Stiga Mantra - possibly the best priced tensor

JulianTT · Jul 18, 2019

You are being a bunch of drama queens. The context is important: hinoki and zlc are actual materials. "Tensor" is a very wide concept that doesn't mean anything in itself. I could argue that all rubbers with similar properties are tensors.

Nobody is stopping you to use the term "correctly". Expect that from other people and you will be disappointed. Either way it's a non-issue.

Julian

JulianTT · Jul 18, 2019

Airoc said:
I think Julian has a point in saying that most people make no difference between Tensor, Butterfly´s spring sponge or any other (I guess Stiga´s even goes unnamed?),

Might as well go with that flow.

Stiga calls it "Tension rubber"

Julian

Tony's Table Tennis · Jul 18, 2019

JulianTT said:
You are being a bunch of drama queens. The context is important: hinoki and zlc are actual materials. "Tensor" is a very wide concept that doesn't mean anything in itself. I could argue that all rubbers with similar properties are tensors.

Nobody is stopping you to use the term "correctly". Expect that from other people and you will be disappointed. Either way it's a non-issue.

Julian

if every 2nd new forum members comes on board and invents they own way of calling things, then all hell would break loose.

there is many people out there that is not knowledgeable about equipment.
calling a spade a spade is important and to avoid confusion.

you can't call all carbon blades ZLC, just like you can't call all tensor like rubbers tensors.
some company uses marketing terms, some are totally different in terms of technology.
This obvious proves that you have little understanding of the rubbers in question. You merely just treating it as words.

Non issue for me indeed. maybe issues for many out there who will get ill informed by people like you
Langel was correct to point this out, for the sake of correct information being shared.
You can continue your incorrect information sharing. I, as well as many here will just continue with correct information

yogi_bear · Jul 18, 2019

Arguing is not being a drama queen.......

Tony's Table Tennis · Jul 18, 2019

yogi_bear said:
Arguing is not being a drama queen.......

as per the other thread, this person is just so rude.

Tony's Table Tennis · Jul 18, 2019

Airoc said:
I am with you here in principle, since Tensor is a registered trademark.

However, I think Julian has a point in saying that most people make no difference between Tensor, Butterfly´s spring sponge or any other technology (I guess Stiga´s even goes unnamed?), and that Tensor is being made the generic name.

Might as well go with that flow.

Stiga calls its OCS.

and since Mantra is made by a Japanese company (name withheld), it is not the same as the ESN made technologies.
I personally enjoy Mantra over the ESN made alternatives from brands I have rights to.

JulianTT · Jul 18, 2019

OCS is the name they use for the micro bubbles. Tension rubber is listed separately on the package. You are not as smart as you think you are [emoji41]

Julian

dominus7 · Jul 18, 2019

Tony's Table Tennis said:
Stiga calls its OCS.

and since Mantra is made by a Japanese company (name withheld), it is not the same as the ESN made technologies.
I personally enjoy Mantra over the ESN made alternatives from brands I have rights to.

If you have to compare mantra m vs el-p to by and mantra h vs mx-p to fh what do you choose and why?

langel · Jul 18, 2019

JulianTT said:
"Tensor" is a very wide concept that doesn't mean anything in itself. I could argue that all rubbers with similar properties are tensors.

Absolutely wrong statement!

And That is a real drama.

One can not come to right interpretations and true conclusions, standing on wrong basis.

Airoc · Jul 18, 2019

Tony's Table Tennis said:
So we should just call all blades hinoki then?
or all carbon blades ZLC?

No. And again, Julian has a point saying

JulianTT said:
The context is important: hinoki and zlc are actual materials.

What I wanted to say is despite the fact that I know better and will use the correct terms personally, I see a tendency to simplify things (whether I like it or not) or even one brand/registered name taking over as a synonym for a whole range of similar stuff.

Over here, no-one asks for a soft tissue, everybody asks for a "Tempo". Probably every country has an example like that.

And I, for one, am not sure if it is worth my time to interfere in threads with the incorrect use of the term Tensor anymore, as I have done various times previously, mostly on a German forum. I´ll probably stick with the habit, though.

langel · Jul 18, 2019

Let me clarify - the subject of the article is called

"Stiga Mantra - possibly the best priced tensor"

In some regions if you make a commercial like that it will be banned and you may have problems with the law, as its a pure fraud.

The accent is put on two directions - Stiga Mantra is a Tensor, and - being a Tensor it is possibly the best priced one.
And its a fraud.

At the very beginning I said that I may agree with everything, concerning the particular performance of Stiga Mantra.
I would appreciate a comparison between Stiga Mantra and some Tensors, and/or some Tenergies.
Thats why I made a short and polite remark.
But you continue arguing, although its now very obviious that you know nothing about Tensors.
Its not helpfull to anyone.

Airoc · Jul 18, 2019

dominus7 said:
If you have to compare mantra m vs el-p to by and mantra h vs mx-p to fh what do you choose and why?

