Editorial: It's hard to know if an equipment change actually makes you better

Does equipment change make you a better or worse player??

For some players it can make a huge difference!! More so with a ‘major’ change, let’s say from BH inverted to Bh SP. for some it’s good for others it’s bad!!

So as a recent re-starter to TT, and having used a reasonably high ( some may say- unreasonable!!) amount of different rubbers and blades, especially over the last 10 months since COVID kicked in.

Has using different rubbers and blades made me a better player?-

NO, but it has made me more knowledgeable.

What equipment has helped me improve?

BUYING A TABLE AND ROBOT !!! This has definitely improved my play, especially with serving!! But really all having a table and robot has done is given me the chance TO PLAY AND PRACTICE MORE.

THIS is the real point - PLAY, PRACTICE, LEARN, (no matter how old or young you are) THIS WILL TRUELY HELP YOU IMPROVE - but you gotta commit yourself and be prepared for a possible decline in standard until the Training really kicks in, DON’T GIVE IN !!!

AS SAID PREVIOUSLY BY OTHERS TREAT PRODUCT REVIEWS WITH A DEGREE OF SKEPTICISM they are a ‘personal impression’ and level / ability / experience of the reviewer are important.

HOWEVER ‘YOU DON’T KNOW UNTIL YOU USE SOMETHING’
you can only guess and assume, in general terms a lot of experienced players will know the ‘field park’ of a new rubbers performance by its general description. But not possibly what it will excel at ( if it does excel at anything!!)

You can tailor your equipment to your personal needs once you know your style, strengths and weaknesses.

lastly - CONFIDENCE !!!

THIS PLAYS A HUGE PART OF PERFORMANCE.

So confidence and mental standing is very important, if you are not confident with your equipment, then this will affect how you perform.

I love this thread! Although, I am definitely guilty of this by constantly trying to “fine tune” by testing out different thicknesses and hardness of the same rubber on the same blade. I have a coach, but the slight changes are very hard to notice in training. I notice it more in game when I start to miss or make a specific shot at a higher %.

I feel of two minds: During a coaching session, my mind is adaptive and really trying to process and soak things up. During game, I’m reactive. More relying on instinct and what’s really been drilled in.

Maybe the best way to (immediately) feel a difference in your gear change is to play games without trying to adapt to it in practice. Play your style. But- that might lead to some pretty bruised confidence which will in turn effect your play as well.

No winning without practice!

Oh- and as I’ve recently determined a rubber combination (type, thickness, hardness) that I like in my current blade- I’ve purchased a new blade of different composition hoping it works great with my rubbers. [huge 2020 shrug emoji]

Happy new year folks!


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zyu81 said:

Watch a good player with good technique power loop with hard rubber and then loop with soft rubber and see if you notice a difference.

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This is yet another statement without proof.
What difference and more importantly, why?
Which pros use hard rubbers?
If R53 is good then why not R58?

brokenball said:

The question is why are they good for anybody? I can understand that some people may prefer harder rubbers but I can see no reason why harder rubbers are better.

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Not all hard rubbers are fast. I'd rather argue against too fast rubbers, those might make sense for advanced players. But I don't understand the negativity against hard rubbers. People might even be afraid to buy those. They are neither better nor worse than soft rubbers, imo.

brokenball said:

This is yet another statement without proof.
What difference and more importantly, why?
Which pros use hard rubbers?
If R53 is good then why not R58?

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All of them. It's not a statement. It's a question, regarding your past experience. Have you ever?

Baal said:

There are a number of inherent biases at work but the real challenge is measurement, and on a lot of EJ (equipment junkie) threads it is just assumed that something like "my forehand loop was spinnier" or other such statements are actually true.

In fact, though this kind of statement should not be simply accepted at face value and should probably be read with a healthy skepticism.

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I like the message of this thread and the form and way it was formulated. The question is, how many people actually think that equipment change can make them better? I don't have a slightest clue, but optimistically I'd hope that not that many. Why, because we are TT players .

Baal said:

Now, bear in mind that I am talking about the kinds of equipment changes that most people are going to be making in the EJ spirit (of which we see countless threads on TT forums). Say you normally use Tenergy 05 and decide to try MXP or one of the Dignics -- or you switch from say a Viscaria to some DHS composite -- I'm not talking about something drastic, like switching from inverted to some pips or something like that. (But even then, once you learn what you can about the new equipment, you will still have all the same physical and mental limitations).

I'm guilty of all of this myself. And I should add that there are equipment choices that can make you a bit better, but it takes a long time and lots of matches to know for sure.

