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  1. Music&Ping is offline
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    #41
    Ok you seem to be either a stalker zeio, either a CNT fan.

    I stand corrected: DHS makes custom rubbers for CNT’s players and do not release them on the worldwide market, it’s been an issue well documented even by EmRatThich himself.

    Boosters are strictly forbidden by ITTF, why do they keep on using them then ? only because it does not exceed 4mm it’s ok ?

    I think it’s a way more serious issue than seeing guys doing « antics » against young asian players.

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    #42
    My answer to IB66: it’s pretty simple to keep the rules safe: put everyone in the same gluing room with officials to control the process for 2 hours. Then rackets into sealed enveloppes. No doubles standards anymore.

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    #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Music&Ping
    Ok you seem to be either a stalker zeio, either a CNT fan.

    I stand corrected: DHS makes custom rubbers for CNT’s players and do not release them on the worldwide market, it’s been an issue well documented even by EmRatThich himself.

    Boosters are strictly forbidden by ITTF, why do they keep on using them then ? only because it does not exceed 4mm it’s ok ?

    I think it’s a way more serious issue than seeing guys doing « antics » against young asian players.
    The DHS factory should have a voc detecting device also to keep parts per million inline with the ittf rule.

  4. zeio is offline
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    #44
    With all due respect, you have a lot of catching-up to do on many issues. When you say DHS does this, you gotta understand you're effectively making a blanket statement. Armstrong mentioned above is a counterexample. TSP is another one which supplied Haruna Fukuoka with custom-made Curl P-3 that outsiders couldn't get. Japanese bloggers question their own players and manufacturers as well.

    Boosters/tuners are legal when applied at the factory level, according to Adham Sharara when the "VOC limit" was implemented 12 years ago, as opposed to "speed glue ban".

    https://ooakforum.com/viewtopic.php?...96b61ec#p69793
    Q (haggisv):
    I'm sorry to keep questioning this, but I'm still unconvinced of the explanation...

    1. Lets assume we have a VOC-free poison-free booster. The factory glues an ITTF approved topsheet onto a sponge. Now the factory uses a booster on the SPONGE ONLY. Now according to all evidence I've seen, the ONLY effect that the booster has on the TOPSHEET is that it stretches it, which according to you is legal when done in the factory (within ITTF set limits). Sponges are already made with the use of chemical, and are also glued to the topsheet using VOC-based chemical, so the booster is simply part of this factory process. The rubber is aired properly before sold to the public. Legal rubber or not?

    2. Lets assume we have a VOC-free poison-free booster. The factory uses a booster on the sponge, BEFORE it's glued onto an ITTF approved topsheet. The rubber is aired properly before sold to the public. Legal rubber or not?

    3. A distributor buys a cheap ITTF approved topsheet and a sponge, and applies either on the the methods (1. or 2.) above. This turns a cheap chinese topsheet and sponge combination into a rubber of similar performance to the top-end Tensor style rubber. The rubber is aired properly before sold to the public. Legal or not?

    4. A player buys a cheap topsheet and sponge, and applies either on the the methods (1. or 2.) above. This turns his cheap chinese topsheet and sponge combination into a rubber of similar performance to the top-end Tensor style rubber. Legal or not?

    ...

    A (Adham):
    In order to answer your 4 scenarios, first I will explain clearly the rule:
    - Any post-factory alteration of the equipment (in this case racket covering) is NOT legal. By post-factory, we mean at the distributor level, at the retail level, at the player level, at the reseller level, etc.
    - VOC-containing glues are used at the factory level for several applications (gluing the rubber to the sponge, gluing the wood plies to make the racket, etc.). The factory must follow the rules of their government as it relates to VOCs (very strict in Japan, Canada, Germany,etc, but rather lax in China, India, Russia, etc.). In any case, the ITTF advices the factories to air and ventilate the equipment (rackets and racket coverings in this case) using special ventilated racks, which usually eliminate all VOCs (or almost all).
    So now, you could answer your questions yourself:

    1. Legal (at factory, no VOCs, no poison, properly aired, stretched within limits).
    2. Legal (same as above, if I understood correctly)
    3. Post factory, not legal
    4. Post factory, not legal

    The above is according to the current rules (if I understood the scenarios correctly).

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    #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Music&Ping
    How about setting up REALLY USEFULL measures against CNT's cheating ? i.e. boosters and custom DHS rubbers not released on the worldwide market.
    You do realize that non-Chinese players all boost, and in some cases have custom rubbers too, right?

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  6. zeio is offline
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    #46
    Been 9 years since. Good times bickering with Mastermind over Sharara's plugging the loophole of rubber authorization for topsheet only.

    http://mytabletennis.net/forum/forum...id-them#549291
    https://web.archive.org/web/20090201...ID_Forumn=100&
    President Forum wrote:

    Coming to an end I have two last questions. What do you think about the new trend that the companies “prepare” the rackets of their top players in the factories? Is this also forbidden? For me It is exactly the same delict as if an amateur player booster his rubbers. Is there a possibility to force the companies to stop this behavior in the future?


