The "old" blades - still a valid option or not

SFF_lib said:

Probably because I am biased. My point is that old blades give you great feel due to age and better handcrafting in the old days. Speed is never an issue even using an ALL blade as long as you know how to swing properly.

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Yes, there have been great blades. Revered still, and fondly remembered.

There have also been lesser ones. Maybe we remember selectively, and would do well to remember this.

Pretty much like now. A lot of very good blades exist, probably built with a lot less handcraft involved and the pros and cons that go with that.

fanoftt said:

totally disagree, with new balls there is no more spin, you have to change tactic and playing style also..

there is no more massive topspin, if you try to play like that your opponents counterspin very easy if they play close to table..

I am looking at the kids today, 14-20 .. nobody tries to rotate, effective playing styles changed ..

If you look at top level, harimoto is just like other kids today, no fear of rotation (because there is much less rotation now)..
Also a lot of players hit the bole very flat/high, not from down because with new balls you do not need to that anymore on pushes/serves..

every new generation of plastic balls brought less rotation, less speed

with slow blades like stiga clipper is now hard to play, but good old viscaria (carbon) is big hit again

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Tell Xu Xin there is no more spin.

Also Clipper is barely slower than a Viscaria, there is not much in it. Lots of top 100 players use a blade slower than a clipper.

I think there are quite a few myth peddlers in this thread. For your average club players what the pros are using is irrelevant. And still they feel they want a Viscaria and Tenergies when they can't loop backspin properly.

Jim said:

New ball is slower than old one , even if you say otherwise.

To generate speed you need a faster blade and rubber compared to before.

New balls give players using fast attack game without much spin advantage. Harimoto and Truls Möregårdh are two good examples, im sure you can find footage of them.

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A good player knows how to add the pace based on technique. The new ball is slower. But a good player can still add the power from good timing and technique. A player who is not so good using equipment that is too fast for him will still take longer to develop good technique.

And I was interested in footage of YOU. Not a pro. Seeing how this applies to someone who is on the forum. Not a pro. We already have an example of a pro saying how he likes the Korbel because it gives him better feeling and more control. And since there are many answers to any question that is based on personal preference, I was hoping to see how you apply your reasoning on the table.

Sometimes it helps to know the value of someone's opinion based on seeing their level of play.

FruitLoop said:

Tell Xu Xin there is no more spin.

Also Clipper is barely slower than a Viscaria, there is not much in it. Lots of top 100 players use a blade slower than a clipper.

I think there are quite a few myth peddlers in this thread. For your average club players what the pros are using is irrelevant. And still they feel they want a Viscaria and Tenergies when they can't loop backspin properly.

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please ask xu xin for opinion and give us his feedback of new bals, thanks..

clipper is no were near as fast as viscaria, played with both of blades for few years in different time periods.
for me clipper was perfect blade, but first glue ban and then new balls killed that blade for me.

lVegita said:

Tell this to the top 100WR Korbel guy up there.

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why would I tell him that? he probably knows why he uses that blade

fanoftt said:

please ask xu xin for opinion and give us his feedback of new bals, thanks..

clipper is no were near as fast as viscaria, played with both of blades for few years in different time periods.
for me clipper was perfect blade, but first glue ban and then new balls killed that blade for me.

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About to be the new world.number 1, that Xu Xin? He will probably say he needs to retire since new balls don't spin and will cry into his Japan Open trophy.

Viscaria is only a tiny bit faster. I have used both. A heavy clipper is almost as fast. There are almost no blades in between those two in speed put it that way.

My observation onto blade flexibility for close-mid looper apart from blade age;

If you cannot swing your arm quickly, you better do bigger swing to reach enough racket speed. The best set up for these people is flexible blade.(I am this guy)

If your swing is quick with small motion, you need crisper contact. Those people play better with harder blades(koto, balsa, carbon etc).

There are other immortal pro players play better with carbon but relatively flexible blade with big quick swings.

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I still wonder if a donic allplay with like two yasaka mark v in max and 2.0 are still good in the lower classes for a spin control game?

LittleSeki said:

I still wonder if a donic allplay with like two yasaka mark v in max and 2.0 are still good in the lower classes for a spin control game?

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Still good for beginners and intermediate players who are still developing strokes.

yeah i dont know in which on i belong because i play 11 years and still in the lowest ranking. in training i am a lot better but maybe classic rubber give me more safty

Maximilian2016 said:

Hello to everybody,

I would like to know your opinions about how the blades before the plastic ball era are still a valid option today when we have the plastic balls and new rubbers adapted to this plastic ball.
I am interested in all wood blades, ALL and ALL+ blades (examples: Nittaku Violin, Nittaku Accoustic, Stiga Allround Classic, Butterfly Primorac, etc ).
Do you consider that these "old" blades are obsoleted and the new balls/rubbers require new blades made with the new technologies (like ZLF, ZLC, etc ) or the "old" blades are still a valid option today?