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In recent thread Carl posted a video about motoric learning. (https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/fo...ying-and-loosing-sindrome&p=333233#post333233). Put shortly, the more random, the better. I'd extrapolate this to the equipment, partially. Exactly those changes people do in the EJ spirit - as you formulated - not something drastic, imo, at least in so far equipment matters (say 10%), must somehow teach you and bring some information to the brain.

I don't argue for equipment change at all. In my case it is more like, OK, the rubbers are used, now I need new rubbers, I'll buy something close to what I had and liked, but perhaps not "exactly" the same. And if this is what you meant, then why feel quilty?

I'd add that the objective is not only to get better. It is also to have fun. Those are 2 sides of the same coin. After all, what do we have? From my small perspective it is couple of contacts of the ball "felt" in the brain. I like those, and I like to feel the differences.

brokenball said:

The question is why are they good for anybody? I can understand that some people may prefer harder rubbers but I can see no reason why harder rubbers are better.

If I were to pick a new forum name it would be "Goldilocks". No I am not a girl but Goldilocks was looking for a bed that wasn't too hard or too soft but just right. I really doubt that most people on the forum will find hard rubbers "just right" for them. I really do believe there are more than enough rubbers and blades that will be "just right" for you now without paying for the latest fad.

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Trololo, it reminds of a user that went through 50 shades of clipper to find the just right one (and it was the cheapest one lolz).

Music&Ping said:

I know that issue as a musician, since it's all about the senses of course there are a lot of biases due to the person's psychology talking about his/her equipment. In music it's about ears, and also touch feeling like in TT, and everyone has it's own biases for sure.

1- There are the beginners or amateurs telling ya that their 99 bucks entry level instrument is worth the "ferrari" Fender Custom Shop or Sadowsky jazz archtop guitar or the vintage stratocaster sold 100K at an auction.

2- There are the aspiring pros telling ya that a well built custom instrument they asked a luthier to make for them is the right move to get to another level

3- the pros telling ya either "that" entry level instrument is now their weapon of choice, or that 10K instrument specially tailored for them by a luthier is killing everything on earth, but of course it's all biased because of... endorsement system in the music industry. Most of them didn't pay anything to get that instrument.

People in general want to be reassured that they made the right move, because in that world we're living in not having enough money, or having too much ! is an issue: feeling ashamed we don't have enough money to buy the custom shop model, so we are inconsciouly biasing our brain and then our senses, or feeling ashamed we have too much or don't have to buy any equipment with all the endorsements we have and reassuring ourselves we are preaching the good when talking about pricey equipment.

So yeah it's difficult because we have to train ourselves to be the most objective possible regarding our own psychology, our own feelings,our own senses, do we think we really know ourselves that well ?

And finally, how to put the correct words on it ? the correct vocabulary that will be understood by the vast majority of players ? it's another source of biases too.

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Don't agree with this 100%. Entry level guitars have really crap frets. It tends to result in muted bends and recordable buzz. It's fine until you want to publish your playing.

brokenball said:

This is yet another statement without proof.
What difference and more importantly, why?
Which pros use hard rubbers?
If R53 is good then why not R58?

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Why not R60! Oh wait..

If you want to evaluate equipment changes and performance, then I think you would have to keep detailed records of your results in match play.
All the leagues I’ve played in keep some stats, usually games won and lost usually as a % won. also recent form, ie last 5 matches played 15, W 5 L 10 etc
You would also need to give it at least 1/2 a season before making the equipment change, so that you play all the other teams once with one set up and then the 2nd half of the season with the 2nd set up.
Even then there are variables, is the opposition players the same as the previous match ? If yes, have any of the other players changed their equipment?, home and away venues etc
Have YOU improved rather than the equipment making the difference? Or is it a bit of both?

So even if you did all you could to keep stats records etc I’d have to agree with Baal that it’s very difficult to assess the improvement or decline due to minor equipment changes!!


Maybe some of the equipment developments are actually performance based from testing, overall - slightly more control, slightly more spin, slightly more speed!!!
Are manufacturers going to release the test evidence? Unlikely!!
Maybe some are just ‘covering all the bases’ !!
Is there an independent testing facility for TT equipment ? Maybe there should be!! That would really throw the cat amongst the pigeons!!!

Advertisment - required 1 no Multi Millionaire TT enthusiast to set up and fund an independent equipment testing facility!!!

latej said:

Not all hard rubbers are fast. I'd rather argue against too fast rubbers, those might make sense for advanced players. But I don't understand the negativity against hard rubbers. People might even be afraid to buy those. They are neither better nor worse than soft rubbers, imo.