    It depends how it is done. If the sponge is boosted at the factory level when it is being produced. Then after production iit is aired and free of VOCs, then it is OK. No problem according to our rules. However, if the booster is ADDED after production and after approval by ITTF, then it is also illegal. We have both cases of course. For the players they feel better because they can say that they themselves did not do anything wrong. We are talking to the manufacturers and trying to work together to control the situation.
    Last edited by zeio; 01-06-2021 at 05:10 PM.

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    #47
    The inner carbon stiga is said to be released in spring. All other blades aside from clipper and inner carbon stiga are allegedly available in China only.

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    #48
    THE END OF THE BASTARD RUBBERS.

    T4 revision is underway, including new regulations for the sandwich rubbers. Some mosr noteworthy is the newly proposed requirement for a sponge layer to have an identificator printed on. Proposed by JTTA with the purpose to prevent all the BASTARD rubbers like DHS Hurrucane III blue sponge.

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    #49
    what is a bastard rubber

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    #50
    Quote Originally Posted by tt_beginner
    what is a bastard rubber
    Thats the brand new DHS John Snow. All Chinese stars are switching to it. Weird you haven't heard about that miracle yet.

    On a little more serious note. Why is this boost / nat gear hate spoiling every other equipment thread?

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    #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Trayanee
    Thats the brand new DHS John Snow. All Chinese stars are switching to it. Weird you haven't heard about that miracle yet.

    On a little more serious note. Why is this boost / nat gear hate spoiling every other equipment thread?
    I think some of it is to do with the fact that people want equality with what they can purchase and use.

    The rule about treating a rubber in the factory being ok, is fine, if you can get the rubber quickly which in the real world therefore not really practical . The treatment effects can wear off, if it was a food product you have a ‘USE BY’ date, the same would be needed for treated rubbers/ sponges!!!

    Blades are different, you can easily have a blade custom made. But people like to use what the pro’s use, it ‘sells’ and often for more!!

  12. P1ngP0ng3r is offline
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    #52
    Let's get back on topic

    TSP blades are EOL and SWAT blades will be Victas-branded as of March:
    Victas Swat
    Victas Swat Speed
    Victas Swat Power
    Victas Swat Carbon

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    #53
    anything new from Xiom?

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    #54
    Probably the An Jaeyun blade not sure yet.

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    #55
    Found these two. Probably too expensive for no name chinese products, but the the plies look well glued and handles seem to be nicely finished

    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001918738616.html
    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002009721142.html

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    #56
    Quote Originally Posted by P1ngP0ng3r
    Let's get back on topic

    TSP blades are EOL and SWAT blades will be Victas-branded as of March:
    Victas Swat
    Victas Swat Speed
    Victas Swat Power
    Victas Swat Carbon
    And not only SWAT: https://spinnier.com/equipment/tsp-i...n-into-victas/

  17. Music&Ping is offline
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    #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Trayanee
    Found these two. Probably too expensive for no name chinese products, but the the plies look well glued and handles seem to be nicely finished

    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001918738616.html
    https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002009721142.html
    Viscaria and Apolonia clones obviously, though labelling them both as OFF++ blades is a bit funny.

    Anyway the candlenut wood used here is more or less the same as Kiri's properties, but its tree is harvested also for nuts and oil. That's also more sustainable way to build an eco-friendly business, much appreciated !

  18. Konrad Bak is offline
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    #58
    Candlenut is even faster because it is harder and stiffer and probably cheaper.
    If I consider my made in oman apex off blade with candlenut core(this is not kiri or ayous) the throw is medium all the time so it will put more feeling to fukazi mushy zlc/alc

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    #59
    Quote Originally Posted by IB66
    I think some of it is to do with the fact that people want equality with what they can purchase and use.
    But can they use it? Ot just have it?

    For example the top product from andro is R53, which is well above most serious amateur levels. Too hard, too difficult to activate. I really like the ads with Gauzy showing R53 "made for me" and R48 "made for you".
    Most players are perfectly served with R48.
    For the few who can really unleash the potential of R53, does it really matter that Gauzy´s rubbers are maybe even better? And "better" in what respect? Maybe even harder, like some other professionals demandend their Evolution rubbers at 50 or even 52.5 degrees when the commercial version stopped at 47,5? (Yes, they were also able to pick a different sponge which now sits under the 50 degree version, but what difference does it really make to the hobby player?)

    If you could buy a rallye performance version of a car at 10 times the price, but only drive around town, would you?

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    Last edited by Airoc; 01-11-2021 at 06:23 PM.

  20. Kuba Hajto is offline
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    #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Airoc
    If you could buy a rallye performance version of a car at 10 times the price, but only drive around town, would you?
    That is not good question to ask. I daily 400HP BMW. If something bring joy to ones life, than what is wrong with using it by that particular person...

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