Best regards.

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Well... for me the only valid option is the one you're confortable with. Doesn't matter the blade and the rubber.
If after some reasonable training you don't like your bat so change it.

Well in training i like a boll alc with vega pro and also a defplay with long pips. I cant tell much difference between an allplay with mark v and an alc with vega pro

Maximilian2016 said:

Hello to everybody,

I would like to know your opinions about how the blades before the plastic ball era are still a valid option today when we have the plastic balls and new rubbers adapted to this plastic ball.
I am interested in all wood blades, ALL and ALL+ blades (examples: Nittaku Violin, Nittaku Accoustic, Stiga Allround Classic, Butterfly Primorac, etc ).
Do you consider that these "old" blades are obsoleted and the new balls/rubbers require new blades made with the new technologies (like ZLF, ZLC, etc ) or the "old" blades are still a valid option today?


Best regards.

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Hi Max,

I started playing again around 1 3/4 yrs ago, after a 30yr lay off!!
So I missed the speed glue era,
Missed the ball size change,

Now, everyone has been saying that -

1) the ball is slower, how much slower ??? Not sure if this has been calculated?? but it would be interesting to know.
2) harder to produce spin / new ball is less spinny!!!!

This is likely to be true!!

However , when you have been away for a long time you don’t really have a reference point for the changes.

There’s loads of spin out there !!! There’s loads of speed out there !!

regarding obsolete equipment - I think rubbers more so than blades. Sriver, Mark V, etc are still around but with modern variations

I have 2 Tamca 5000 blades from 30+yrs ago, pre speed glue era, these, are a far as I’m concerned ‘super fast’ and for me way too fast, (NOW!!!)
I even put 2 sheets of Aibiss on one of them because I thought that Aibiss was too slow on an all wood all round blade and that I would be able to handle it on the Tamca blade, WRONG !!!!!!

30+ years ago, the Tamca 5000 blade paired with Tackiness D and Sriver was my ‘go to’ set up!!!

the only thing that’s really becoming ‘obsolete’ over time is ME !!!!

IB66: Speed Glue Era started in 1979. You may have not participated in the speed glue era. But you did not miss it.

However, I agree about the assessment of equipment. Anything that you could use back then, you still can use. It is true the ball has been progressively slowed from 38 to 40 to 40+. If you are not sure how much faster a 38mm celluloid ball was, a fun experiment would be to see if you can locate one and have a little knock with it.

I have several Nittaku 3 stars that are 38mm. The first time I tried one (after decades--I stopped playing around 1992) I was amazed at how dramatic the difference between the 38mm and the 40mm ball was. This was as ITTF was in the process of making the change to 40+.

One thing that stood out to me was, how much less arc the 38mm ball got because of how much faster it was despite the extra spin. The 40 and 40+ balls are slower and have so much more frictional resistance in flight that, even though they spin less, there is a much bigger Magnus Effect evident on the flight of the ball.

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UpSideDownCarl said:

I have several Nittaku 3 stars that are 38mm. The first time I tried one (after decades--I stopped playing around 1992) I was amazed at how dramatic the difference between the 38mm and the 40mm ball was. This was as ITTF was in the process of making the change to 40+.

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It's quite fun to play with a 40+ ball a few minutes and then switch to a 38mm for a few minutes. If you then switch back to the 40+ it feels like that the game play is in slow motion.

UpSideDownCarl said:

IB66: Speed Glue Era started in 1979. You may have not participated in the speed glue era. But you did not miss it.

However, I agree about the assessment of equipment. Anything that you could use back then, you still can use. It is true the ball has been progressively slowed from 38 to 40 to 40+. If you are not sure how much faster a 38mm celluloid ball was, a fun experiment would be to see if you can locate one and have a little knock with it.

I have several Nittaku 3 stars that are 38mm. The first time I tried one (after decades--I stopped playing around 1992) I was amazed at how dramatic the difference between the 38mm and the 40mm ball was. This was as ITTF was in the process of making the change to 40+.

One thing that stood out to me was, how much less arc the 38mm ball got because of how much faster it was despite the extra spin. The 40 and 40+ balls are slower and have so much more frictional resistance in flight that, even though they spin less, there is a much bigger Magnus Effect evident on the flight of the ball.

Click to expand...

Not participating is correct, but unaware is a better description, at the age of 16, I was attending some county junior training, this would be 1982, none of the juniors were using speed glue then, or if they were, it was very secretive!! I had a break from 1983 to 86 and when I started playing again in 1986 for 1 season, it was ‘common knowledge’ about speed glue. I never tried it though !!!