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That' is exactly why chinese style rubbers should be taken in consideration: hard sponge does not mean speed necessarily, it all depends if the sponge is porous or not. A hard and dense sponge like the H3 won't have the catapult effect as the german tensor rubbers have. That's why it has to be boosted to get that catapult effect, without boost it's safe for beginners.

Kuba Hajto said:

Trololo, it reminds of a user that went through 50 shades of clipper to find the just right one (and it was the cheapest one lolz).




Don't agree with this 100%. Entry level guitars have really crap frets. It tends to result in muted bends and recordable buzz. It's fine until you want to publish your playing.

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I know a friend, a killer swede bass player, who purchased a 89 bucks Harley Benton precision, and he... leveled the frets by himself, and now it plays ridiculously well. Of course it requires some knowledge and skills, but it took him only a couple of hours to get a nice bass.

Try to find high spots on a Squier or a Sire, they don't have any, the fretboards are well finished, really. Now if wanna talk about those old Warwick Rockbass built in China in the 2000's, yes: they were crap, because of the cheap iron used for the truss rod, many of those neck are warped nowadays, I got a student some years ago who came taking lessons with one of those defective basses, guess what ? he bought a 1st Harley Benton on Thomann, I checked the fretboard, too much buzzes, no problem for Thomann he got a new and very good one 2 weeks after returning that instrument.

Remember also that in the early 90's it was easy to test a blade cos' you could find them easily in physical shops. In My case there were at least 4 or 5 Stiga Clipper at the Decathlon shop near my University, It was fine for me with the 1st pick, been lucky ? maybe, but if it would have been defective no problem: I could have returned it to the shop and get another one to try in 15 mn.

I know... nowadays with internets it's not the same deal at all, as I've said with the student's bass issue.

Publish your playing ? yes, I've done that with a custom bass built at my request by a spanish luthier, 2400 bucks. And... guess what ? 2 years after getting it a problem occured: sharp fret ends ! why ? because my apprtement was dry, and the place where the neck has been built was wetter, simple as that. ALL instruments have to be checked, setup, repaired once in a while, it is wood, so moisture matters. That's why a blade doesn't keep its properties more than 3 years or so.

Music&Ping said:

I know a friend, a killer swede bass player, who purchased a 89 bucks Harley Benton precision, and he... leveled the frets by himself, and now it plays ridiculously well. Of course it requires some knowledge and skills, but it took him only a couple of hours to get a nice bass.

Try to find high spots on a Squier or a Sire, they don't have any, the fretboards are well finished, really. Now if wanna talk about those old Warwick Rockbass built in China in the 2000's, yes: they were crap, because of the cheap iron used for the truss rod, many of those neck are warped nowadays, I got a student some years ago who came taking lessons with one of those defective basses, guess what ? he bought a 1st Harley Benton on Thomann, I checked the fretboard, too much buzzes, no problem for Thomann he got a new and very good one 2 weeks after returning that instrument.

Remember also that in the early 90's it was easy to test a blade cos' you could find them easily in physical shops. In My case there were at least 4 or 5 Stiga Clipper at the Decathlon shop near my University, It was fine for me with the 1st pick, been lucky ? maybe, but if it would have been defective no problem: I could have returned it to the shop and get another one to try in 15 mn.

I know... nowadays with internets it's not the same deal at all, as I've said with student's bass issue.

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It is a bit derailing but fretwork is expensive, it costed me 2 times more than some entry level guitars. If you buy something that is really basic and entry you might have to jump some hoops in the guitar world.

The problem I have with any equipment is that, sometimes it may be a bit hard to detect why an error happened. In case of table tennis its always user error, but in case of guitars some times the flat is just worn and flat, because it was made from crappy material, or the fret is buzzing because the neck saddle was made of garbage plastic and wore through.

And as I've said: simply purchase your instrument at the biggest store on the internet, if it's defective, return it and they'll give you a new one.

You are searching for problems where there are not any. What you're supposing was right 40 years ago, crappy instruments were coming over. Now it's not the same at all.

