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    1. Top | #1
      Maximilian2016 is offline
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      The "old" blades - still a valid option or not

      Hello to everybody,

      I would like to know your opinions about how the blades before the plastic ball era are still a valid option today when we have the plastic balls and new rubbers adapted to this plastic ball.
      I am interested in all wood blades, ALL and ALL+ blades (examples: Nittaku Violin, Nittaku Accoustic, Stiga Allround Classic, Butterfly Primorac, etc ).
      Do you consider that these "old" blades are obsoleted and the new balls/rubbers require new blades made with the new technologies (like ZLF, ZLC, etc ) or the "old" blades are still a valid option today?


      Best regards.
      Last edited by Maximilian2016; 06-12-2019 at 12:31 PM.

    2. Top | #2
      Airoc is offline
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      Quote Originally Posted by Maximilian2016 View Post
      I am interested in all wood blades, ALL and ALL+ blades (examples: Nittaku Violin, Nittaku Accoustic, Stiga Allround Classic, Butterfly Primorac, etc ).
      Depending on the player´s level, I would say these are still valid options, despite the overall tendency to go faster with the plastic balls.

      But on amateur levels, I think there´s no reason to upgrade from, say Primorac with medium rubber to fibre-enhanced with hard rubber generally. If you feel your game lacks something it´s a different story. But not just because of an overall trend among pros.

    3. Top | #3
      UpSideDownCarl is online now
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      Something to consider, Tenergy was made in the cell ball era. It is still one of the best rubbers.

      Viscaria was originally designed in the 1990s. None of the new blades are really that different than a Viscaria.

      So, what is the new equipment you are talking about that was designed and adapted to the new plastic ball when Tenergy is still better than most of the rubbers "designed for the plastic ball" and Viscaria is still as good as any other blade "designed for the plastic ball"?

      Have you been taken in by TT marketing? They will try to tell you that things are new and different. But how different can they be when all of this stuff is simply made of the same basic materials as always. Wood....carbon.....polyaramid....rubber.....all these substances have been used and adapted in TT equipment for decades.
      Last edited by UpSideDownCarl; 06-12-2019 at 01:12 PM.
      Spin Everything.

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    5. Top | #4
      Maximilian2016 is offline
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      Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl View Post
      Something to consider, Tenergy was made in the cell ball era. It is still one of the best rubbers.

      Viscaria was originally designed in the 1990s. None of the new blades are really that different than a Viscaria.

      So, what is the new equipment you are talking about that was designed and adapted to the new plastic ball when Tenergy is still better than most of the rubbers "designed for the plastic ball" and Viscaria is still as good as any other blade "designed for the plastic ball"?

      Have you been taken in by TT marketing? They will try to tell you that things are new and different. But how different can they be when all of this stuff is simply made of the same basic materials as always. Wood....carbon.....polyaramid....rubber.....all these substances have been used and adapted in TT equipment for decades.

      I am not talking about a specific vendor/rubber/blade in particular. I was referring to the new equipment released after the plastic ball era; some of them are advertised that they include new technologies.
      Examples:
      Stiga Mantra series for example are based on the "Oxygen Capsule System"
      Butterfly DIGNICS 05 combines the "Spring Sponge X" technology
      DONIC BlueGrip - " The answer to the plastic ball loss of rotation conundrum! "
      ...

      At least, in terms of marketing, the biggest vendors on the market released new equipment after the cell ball was replaced.
      I was not caught in the marketing trap but even if the materials are the same probably they combined them in different ways and they got different results, more suitable to the plastic balls.
      Since there are a lot people on this forum who are knowledgeable about the tennis table equipment , both " old " and "new" and more than just reading a review or a description in a catalog, they have tested it in practice, I am interested in their opinion.

    6. Top | #5
      Der_Echte is offline
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      Some old stuff is better for some players now...

      Some of that stuff wasn't as good with the 40 cell ball.
      You would need to discover it by ur self. We are all different.

