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Poll: Who is Greatest?

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  1. alex rogers is offline
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    #161
    After watching that video who could even think that Jan ove Waldner was as good or better than Ma long.
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    #162
    Quote Originally Posted by alex rogers
    After watching that video who could even think that Jan ove Waldner was as good or better than Ma long.
    If you are talking about the video between Waldner and Ma Long, the point of that video is that at 45, with a bad back, having trouble moving, and not really playing very well, he was still able to use tactics to frustrate Ma Long and make the match somewhat close. He lost but he did not get destroyed. He actually played better than a lot of guys who Ma Long simply beats 4-0 and 3, 3, 3, 3. He can do that to pretty much anyone who isn't in the top 10 on a given day except someone like Bojan Tokic who seems to match up well vs Ma Long.

    If Waldner, as old and out of shape as that, could just use his head and stay in the match, then Waldner in his prime could probably play pretty decently with against the top players of today.

    Would he go down as one of the all time greats if he played today? We don't have the luxury of a time machine. But you can't say that in his prime he would get destroyed by the guys of today. Which is what was said and what I was responding to. But we can say that, old and out of shape, with a bad back and unable to train, having trouble moving, he still can nullify many of Ma Long's weapons. And 2 years later, in 2011, the match was even closer where I think Waldner may have taken Ma Long to 7 games. But I can't find the footage for that match.

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    #163
    Ma Long has won more majors than the Evergreen now I believe? But the Evergreen was more an allround specialist than him. Some services of Waldner were and are still very sharp! Mentally Waldner was also stronger than him. Besides let's not forget that Waldner has been playing in the professional competitions for more than 30 years!! Will Ma Long be playing for that long in the professional level too???!!! Of course the materials and the official playing rules were different in the heyday of Waldner. After Waldner was retired from playing in the international tournaments I haven't seen anyone with such a good ball control. It's also more enjoyment for me seeing Waldner playing than Ma Long on TV.
    Last edited by BORNINHKG; 05-30-2018 at 11:26 AM.

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    #164
    How about Wang liqin?3 times world champion,It s even haarder to win world championship than Olympics.Waldner only 2,Ma long only 2

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    #165
    Quote Originally Posted by chughtai
    waldner without a doubt he played with his knowledge of the game nd dictated play with it not like ma long who uses brute force nd aggression to win points
    I think you're underestimating the smarts & skills of Ma Long here. That description befits Fan Zhendong to some extent, but if you look closely you'll find that while not as versatile as Ma Long or Ma Lin, even Fan Zhendong does not get away with just brute power. (Hint: search for Fan Zhendong Roller if you want to see proof of exquisite touch).

    Ma Long is a master of placement, pace disturbance, pattern breaking. He just has a lot of power too, but he's very, very versatile. Who's got the must subtle variations in chop blocks? You get one guess, and it's actually not Koki Niwa.

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    #166
    Quote Originally Posted by vik
    How about Wang liqin?3 times world champion,It s even haarder to win world championship than Olympics.Waldner only 2,Ma long only 2
    I guess many don't consider Wang Liqin as the greatest of all time, because he has never achieved the career grand slam. So sadly he has never won the men's title at the Olympic Games in the singles. Could you please explain why it would be harder to become the WTTC champion than the Olympic champion? Will there be more world class top players at the WTTC?

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    #167
    Olymipcs now only max 2 players from 1 nation,less matches less competition,In wang days max 3 players from one nation.In order to win WTTC yu must compete for example 5 chinese players,5 german ,korean,japanese players.In days of Wang even 6 playeres were allowed.He had tobeat several players from china to win.

  8. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #168
    OH NO! Not this again.

    Lets not compare best from different eras.

    Waldner
    Kong Linghui
    Liu Gouliang
    Wang Liqin
    Zhang Jike
    Ma Long

    They are all the best. The best of separate eras.

    I do think, if Ma Long keeps doing what he is doing consideration for how good he is may trump all the others. But this thread was started in 2012. Before this necromancy from an hour ago, it had been dead for 3 years. The discussion from before ML had won any WTTCs is no longer relevant. The discussions from just after ML won his first WTTC is no longer relevant.