Levelling is feasible with some skills and cost nothing, and of course, it's not worth asking Thomann to put an entry level instrument in the Plek machine for 200 bucks, I would do it for my Marin Cano for sure, but not for an Harley Benton.

im not a pro by any means.in fact,im not even near average(like i once used to be).but there's one thing i can agree on,and that is,as long as you dont practice,even if they give you ma long's equipment,you are not gonna end up being happy with it.
i used to play with the donic ovtcharov true carbon blade almost right when it came out and i thought it's the second to best blade ever because i was in mad love with the hurricane long 5 blade and i thought there has to be a reason ma long is the olympic champion.
so,two years go by and i take a break from playing because i gotta study,and i get myself the hurricane long 5 blade.and what happened? i missed my old racket! but then i played my own racket and i still couldnt play.so i reckoned it has to do with my technique.So,instead of whining,i tried to remember all the things my coaches had told me before and i finally got it right with the hurricane long blade!


what im trying to say is not the fact that the blade made me better,but rather,how important it is to get the technique right.
like i said,im not even near average and yet i have the understanding that racket doesnt play the game for you,but you dbviously there is a difference between a trash blade and a high quality blade,but assuming you already wanna get a high quality blade,then it's just about adapting to the stiffness and feeling

i actually used to think dan is trying to sell the product whenever he reviewd something because he never gave negative feedback like that.then i realized it's most probably because dan is a very great player himself who doesnt find himself struggling to adapt to the equipment.So despite the cons a blade has,he still gets the best of them.

I don't know of any other sport where the equipment you use has a greater impact on how you play, for better or worse. For example, if your setup is too fast, it can hurt your development, technique and consistency. If your setup is not matched to your playing style, you can't play to your full potential. So I personally believe it's really important to have a blade and rubbers that are aligned with your playing ability and style. That won't be known though until you have a certain amount of experience.

I thought I heard in a podcast interview that most youth in China use basically the same setup until they have perfected their strokes after years of training, and at approximately the age of 12 can start to develop their unique style and perhaps change their setup. Can anyone confirm this? If so, sounds like a good strategy. Perfect the strokes with a basic, relatively slow setup before customizing...

The problem is when you are forever in search of the holy grail setup, forgetting that with every blade and rubber there are going to be tradeoffs. Once you determine what's most important to you and your game, it becomes a lot easier to settle on a setup. That's just my opinion.

PushSmasher said:

I don't know of any other sport where the equipment you use has a greater impact on how you play, for better or worse. For example, if your setup is too fast, it can hurt your development, technique and consistency. If your setup is not matched to your playing style, you can't play to your full potential. So I personally believe it's really important to have a blade and rubbers that are aligned with your playing ability and style. That won't be known though until you have a certain amount of experience.

I thought I heard in a podcast interview that most youth in China use basically the same setup until they have perfected their strokes after years of training, and at approximately the age of 12 can start to develop their unique style and perhaps change their setup. Can anyone confirm this? If so, sounds like a good strategy. Perfect the strokes with a basic, relatively slow setup before customizing...

The problem is when you are forever in search of the holy grail setup, forgetting that with every blade and rubber there are going to be tradeoffs. Once you determine what's most important to you and your game, it becomes a lot easier to settle on a setup. That's just my opinion.

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i heavily believe it all has to do with mentality.if you believe a setup is good,then you're most probably right.and if you think it's bad,it's actually gonna make you under-perform.unless you're really using something that's way out of your style,which is a totally different conversation

Brs said:

So a lot of equipment changes do make you better, at something. They also make you worse at something else. All of this is within the constraints of your level.

I changed a couple of years ago to short pips backhand. This made my backhand attack way better. Better as in, more consistently landing and much harder for opponents (at my level) to return. But I can't play backhands away from the table now, and my backhand push sucks. These are reap changes because of the equipment. I happily take that trade because I want to attack and I want to play close to the table. But even with a massive change like that there is no free lunch. If something is better something else is worse.

Most modern inverted rubbers make literally no difference. But I changed for a while from fastarc g1 to butterfly aibiss. Aibiss is about 61° on the ESN scale, the hardest rubber I have ever felt by far. Suddenly my short touch was ridiculous. I could take a long backspin ball and push it so it bounced four times on the opponents side. And my short push is bad. But my forehand loop was less consistent and had less spin and speed. So as much as receiving short would help me get the first attack in, I probably wouldn't win many points with it.

But with either of those changes, which are much bigger than what most EJs routinely do, I'm still going to play within my 1800 - 2050 range. Because playing level is < 5% equipment and > 95% skills.

So baal's OP is true that equipment changes hardly ever make a difference to your overall level. But he left out that they can rearrange your level on different strokes by a lot. Unfortunately, for something to go up something else almost surely went down. If you don't find that out because you only looped vs block with a borrowed setup then you are in for disappointment when you buy one and have to serve and receive with it. The key is to match the strengths of your equipment with the way you want to play.

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Love this post.

I think I'm the opposite of an EJ. I've used the same blade (nittaku acoustic) for about 5ish years and recently bought another with almost identical weight. I've used tenergy 05 for about 5 years too and Rakza 7 for 3 years, I think. I really don't like change. For a while I've thought about changing to chinese rubber on the FH since I think my technique has improved since a few years ago. I also hit harder on my BH so I wanted a harder rubber for the BH too. I've now changed to hurricane 8 and mantra H.

