I think it would be very hard to set any rule except for an umpire's judgment call and would lead to too much controversy. Likewise, umpires do not always speak the same language as the players in the match so it can become difficult to convey the specifics of what they would be penalizing. I also do think a good rule in place to keep things at maybe a maximum of 80% of what Harimoto does would be a good thing.
Is Harimoto's screams disrespectful to the opponent?
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I think it would be very hard to set any rule except for an umpire's judgment call and would lead to too much controversy. Likewise, umpires do not always speak the same language as the players in the match so it can become difficult to convey the specifics of what they would be penalizing. I also do think a good rule in place to keep things at maybe a maximum of 80% of what Harimoto does would be a good thing.
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Zeio you are clearly fluent in English are you deliberately missing the point like you did with next level?
The point is I cannot tell but he seems to fit some of the albeit quite common in non disabled people. Quiet to the point of shy, very polite but sometimes very loud in specific circumstances especially when it comes to emotive voicing.
As such I asked if he was and expect a yes or no from somone like you who apparently seems to know him personally?
The point is I cannot tell but he seems to fit some of the albeit quite common in non disabled people. Quiet to the point of shy, very polite but sometimes very loud in specific circumstances especially when it comes to emotive voicing.
As such I asked if he was and expect a yes or no from somone like you who apparently seems to know him personally?
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Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
Now you're in moral crisis just like the moderator. Learning disability for someone who is a straight-A student but can't keep himself quiet under specific circumstances? So you're suggesting I should view Harimoto as a straight-A retard?
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Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
No, that's not the point. The point is he's suggesting something is wrong with Harimoto that only happens in the arena. What about his daily life? To the best of my knowledge, I've never seen any Japanese media report anything wrong with him. I've subbed NHK videos about his daily routines during the tour from 2018 and WTTC 2019. He's been very disciplined.
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I have never heard anything reported about Rafael Nadal but I have always felt something was off about him. He is still one of my favorite tennis players. Very disciplined and very intelligent.
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I'm asking this to people who see more about him. I only see him in table tennis. Table tennis is fringe and not commercial really where I live not even our own best or the Chinese are on TV playing let alone the lifestyle of a Japanese 17 year old star. Even Inoue isn't known really and boxing is much more Accessible.
It's not a moral crisis I think you're just "coping" with other opinions badly and saying it's others.
When I posted that there were no response but it seems like you really love the man and can convincingly say no.
Also people with asd tend to do extremely well academically but limited to a narrow subject spectrum usually
It's not a moral crisis I think you're just "coping" with other opinions badly and saying it's others.
When I posted that there were no response but it seems like you really love the man and can convincingly say no.
Also people with asd tend to do extremely well academically but limited to a narrow subject spectrum usually
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It is quite possible and quite likely that you are very wrong about this. But this is what happens to famous people all the time when people talk about them.
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Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
Fair point. How about this? Would you shout out of the blue for no reason once outside the table tennis court? passfid is suggesting that something is wrong with Harimoto's mind if he does that in the arena, whether EXCESSIVELY or not, which is something to be expected in a match, yet has not offered any evidence he had watched any footage of how he behaved once away from table tennis before posing that question. He was treading on thin ice, by intention or not. A normal human being could interpret that as a form of curse, particularly in Asian cultures.
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Yeah I thought it was unlikely to be fair next but I also definitely didn't want to rag on about behaviour if it was. Also with the information presented by our Japanese cohort it seems to be basically nil and also that the behaviour seems very controllable with nets and let's and also when on the back foot.
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toooooo much choice!!
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I personally believe the poll and the question in the poll is misguided. To vote would be a nod to the validity of something I feel is completely invalid.
If anyone else of the others who don't appear on the poll did not vote for similar reasons, I applaud them for not being herded like cattle.
if that’s what the others and yourself think, then I feel you have all more than validated the question asked, by posting numerous times on this thread and have been herded along with the rest of us.
if the question is invalid, then surely the answer has to be a NO??
Having just ate a dictionary for lunch!! Invalid ( based on an argument / statement or theory) would mean ‘not true because based on erroneous information or unsound reasoning’ therefore an answer of NO would be forthcoming.
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toooooo much choice!!
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Nope. My initial responses were an attack on the premise that, because a viewer does not like something it was okay to make attacks and shame a talented kid.
My responses were also about the fact that, eccentric behavior and antics was common in many sports and that, often, the athletes who do that are among the most famous in their sports, and often have had something to do with the specific sport becoming more popular or gaining more media attention. So, an attempt to ban personalized behavior should not be associated with making a sport more popular.
My responses have also been about the fact that, on the internet, from a screen and a keyboard, people seem very comfortable shaming a specific person in an attempt to get other people to agree with them. I don't like any side of that equation. And hence, I have no intention of falling in line and saying YES OR NO to something I completely disavow the entire premise of. And for that specific reason, me posting about disliking all sides of the premise presented.....is precisely the response I wanted to present.
I think my feeling about the subject is not straight forward: I think some of the after point celebrations are a bit annoying and embarrassing. Why can't people say something more than a guttural sound that means nothing when celebrating a point won in TT? I find it odd? Celebrations I have heard that I think less silly are things like: "Yes!" "Come On!" "Yeah baby!" "Alright!" "F-ck Yeah!" "Allez!"