If the information on another forum is correct Mantra M has a sponge hardness of around 47,5 degrees, H has 50.

That said, the sponge of Mantra M is just about as hard as that of MX-P, and it has less catapult. In my opinion Mantra M plays much closer to tenergy 05 than any other rubber, including MX-P that many people used to replace t05.

I would, if that is what is desired, replace the MX-P with the M and leave the H alone.

As a replacement for EL-P, you´ll find the M way harder and with way less catapult. To me, not an option, but might depend on what you want from it. And in case you were going to ask, S is much softer.

So if you replace your MX-P with Mantra H and your EL-P with Mantra M, you´ll very probably get a racket that is more difficult to play, with equal spin at least, less catapult on both sides for sure.

JulianTT · Jul 18, 2019

langel said:
One can not come to right interpretations and true conclusions, standing on wrong basis.

Actually the opposite is true. If you ever studied Logic, you know that starting with an untrue hypothesis can lead to anything, including a true conclusion [emoji106]

So the joke's on you.

Julian

Tony's Table Tennis · Jul 18, 2019

really rude person
just block and ignore this rudeness

mart1nandersson · Jul 18, 2019

+1 to Airoc's analysis. I know of several players that has transitioned from T05 to Mantra M (and H) without any major transition. It's extremely attractively priced in our market (you usually get it below 40€/sheet).

Tony's Table Tennis · Jul 18, 2019

mart1nandersson said:
+1 to Airoc's analysis. I know of several players that has transitioned from T05 to Mantra M (and H) without any major transition. It's extremely attractively priced in our market (you usually get it below 40€/sheet).

+1 also on Airoc's analysis

I'm really impressed with this 2nd gen Mantra rubbers.
especially a fresh batch - left the factory in Japan and in my hands the week after.
I guess the made in Japan does mean something at the end of the day

Tony's Table Tennis · Jul 18, 2019

Airoc said:
No. And again, Julian has a point saying

What I wanted to say is despite the fact that I know better and will use the correct terms personally, I see a tendency to simplify things (whether I like it or not) or even one brand/registered name taking over as a synonym for a whole range of similar stuff.

Over here, no-one asks for a soft tissue, everybody asks for a "Tempo". Probably every country has an example like that.

And I, for one, am not sure if it is worth my time to interfere in threads with the incorrect use of the term Tensor anymore, as I have done various times previously, mostly on a German forum. I´ll probably stick with the habit, though.

you see, that is the problem
this is not a German forum, its not a British forum, its a world wide forum.
You can't bring what you are used to and knowing it is incorrect to say it is correct.

Langel has explained very clearly on Tensor.
Mantra is not made by ESN, its is made in Japan, and this correction needs to be pointed out.
But you see, the OP is very rude, just check the Yinhe Jupiter thread.

never the less, I agree with Langel, Stiga Mantra - Possible the best priced tensor is totally incorrect.
Its like saying a wetwipe is the best tempo or something like that. Its not really the same comparison.
Tissue still get different kinds, or rather lets say a toilet paper and klennex?
any ways, hope you get my point

Maxtense is not Tensor, Mantra and Tenergy is not Tensor

Airoc · Jul 18, 2019

Tony's Table Tennis said:
You can't bring what you are used to and knowing it is incorrect to say it is correct.

Wouldn´t do. Just get more willing to ignore ...

Tony's Table Tennis said:
I agree with Langel, Stiga Mantra - Possible the best priced tensor is totally incorrect.

I also agree. But don´t you think that most people nevertheless knew what was meant? And that you, Langel and even I will end up as voices in the wilderness and smartasses?

At the end of the day, you are right. A fact is a fact and where something is obviously wrong a correction has to be made, if only to help others.

Tony's Table Tennis · Jul 18, 2019

Airoc said:
Wouldn´t do. Just get more willing to ignore ...

I also agree. But don´t you think that most people nevertheless knew what was meant? And that you, Langel and even I will end up as voices in the wilderness and smartasses?

At the end of the day, you are right. A fact is a fact and where something is obviously wrong a correction has to be made, if only to help others.

assumption is the mother of all problems

I would rather be correct than thinking people will know what I mean.

just like I would add, 20 usd mantra is very very dodgy

tropical · Jul 18, 2019

I am putting my 2cents here. Without people arguing about "tensor" I didn't know that "tensor" was just a trademark name. I always though it was a technology. So I think the OP was also confused as well. A new technology with some characteristics that old technology doesn't have.

Nevertheless, I think people could be nicer. The OP's intention was clear and some folks just want to correct him by showing better knowledge with statements to a point that the OP felt defensive. Keep in mind that there are names that later become so common that people just use them as verbs, nouns, adjective, etc. Think about words like taser (actually an acronym) which commonly used as a verb, sriracha is a name of a Thai town but now becomes a noun for a type of hot sauce, etc. You guys can argue what should be a correct term. In a long run, the noun "tensor" will become known as a technology more than a German company who trademarked it .

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