I feel they give me an advantage in serve return since the ball doesn't trampoline off the rubber as easily as with the softer rubbers and when I hit hard, I hit harder than before. Both rubbers are grippy, which is important as it makes it easier to hit slow and spinny loops.

It's difficult to say whether it's because of the equipment change or other factors (perhaps I'm just playing better generally), but after the switch I've had big winning streaks (about 5-7 wins in a row) against the same players I practiced and played against before which I'd say are fairly equal in level. I'm sure I'll go on a losing streak after this post, just to show it had nothing to do with the equipment .

Either way, I think I made a good decision to switch up my setup based on what I expect to get out of them. Less free power and the disadvantages and advantages that comes with that. Easier to serve short with more spin, easier to receive short. Easier to counter topspin with the FH, easier to block on the BH as the ball doesn't spring off.

So I don't think equipment change has made me better but it has (maybe) suited the things I base my game around better, considering the things I try to do. Mostly that is to serve short, try to receive short, counter hard on the FH, block or sometimes counter on the BH. I find this setup less spin sensitive which helps me too. The guys I practice with have said that I've been more consistent and put the ball on the table more.

But like BRS said, we'll still play play within a certain skill range, but maybe if equipment change is done well it can bump one up to the higher end of that range and suit their skills better. Since there isn't a massive difference between most inverted rubbers there is only so much change that can be made. For me, going from very bouncy rubbers to rubbers much less bouncy was a big change. If I now went from hurricane 8 to another chinese rubber or mantra H to another of similar hardness I'd expect to see fewer differences.

Baal said:

Manufacturers make a huge variety of subtly different kinds of rubber and blades all designed for pretty much the same kind of player. Then they, along with "experts" on forums, convince people that there is some sort of super secret rocket science (accumulated by "experience") by which every aspect of a player's technique (or technical limitations) can be perfectly matched to this finely tuned equipment. You just need to try all their stuff until you find the right COMBINATION and ONLY THEN can you reach your "full potential"; but then they will introduce a new version with 1 degree harder sponge.....

Reality is that after a period for your brain to get used to the new thing, rubber or blade, you play like you play. Yiur motor systems will adjust to this new setup. Then you will be you. Again. Switching from ALC to ZLC will have zero impact on your level.

But, let's assume it does, a little? It is after all possible and sometimes does happen. Rarely. How would you know? Objective (quantitative) measures of your overall level take a long time to accumulate.

Be skeptical!! (Also, as Brs noted, the equipment choicess that actually do have a lasting impact entail tradeoffs!!).

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1. If what you are saying is true the a lot people can adjust to a sardius or primorac carbon with time. My former coach has used extensively tamca 5000 blades but still settled for a dhs 08 blade despite playing with a carbon blade for years. He even reached as high as 2400 us rating. So where is the brain and equipment adjustment are you talking about within the context of your arguement?
2. Yes, as an experienced coach of beginners to college level players, i can definitely say the opposite of what you are saying. I have downgraded blades that are too fast for players and produced better accuracy of shots for them compared to them using very fast equipment. If i will take your statement as fact then their topspin shots and counters will still be flying off the table. Why would i as a coach measure the success by quantitative measurements only? If as a coach i would see their shots to be more accurate and more spinny, better handling, etc, wouldn't that be enough already??

3. Since you have something against forum "experts" here which i am counted as one, how in the world will you describe an equipment when you are testing it then?

4. On higher levels of play, if a certain rubber or blade makes your feel of the game better, why not??

5. Equipment combinations are endless due to the number of brands and products but there are always safe setups a playwr can try. Which would you choose for a player who has no access to an equipment to try - chose a safe setup that was suggested or just buy an equipment on what he wants with nomprior knowledge?

6. "Equipment reviews are biased, no negative thoughts" - i have heard of this crap a lot but in my opinion people who think of this way are the ones biases themselves. If a certain equipment is not letting you perform optimally, you dismiss it as garbage then another person likes it and keeps it, aren't you the one who is biased? You can say it wasn't right for you but is it a bad equipment? Hell no! Again, that dismisses your theory that every equipment can just be adjusted. I cannot imagine all those people who loves tenergy 05 and then will use DHS H3 unboosted (since this is the natural state of the rubber). Sure give them time to adjust but are you sure they would not want to go back tonuse tenergy 05??

6. You actually dismissed the importance of comfort and feel of using an equipment because according to you and science the motor part of the brain will just let you adjust properly.