    It is worth noting that, before ML had won any WTTCs or OGs, this thread had started. I think that says something about fans of players who are playing currently. And personally, I feel history should be judged from a distance. Like: "Will FZD be the best ever?" is not worth asking right now. And back when this thread was started, there is no question that ML was not the Greatest Ever. Although, he now could be on that road. And some would say he now is. I still feel, he may one day be. But, he is still playing so it is not worth judging that yet.

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    #169
    GUO YUE HUA!!!!!

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    #170

    THE ENERGIS match did not end 2-3. Waldner took one set off


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    #171
    This was embarassing, lost 7 points in a row in the last set when he had match point, hard to watch. So it's very hard to say Waldner is the best and the greatest. I don’t understand how Ma Long faced less of a competition in peoples minds... Harimoto, fzd, lin yun ju, xu xin, zhang zhike, ma lin, wang hao, how are these lesser opponents ... he even played waldner once (agreed both were not in their prime, ma was way too young and Waldner was way too old but ma won 3/1 then) I’m not saying at all Waldner is a bad player, for sure not. But arguing ma had an easier opposition is just blatantly untrue.

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    #172
    Waldner had a brain, and he knew how to use it. When you see how Ma Long struggles against lefties with his stereotypical FH loopkills always bloked in diagonal VS lefties backhands, it's embarrassing... Waldner is the obvious GOAT cos' he could torture ANYONE in ANY ways.

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    #173
    Quote Originally Posted by Music&Ping
    Waldner had a brain, and he knew how to use it. When you see how Ma Long struggles against lefties with his stereotypical FH loopkills always bloked in diagonal VS lefties backhands, it's embarrassing... Waldner is the obvious GOAT cos' he could torture ANYONE in ANY ways.

    Haha, agree


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    #174
    Quote Originally Posted by Music&Ping
    Waldner had a brain, and he knew how to use it. When you see how Ma Long struggles against lefties with his stereotypical FH loopkills always bloked in diagonal VS lefties backhands, it's embarrassing... Waldner is the obvious GOAT cos' he could torture ANYONE in ANY ways.

    wow so wrong...i guess its embarassing being reigning OG champion and 3 time CONSECUTIVE WTTC champion

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    Last edited by kogeh; 05-05-2021 at 06:29 PM.

  15. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #175
    I find it entertaining that this thread from 2012 still has legs every so often.

    Entertaining how people get drawn into goat arguments so easily. There is no such thing. It is a media creation to get people to argue and create a buzz.

    But.....Argue on....activity on the forum....I am not against that.
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    #176
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    I find it entertaining that this thread from 2012 still has legs every so often.

    Entertaining how people get drawn into goat arguments so easily. There is no such thing. It is a media creation to get people to argue and create a buzz.

    But.....Argue on....activity on the forum....I am not against that.

    Both outstanding players obviously...it's best not to take this too seriously...but Walder is better though

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    #177
    To post our not to post....

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    Last edited by Baal; 05-05-2021 at 11:53 PM.

  18. Baal is offline
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    #178
    Time has spoken.

    Ma Long. Not even close.

    And I am a huge Waldner fan. Not only that, I learned to play as a kid in Sweden, lived there awhile, have only good memories and go back whenever I can.. So I ALWAYS cheer for Swedish players (given not so many Americans to cheer for). My dad actually took me to see Alser and Johansson play at a tournament in Stockholm.

    But at this point (not 2012 anymore)? Ma Long.

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    Last edited by Baal; 05-06-2021 at 12:00 AM.

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    #179
    Quote Originally Posted by Baal
    Time has spoken.

    Ma Long. Not even close.

    And I am a huge Waldner fan. Not only that, I learned to play as a kid in Sweden, lived there awhile, have only good memories and go back whenever I can.. So I ALWAYS cheer for Swedish players (given not so many Americans to cheer for). My dad actually took me to see Alser and Johansson play at a tournament in Stockholm.

    But at this point (not 2012 anymore)? Ma Long.

    Same thought. The consistency of ML's wins and ranking was not achieved by JO and that is hard to replicate.
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    #180
    ML is the top of the chinese wave.

    JOW was the wave.

    // I thought a bit of exaggeration won't hurt.

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