I may also feel that the idea of restricting celebrations is a dicey subject. While there are certain behaviors that I may not like myself, I still feel that restricting them may be worse than the behavior in the first place. But, that also may depend on how it was implemented. And, as far as I know, in any sport, when a celebration moves towards the area of unsportsmanlike conduct, a game official, a referee, an umpire, already has the tools to handle that.
But, for me the most important thing is, online, this shaming that goes in all kinds of directions, I just feel it is a slippery slope. People shaming others for wearing masks, for not wearing masks, for this, for that, for so many things....So, because I don't like the premise of trying to make people appear bad for something they are doing, means I absolutely feel I have a right to comment and absolutely have a right to refuse to vote on a stupid poll while still commenting that the whole process of how people are lining up and attacking each other is the actual problem. So, nope....I don't have to vote.
If you don't get it, then....I am sorry but I can't help you there.
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Archyan said:
James Bond said:
Yup, we believe that. Yup.
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I decided I wanted to become the grammar police.
Yourself is a reflexive pronoun. For a reflexive pronoun to be used, the pronoun must refer to the subject of the sentence or parenthetical phrase.
--If you really think that way yourself.....
--I am going myself......
--He came up with that idea all by himself.....
Here are a few pulled off a grammar website:
--Jack decided to reward himself with a dinner out.
--Cynthia pours a cup of tea for herself every morning.
So, this:
--if that’s what the others and yourself think.....
Is incorrect usage of a reflexive pronoun. If you use the reflexive pronoun "yourself" then "you" (referring to me) would have to be the subject of that sentence, and it is not. From "That's" [contraction of that + the verb is] the That in "that's" is the subject and in that context it refers to the content that I abstained from voting because I disagree with the premise. And since "that's" and "yourself" are not the same thing or person, "yourself" is being used incorrectly.
Also, when someone says something like:
--John was joined by myself.....
That is incorrect grammar.
Here are some more examples of incorrect usage from the same grammar site I used for extra examples of correct usage above:
-- Incorrect: Andrew and myself will conduct today’s meeting.
-- Incorrect: Myself will conduct today’s meeting.
I remember an old Nike commercial where Michael Jordan and Patrick Ewing were on and Jordan said: "For a big guy, like myself." The commercial was funny, but that is incorrect usage of the reflexive pronoun.
Reflexive pronouns are used incorrectly all the time. All the time.
But this is an issue where there is not any shade of gray. The rules of grammar are clear. A reflexive pronoun refers to and is equal to the subject of the sentence or phrase within which it is contained. If it is used in a sentence and it is not referring back to and synonymous with the subject of the sentence or parenthetical phrase it is contained in, then it is being used incorrectly. Look it up on any grammar site or in any grammar book.
However, the subject of this thread: should a person be allowed to celebrate after winning a point or should the behavior be banned.....IS NOT A BLACK AND WHITE QUESTION. There are times when freedom of expression would be valuable and important. And there are times when the celebration has crossed a line.
Has Harimoto crossed a line? Is what he is doing no longer the sphere of celebration and free expression and is it now in the territory of UNSPORTSMANLIKE CONDUCT?
Well, it seems different people have different thresholds for where this divide is crossed. Passifid gave a good example of where the line may clearly be crossed where all would agree: if a player crossed over and punched the opponent, most, I have a feeling, would agree, that would cross a line. When Mike Tyson bit off Evander Hollyfield's right ear, most would agree that crossed a line. That the ref let them continue fighting may have been questionable. But it happened. However, when Tyson went and bit off Hollyfield's other ear, not many thought the fight should continue. (Yes, if you missed it, that happened. Look it up.)
I think that puts the discussion more in the sphere it belongs in. And I think the people thinking there are easy answers to this, ought to think very long and hard about what the actual subject matter they are discussing actually is. Do you value freedom of expression, and where does that end? This can be discussed without shaming any players or attempting to force people into opinions they don't actually hold.
---Is what Harimoto doing in the sphere of freedom of expression and celebration after winning a point (regardless of whether it is annoying or not)?
---Or is what Harimoto is doing crossing a clear line in the sand into the territory of unsportsmanlike conduct?
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if the statement is valid, as in its correct then the answer is YES
if the statement is invalid, as in incorrect, the answer is NO
This can be seen incorrect because ‘the post is biased and disrespectful to Harimoto’, and also as ‘no disrespect is meant by Harimoto to his opponents and the sport’. Either way it’s a NO
If Harimoto’s name had not been part of the question , if the question had read something like-
‘Is choing loudly during a match disrespectful to the opponent and the sport’
then I take it the post would not have been biased or misguided??
Harimoto, however would have been top off everyone’s list regarding loud Choing, 100%!!!!
if the post had been seen as disrespectful to Harimoto, which I think Carl is saying, when he says ‘the post is misguided’ then possibly the post should have been withdrawn.???
if this is Carl’s point then I have to agree.
I also raised my concerns when the term ‘Harimoto Haters’ was used, i don’t think (and definitely hope) that no one on this forum hates Harimoto.
Because no action has been taken regarding the initial post, then the post and question has therefore been validated, to a certain extent.
Far from me to criticise, I mean no offence to those that give their valuable time to run this forum and appreciate the effort they all put in.
There just seems to be quite a lot of bitchiness going on.
Apologies if that’s seen as myself included
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