When you finally beat the player you never beat!!

MOG said:

But he is talking rubbish and not telling the truth about me? I would be saying a lot more if he was in the room with me. I will however remove the comment!

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You just can't make personal attacks with bad language. You can say what you think about the issue. Like, is your hand ever motionless? Does your opponent block the ball with his hand?

In looking closely, it does look like your opponent may be blocking the ball with his hand and wrist (it does not look like it is with the whole arm) and we can't be sure if it is on purpose or, an accidental habit he needs to address; the ball may be coming under his hand/wrist after he contacts the ball. I can't be sure as a result of the angle. If we could see from where you are seeing the serve, we would know.

But the point passifid made about pointing it out to the umpire is a good one. In the long run, an umpire seeing it and calling him on it, would cause him to change it much more than us talking about it here.

Which brings me to another point. Does this guy know you posted this on an international forum and then complained about his serves?

How would you respond if someone posted video of you on an international forum and started talking about you that way? Should the subject have been brought up here without you telling the guy you were posting this to the forum?

UpSideDownCarl said:

Which brings me to another point. Does this guy know you posted this on an international forum and then complained about his serves?

How would you respond if someone posted video of you on an international forum and started talking about you that way? Should the subject have been brought up here without you telling the guy you were posting this to the forum?

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I'd be pissed. This to me is a much bigger offense than serving illegally, especially when we are talking about a guy whose serves are borderline at most and clearly isn't gaining any clear advantages out of it or doing it maliciously. And especially when it is coming from a guy who recently had a blatantly illegal serve, and arguably still does. I'm still waiting for someone to tell me when both his free hand and the ball are stationary during the serve at 1:11, along with many other examples that I'm too lazy to timestamp.

MOG said:

He is actually a good friend of mine, and I have recently started to train with him quite a lot.

There is a lot of bad history to illegal serving in Hereford and me trying to nicely bring it up!

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If he is a good friend, you should have showed him this thread before you started talking about his serves.

MOG said:

Carl.

I would ask if you think the legality of my service has improved?

As you and the goon squad absolutely slaughtered me about 6 months ago for dropping my hand below the table!

I think it has significantly!! I am certainly trying to clean up the action!

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I do think your toss motion is changed. You are not dropping your hand and the ball below the table anymore. So, good job doing that work.

But if you really look closely, Zyu actually has a very good point. The rule says: "stationary free hand". And you could look at any number of your serves and if you go with slow motion and watch closely, your hand never stops moving. Does it have an effect on your opponents? I am not sure. I doubt it would bother me. But there is a reason why the rule indicates the hand should be stationary before the toss. It is a much easier fix than the old habit of dropping your hand below the table. So, I would say, just fix it rather than getting upset and acting out. You have shown you are capable of it.

BTW: I also think you are playing a lot better and your use of your pips is definitely improved.

If you watch the top pros, they all pause for a notable amount of time, with the hand motionless before they toss (most of the time).

And if you can understand that you were doing the illegal parts of your serve by accident and without realizing it, then you should be able to understand that this may be the case for the guy you are playing. Add to it that you are resistant to hearing it, and you might also understand that, without something that shows it clearly, he may not accept you saying that he is blocking view of the ball.

To show if he is actually blocking the ball, you would need a camera angle that is coming from pretty much behind where you are receiving the serve (I would say, behind and to the side of your left shoulder). And, if you got that footage, I would NOT show it here. I would show it to him and show him how easily he could fix it.

MOG said:

yes good point video removed

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Removing the video does not remove the fact that you brought up the subject that you feel his serves are against the rules on an international forum and without presenting to him that you were doing this. And I am not so sure the presentation was quite polite.

I think you need to think about the fact that: while presenting what is clearly a good win for you, you still felt the need to trash talk about your opponent's serves. To me, that means, you really should figure out how to have a clear moment's pause where your hand and the ball in your open palm are completely still.



How do we know for sure ML's hand is still? His elbow and part of his forearm are resting, still, on the table while his hand is behind the back end of the table as a result of the angle of the forearm. His hand could be more open. But I think it still meets the requirements. There is a reason so many top pros do just what ML is doing for the pause before the toss. 1) You cannot drop your hand below the table. 2) It makes it much more possible for you to pause, be still, collect your thoughts and be calm before the toss.