I am 15 years old, what is the chance of becoming a professional?

Der_Echte · Apr 27, 2020

Zhu81... 1400 ttr dude thinking he gonna be DER JUGGERNAUT OF TT in Detschland ???!!!

I am still laughing tomarrow... Germany proudly got at least a few hundred thousand players better than that level...

Even puny towns in Germany under 1000 population have fielded teams entirely from villagers way above that level hh as he aa.

You got that in USA also with the 400 the basement crowd.

One dude in Army thought he was rec center champ and made a bet with me on tt... I crush his every serve and win 11-3 or 11-2 each game...and if I were to challenge a ttr 2500 dude to a match score would be similar and Der_Echte doing the buying of lunch.

So many levels in tt.

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Der_Echte · Apr 27, 2020

Richie's Story show importance of individual discernment and by filter

Thereis no single one way of tt, but important to judge things for self.

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UpSideDownCarl · Apr 27, 2020

Richie said:
Those who provide advice without context of their playing level often end up causing confusion and might even damage the other persons game.

Some of the biggest stuff like this that I have seen is also bound to cause actual physical injury.

So, yeah, when someone thinks they are spinning the ball and they are using a three year old recreational racket with rubbers that have the grip of anti-spin, and they are telling you you need to make your strokes look more like Ma Long's....it is worth knowing the first part which is not being revealed.

So, nobody will argue with the idea that internet anonymity and the dunning krueger effect often collide on TT forums to create these forum TT experts that anyone sane should run away from.

zyu81 · Apr 27, 2020

Der_Echte said:
Zhu81... 1400 ttr dude thinking he gonna be DER JUGGERNAUT OF TT in Detschland ???!!!

I am still laughing tomarrow... Germany proudly got at least a few hundred thousand players better than that level...

Even puny towns in Germany under 1000 population have fielded teams entirely from villagers way above that level hh as he aa.

You got that in USA also with the 400 the basement crowd.

One dude in Army thought he was rec center champ and made a bet with me on tt... I crush his every serve and win 11-3 or 11-2 each game...and if I were to challenge a ttr 2500 dude to a match score would be similar and Der_Echte doing the buying of lunch.

So many levels in tt.

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This was not in Germany but I gave those ratings for context to readers. It also could have just been a classic case of overestimating one's own ability, that happens everywhere.

UpSideDownCarl · Apr 27, 2020

And to tie this in, I just hope the OP of this thread, plays, is motivated, loves TT and gets to as high a level as he can. I think it is a good goal to strive and try to keep improving. But as you strive, it may be more important that you love playing rather than worrying whether you can become one of the top players of your country.

I believe, I heard this, when Waldner was at the top of his game, he complained: "I want to be able to train with people who are better than me." (Or something to that effect).

That attitude of always wanting to strive, achieve and reach for more, it ultimately does not matter how far you go in the long run, that kind of mentality will help anyone in other areas of life. So that, and the discipline to work towards improving, consistently, over time, those are skills....that will help in many other areas of life.

Der_Echte · Apr 27, 2020

ajtatosmano2 said:
I guess in every league you can find those people, who just want to beat the obviously lower level players, as they only enjoy winning. But most of the players and teams here do their best to win their division, because they want to enjoy playing against stronger players for a whole year and improve.

The deal in Korea about the competition sport of staying way underclassified is for club glory at the team event

Many players would rather have one or many team event winner's certificate for the club wall over an individual singles winner certificate.

These players can always play stronger players any time, either in club or tourney They do not need to leave the division, already there are dozens of rungers. If they face a strong player in club, a handicap is given on 2+1+1 system...

2 puts for 1st level of difference, then additional 1 point for each additional level of difference.

Div 1 gives a 4 pt handicap todiv 4 ... div 2 gives 3 pt handicsp to div 4.