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    7. Top | #6
      UpSideDownCarl is online now
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      Quote Originally Posted by Der_Echte View Post
      Some old stuff is better for some players now...

      Some of that stuff wasn't as good with the 40 cell ball.
      You would need to discover it by ur self. We are all different.
      Yep. What Der said.

      Quote Originally Posted by Maximilian2016 View Post
      I am not talking about a specific vendor/rubber/blade in particular. I was referring to the new equipment released after the plastic ball era; some of them are advertised that they include new technologies.
      Examples:
      Stiga Mantra series for example are based on the "Oxygen Capsule System"
      Butterfly DIGNICS 05 combines the "Spring Sponge X" technology
      DONIC BlueGrip - " The answer to the plastic ball loss of rotation conundrum! "
      ...

      At least, in terms of marketing, the biggest vendors on the market released new equipment after the cell ball was replaced.
      I was not caught in the marketing trap but even if the materials are the same probably they combined them in different ways and they got different results, more suitable to the plastic balls.
      Since there are a lot people on this forum who are knowledgeable about the tennis table equipment , both " old " and "new" and more than just reading a review or a description in a catalog, they have tested it in practice, I am interested in their opinion.
      Part of my statement was that the marketing that they have designed new things for the new ball....it isn't entirely true. It is marketing. And it will get people like you to distrust what they feel and buy more and more new things. That is how these companies make money.

      I will give you an example:

      ZJK ALC is a rebranded Viscaria. TB ALC is also. So is the Kenta blade. They are all 99.5% the same with different logos and handles. Very slight differences. The Freitas blade is a M Maze blade rebranded and made a little stiffer. The Apolonia blade is an Innerforce ZLC with a new paint job.

      None of that is new technology. They are all good. But not really new.

      There are plenty of new rubbers that are better than older versions of ESN rubbers, they still do not distinguish themselves notably above Tenergy.

      So, think about what specific new technology you are talking about and see if you can explain to us how it is something other than hype from the companies to try and get you to spend your $$. Feel free to buy what you want. There is nothing wrong with that. Try different equipment with an open mind. Decide for yourself how you like it. But don't overly trust marketing.

      Test for yourself and decide for yourself. It is easy to get led astray by companies trying to manipulate you. If you like to EJ, there is nothing wrong with that. But don't think you need new stuff. I can play pretty much the same level as I play now with a Primorac Off- and Mark V rubbers....old school equipment from a few decades ago.
      Last edited by UpSideDownCarl; 06-13-2019 at 02:11 AM.

    8. Top | #7
      lasta is offline
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      The blades you mentioned are not that old and perfectly suitable for modern play.

      I'm actually on a vintage blade kick at the moment, 70s era 7mm+ and 100g+ blades are MUCH faster than the latest featherweights. They certainly don't make em like they used to.

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    10. Top | #8
      BryanY is offline
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      I agree with the replies here. But... I would say that some of the speed ratings (ALL, OFF, etc...) are outdated on some of the classic blades from the 38mm era. For example, Stiga OFF Classic is kinda slow OFF- at best. Stiga Allround Classic is extremely slow and has the smallest sweet spot of any blade that I have used. $8 Palio allround blade has a better sweet spot

      My opinion on classic blades is that it’s often possible to find a more modern blade with similar performance but with less weight or better sweet spot. (There has been some progress with gluing techniques, UV and heat processing of the wood, and of course carbon fiber).

    11. Top | #9
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      i think it is alot of personal preference. Many of the old blades are made of just wood, which many think give more feeling. While many new blades are made of wood and another material, so the feeling is proably not the same but they are proably a bit faster.

    12. Top | #10
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      I hit for about 15 minutes with a guy tonight who plays in “Superettan” which is the second best league in Sweden. He uses a Korbel with T05. He’s probably not going to win against Ma Long any time soon but there will not be that many forums members that will take a game from him. All wood blades are amazing.

