene, especially on men's side. On women's side, spin oriented game is still kind of viable (e.g. Bernadette Szocs, Hashimoto and Sato Hitomi), but still difficult to make into top WR40.

But Timo is famous for putting a tremendous amount of spin into the ball isn't it? Like isn't this part of his signature game? He is also an older player which matches my theory that older players played with more spin.

slevin · Apr 22, 2019

The Omega Man said:
But Timo is famous for putting a tremendous amount of spin into the ball isn't it? Like isn't this part of his signature game? He is also an older player which matches my theory that older players played with more spin.

Over the past couple of years or so, when TB plays higher ranked pros, it is evident that, with the new ball, he does get a lot of points not by spin but by having the opponent open first and then countering his opening loop.

RidTheKid · Apr 22, 2019

Timo is perhaps no 1 in varying the spin.

The Omega Man said:
But Timo is famous for putting a tremendous amount of spin into the ball isn't it? Like isn't this part of his signature game? He is also an older player which matches my theory that older players played with more spin.

Ilia Minkin · Apr 22, 2019

It is all relative to the level of the mastery. If you want to win by spinning the ball, you have to be very good at. Which is true for any other style like flat hitting or defending.

olzetezkarzo · Apr 22, 2019

he played for iranian national team so clearly he's a high level player.
to get there you need everything.
serves, spin, control, speed, blocks, loops....

it's possible that the difference in level was so much that he barely needed to do any effort.
that's why you saw him as a lazy slow guy.

he did pull a good trick on you guys.... just showing up like that.
it's like when nba players go to play in parks dressed as an old man

The Omega Man · Apr 22, 2019

olzetezkarzo said:
he played for iranian national team so clearly he's a high level player.
to get there you need everything.
serves, spin, control, speed, blocks, loops....

it's possible that the difference in level was so much that he barely needed to do any effort.
that's why you saw him as a lazy slow guy.

he did pull a good trick on you guys.... just showing up like that.
it's like when nba players go to play in parks dressed as an old man

That I understand at my local club, but watching him clean the floor against players 20 years younger than him and pro players among them at the tournament was something else.
In any case, he is a very nice man, very humble, he offered to coach my son and he gives advice to anybody he plays at the club. I plan to learn as much from him as I can.

olzetezkarzo · Apr 22, 2019

The Omega Man said:
That I understand at my local club, but watching him clean the floor against players 20 years younger than him and pro players among them at the tournament was something else.
In any case, he is a very nice man, very humble, he offered to coach my son and he gives advice to anybody he plays at the club. I plan to learn as much from him as I can.

I guess he's more "pro" than they are.

there are players who have beaten him, so he's not invincible.
check this..... https//tabletennis.guide/profile.php?name=akbar-bahmani-100823

but yeah, in an amateur club setting he would be seen as a super hero.
and you are really lucky he just happened to land in your club.
out of all the clubs in the world, he went straight from iran to your door!

Metaxa · Apr 22, 2019

The Omega Man said:
But Timo is famous for putting a tremendous amount of spin into the ball isn't it? Like isn't this part of his signature game? He is also an older player which matches my theory that older players played with more spin.

For sure! Older TT-player plays more with spin because his arm-technique was different. Starting lower and finest higher with open blade. Result, higher arc => difficult to block. Many younger player are not familiar with this kind of balls. Even agains pure defender players, they don't know how to build-up there point/game.
One of the reasons that table tennis is so difficult.

NextLevel · Apr 22, 2019

thom said:
yes the bang bang looking shots actually have a spin component but it is nothing like what the OP is describing for this Iranian player.

Sure. Play a top player and see if you can come to this conclusion and tell.me how you come to.it. Every world ranked player I have played, the overwhelming characteristic of their game for me was the spin level. They could take the ball differently in timing etc., but there was never any doubt about the spin.

usualsuspect · Apr 22, 2019

The Omega Man said:
But Timo is famous for putting a tremendous amount of spin into the ball isn't it? Like isn't this part of his signature game? He is also an older player which matches my theory that older players played with more spin.

I definitely agree with that. The new material ABS 40+ balls greatly lessened spins.
As far as spin-oriented players go, TBoll is the complete package. He's got great service, footwork, short game, and consistency in rallies at any distance from the table. That's why he's been in the top 10 for so long.

If other spin-oriented players improve more aspects of their game, they will become much more threatening. A common weakness I noticed in most spin-oriented professional players is their inability to stay in a rally for long (e.g. Alamian and BSzocs tend to start missing shots on the 4th or 5th ball when playing against powerful and/or speedy players).

Ioiettino · Apr 22, 2019

The Omega Man said:
No bullshit on my story, I did try to write it in a way to keep you entertained thou.
Tournament took place in Laval -Quebec Canada last weekend. The Big Bang Donic Tournament.
Feel free to ask anyone who you might know in the area.

Oh I didn't think you were lying! I did enjoy the storytelling, too.

Heathrow · Apr 27, 2019

Invite him to join the forum so we can hear his story. I love this stuff.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

cudalbuc · Apr 28, 2019

Related to this https://youtu.be/NzHVZqPwW90?t=360.

tt chats · May 6, 2019

Yes, now the spin of the new materials balls has been reduced too much. Spin is very interesting, especially for beginners.

langel · May 6, 2019

This study fits with my personal experience. Good to read.
I'm sure almost nobody will read it and as a result almost everybody will continuue to echo half-truth mantras.

https://www.researchgate.net/public...Plastic_on_the_Post-Collision_Ball_Trajectory

Lula · May 6, 2019

langel said:
This study fits with my personal experience. Good to read.
I'm sure almost nobody will read it and as a result almost everybody will continuue to echo half-truth mantras.

https://www.researchgate.net/public...Plastic_on_the_Post-Collision_Ball_Trajectory

Just read the abstract. Had some hard time to understand some words and if they came to any results. Could you explain shortly in an easier way?

Thanks.

langel · May 6, 2019

You better read it.

Joepole · May 6, 2019

I think you could read just the conclusion. Essentially a plastic ball bounces higher than a celluloid ball especially at higher speeds. The effect of spin is greater with the plastic ball as it has more friction. Slow backspin serves hold the ball up more and fast topspin drives accelerate of the table more. This applies to 40mm balls so isn't applicable to 38mm celluloid or 40+ plastic.

langel · May 6, 2019

Joepole said:
This applies to 40mm balls so isn't applicable to 38mm celluloid or 40+ plastic.

Wrong!
You better read it.

Joepole · May 6, 2019

I did. The balls were 39.6mm and 40mm and the masses almost identical. These were controls so that the difference in properties of the material could be investigated. The effect of size or mass was not part of the study

Spin is better than Speed - I am a believer now.

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