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Der_Echte · Apr 27, 2020

Lula said:
Feel like Americans and or keyboard warriors are very focused on ranking points. Maybe there is a necessity to be able to compare players online. Always thought that grown men that Do not play tabletennis for a living that Have a crazy high focus on ranking points are pretty odd types

You have a realistic view... and as unbelievable as it may seem, you would become even more surprised the more you hangout at the forums and the more time you spend just listening to guys talk in usa clubs in the manner you describe... with a straight face

This is a huge reason my friend Scoobie Doo Sergey Tsos is slow to register and talk on the forums. He feels his sound advice and perspective would be treated exactly like that. He is content to lurking giggleat those type of posts when he sees them.

He laughs at the 30 blade rotating collection of the latest OFF+ or by super version of the 1000 usage level crowd.

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darucla · Apr 29, 2020

For the OP, look at this video at around 6 minutes in. https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=_e0DNZqz6aI&feature=emb_logo

zyu81 · Apr 29, 2020

zyu81 said:
And when people who haven't seen proper table tennis except for on YouTube start to think they've got it all figured out because they watched some videos, rather than learning through actual experiences applied to real players... you end up with the hot takes you see in the YouTube comment section, written by your local club's 1300 expert.

And EmRatThich.

zyu81 · Apr 29, 2020

Der_Echte said:
You have a realistic view... and as unbelievable as it may seem, you would become even more surprised the more you hangout at the forums and the more time you spend just listening to guys talk in usa clubs in the manner you describe... with a straight face

This is a huge reason my friend Scoobie Doo Sergey Tsos is slow to register and talk on the forums. He feels his sound advice and perspective would be treated exactly like that. He is content to lurking giggleat those type of posts when he sees them.

He laughs at the 30 blade rotating collection of the latest OFF+ or by super version of the 1000 usage level crowd.

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I've actually heard from a few very high level players that they will read what is written about them online. Usually for giggles. Needless to say they have a very poor opinion of most of what gets circulated in online comments, and needless to say it repels them from ever wanting to post.

Der_Echte · Apr 29, 2020

Some pros come on forums, make some relevant and simple comments about a situation, then quickly, the goon squad robot Army of 1000 level basement experts proceed to tell the pro what is what... pro rightfully doesn't like the situation and does not ever post again.

Schlager himself had that happen on about.com before it shut down.

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UpSideDownCarl · Apr 29, 2020

Der_Echte said:
Some pros come on forums, make some relevant and simple comments about a situation, then quickly, the goon squad robot Army of 1000 level basement experts proceed to tell the pro what is what... pro rightfully doesn't like the situation and does not ever post again.

Schrader himself had that happen on about.com before it shut down.

I find it particularly entertaining to hear forum members try to explain what top pros are doing wrong and why they are not higher level than they are.

zyu81 · Apr 29, 2020

Especially the younger generation that is very in tune with social media and the internet. I don't want to give specific names but a good amount of millennial top players and almost all the Gen Z's sometimes or often read what is said about them online.

A good portion of people who are compelled to give their opinion on everything online also think their opinion is worth more than it is. It is also why you'll commonly see people online saying that "you don't need to be a good player to be a good coach", pointing to the few rare examples. Sure, it is not necessarily always true that you don't, but generally...you do. Kind of like people who point to Bill Gates to justify that a college degree is worthless.

Der_Echte · Apr 29, 2020

The kollage degree thing has a few aspects. It is generally over rated. So many in usa think you get a degree then life and decent meaningful employment comes so easy...

Wrong. There is a need to be able to market self and professional qualifications. Some choose a degree that for all practical purposes us not very marketable, like say English or general Liberal Arts.

Result is that many usa college grads do not get immediately employed as they envisioned... work as store clerks or uber driver...

Still, a degree provides opportunities not available to those without one, but it isn't the end all.

The dynamics in USA are different, but it doesn't diminish Zyu's point.

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Der_Echte · Apr 29, 2020

Then, there are some who had to get masters degree to teach kids in school... yeah, they got employment, but the money they have available to them after their work imposed required expenses, expenses to get to work and maintain, extra expenses incurred to live in proximity... taxes...

A dude working at restaurant who can walk, bike, or bus to work has more money available... and may work fewer hrs.