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    14. Top | #11
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      I think the reason why most pros moved to composite is because with time they found that it offers more control than all wood.
      not because of the speed.
      they can get as much speed as they want with boosting.

      my normal blade is a tibhar lebesson, one of the slowest all wood blades.
      the other day I played a little bit with a stiga carbonado clone and it seemed to me like it gave me more control.
      Last edited by olzetezkarzo; 06-12-2019 at 11:10 PM.

    15. Top | #12
      UpSideDownCarl is online now
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      Quote Originally Posted by lasta View Post
      The blades you mentioned are not that old and perfectly suitable for modern play.

      I'm actually on a vintage blade kick at the moment, 70s era 7mm+ and 100g+ blades are MUCH faster than the latest featherweights. They certainly don't make em like they used to.
      Those kinds of blades do feel amazing. So many people today have no idea how, a little extra weight in your hand, with a blade where the weight is balanced, really ends up feeling so so so good.

      But don't get Der_Echte started on heavy blades.
      Last edited by UpSideDownCarl; 06-13-2019 at 02:15 AM.

    16. Top | #13
      NextLevel is online now
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      Quote Originally Posted by mart1nandersson View Post
      I hit for about 15 minutes with a guy tonight who plays in “Superettan” which is the second best league in Sweden. He uses a Korbel with T05. He’s probably not going to win against Ma Long any time soon but there will not be that many forums members that will take a game from him. All wood blades are amazing.
      Filip Szymanski uses this combination and he is one of my idols. He is one of the reasons I gave up on carbon blades. I don't have fun when I use then even though I know I play faster with them.
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    18. Top | #14
      mart1nandersson is offline
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      Quote Originally Posted by NextLevel View Post
      Filip Szymanski uses this combination and he is one of my idols. He is one of the reasons I gave up on carbon blades. I don't have fun when I use then even though I know I play faster with them.
      I'm actually thinking of trying out the Korbel for chopping as my Diode V is a bit too fast which is holding back my FH. I've got a Korbel with T05/Rozena and will probably try to transplant my pip on to it. I believe that Gionis used to play with the Korbel so it can't be that bad of a combo.

    19. Top | #15
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      Quote Originally Posted by mart1nandersson View Post
      I'm actually thinking of trying out the Korbel for chopping as my Diode V is a bit too fast which is holding back my FH. I've got a Korbel with T05/Rozena and will probably try to transplant my pip on to it. I believe that Gionis used to play with the Korbel so it can't be that bad of a combo.
      Gionis still does.

    20. Top | #16
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      For most internediate players, even the old models are already good enough but some blades like stiga azalea off is much better compared to the offensive classic as it has less vibration

    21. Top | #17
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      New rubbers are something for new plastic balls and i see the difference but my friend can beat players from first 100 with Old tag Jonyer 05 combo so preference of equipment balance + game plan and feeling + skillset is more important than new extra blades

    22. Top | #18
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      I’m surprised Acoustic is considered obsolete in the OP. I recently switched away from it to an ALL rated Yasaka Sweden Classic because the Acoustic felt too fast for me. Maybe I’m just still too new to the sport.


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    24. Top | #19
      mart1nandersson is offline
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      Quote Originally Posted by alas26 View Post
      I’m surprised Acoustic is considered obsolete in the OP. I recently switched away from it to an ALL rated Yasaka Sweden Classic because the Acoustic felt too fast for me. Maybe I’m just still too new to the sport.


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      I think that’s exactly the point. Traditional blades will work for pretty much everyone outside of the WR300 unless you’re after something very specific (SP probably requires a fast blade with the new ball etc).

    25. Top | #20
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      Quote Originally Posted by mart1nandersson View Post
      I hit for about 15 minutes with a guy tonight who plays in “Superettan” which is the second best league in Sweden. He uses a Korbel with T05. He’s probably not going to win against Ma Long any time soon but there will not be that many forums members that will take a game from him. All wood blades are amazing.
      Heming Hu(WR106) is addicted to that Korbel blade. See his instagram post.

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