I still agree with Zyu's first point that many make a poor comparison to those who succeed without a degree and expect that level of success and have an attitude to expect it to come to them easy... almost like a birthright.

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mart1nandersson · Apr 29, 2020

zyu81 said:
Especially the younger generation that is very in tune with social media and the internet. I don't want to give specific names but a good amount of millennial top players and almost all the Gen Z's sometimes or often read what is said about them online.

A good portion of people who are compelled to give their opinion on everything online also think their opinion is worth more than it is. It is also why you'll commonly see people online saying that "you don't need to be a good player to be a good coach", pointing to the few rare examples. Sure, it is not necessarily always true that you don't, but generally...you do. Kind of like people who point to Bill Gates to justify that a college degree is worthless.

I’m in an environment with a lot of players that can’t spell social media. Last night two division 1 players (both 50/60+) were intensively discussing how to do the reverse pendulum serve. I normally shy away from them as they’re 3-4 divisions above me but I decided to show them the Timo Boll Butterfly video where he shows this in great detail. They looked at it like it was like a brand new invention. Happy days. I giggled while cycling home.

zyu81 · Apr 29, 2020

Der_Echte said:
Then, there are some who had to get masters degree to teach kids in school... yeah, they got employment, but the money they have available to them after their work imposed required expenses, expenses to get to work and maintain, extra expenses incurred to live in proximity... taxes...

A dude working at restaurant who can walk, bike, or bus to work has more money available... and may work fewer hrs.

I still agree with Zyu's first point that many make a poor comparison to those who succeed without a degree and expect that level of success and have an attitude to expect it to come to them easy... almost like a birthright.

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Right, there is no end all be all rule on either side of the spectrum, but just because one does not NEED to have a certain qualification to be considered some level of successful, certainly does not mean that anyone who DOESN'T have that qualification is in fact that level of success that they claim. And that is what I see implied by too many. For every, say Dirk Wagner, who was not an amazing player but is an amazing coach...there are a million people who are not amazing players nor amazing coaches but think they are.

Der_Echte · Apr 29, 2020

I would tend to agree. There are traits and skills, plus understanding, ability to communicate, ability to lead that are required to function at a very high level as a coach of elite athletes.

These are entirely different skills than the individual elite athlete has ... so there is the argument that being a former elite athlete is not required.

Yet, it is difficult to get the required level of knowledge without having been an elite athlete

Further, every elite athlete does not automatically become a great or even good coach of elites... the skills in para 1 apply and not all athletes have them.

In before the goon squad qrf (Quick Reaction Force)

Der_Echte does not have the understanding of elite level to nor likely ever will. I just understand fundamental and can relate it to adults.

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zyu81 · Apr 29, 2020

Der_Echte said:
I would tend to agree. There are traits and skills, plus understanding, ability to communicate, ability to lead that are required to function at a very high level as a coach of elite athletes.

These are entirely different skills than the individual elite athlete has ... so there is the argument that being a former elite athlete is not required.

Yet, it is difficult to get the required level of knowledge without having been an elite athlete

Further, every elite athlete does not automatically become a great or even good coach of elites... the skills in para 1 apply and not all athletes have them.

In before the goon squad qrf (Quick Reaction Force)

Not even necessarily elite. But there is some baseline, what that baseline is, many may disagree upon. But yes, having the necessary understanding of the game would be very difficult if said person was not able to experience or achieve it themselves to some acceptable degree.

Der_Echte said:
Further, every elite athlete does not automatically become a great or even good coach of elites... the skills in para 1 apply and not all athletes have them.

Yup. Definitely not. The natural talents especially, since it is hard to teach what someone just subconsciously gets.

Lula · Apr 29, 2020

I still think it is very possible to be a good coach and not be able to play very good yourself. Think there is also the other way that very good players Do not need to be good coaches. That is my experience. Feel like some good players are not interested in technique and how to Do the strokes and know even less about how to learn other players This. So coaching is about really knowing about the sport and alot of other aspects around it. Also think that since it is like this the players that end their own playing career to pursue coaching careers have great possibilites to become very good at it.

I am 15 years old, what is the chance of becoming a professional?

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