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  1. hipnotic is offline
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    #61
    Quote Originally Posted by brokenball

    Well how do you propose to measure the speed of the blade AT DIFFERENT SPEEDS using frequencies?
    The frequencies won't change as the speed of impact changes, only the amplitude which is something you guys ignore.
    Wow, you're so desperate for validation that you simply ignore what other people write. It's like talking to a wall.

    OK, you are right Tony Stark, I'm out.


    Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk

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  2. brokenball is offline
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    #62
    hipnotic;338601Wow, you're so desperate for validation that you simply ignore what other people write. It's like talking to a wall.

    OK, you are right Tony Stark, I'm out.


    Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk
    I didn't ignore the frequency stuff. I simply pointed out that it can't be used for measuring speed. This thread is about measuring blade speed not frequency.
    No one, NO ONE, has shown a way to calculate blade speed using frequency.
    If you could show the forum a way then maybe we should listen but until then you and others should be ignored and only talk to walls to avoid misleading people..
    I don't understand and it is frustrating when people perpetuate the same old garbage year after year even when I have pointed out that Tiefenbacher figured this out over 20 years ago.
    I have been posting the Tiefenbacher document for over 10 years now.
    Re-read the second paragraph of section 1. You can see Tiefenbacher was frustrated too.

    Nothing has changed except that technology has improved a lot so now there are high speed cameras that can record at much higher frame rates.
    Unfortunately the TT forums have not changed and it is the TT FORUMs not ME that has ignored the true information.
    You can't refute this. That is what really p!$$e$ you off.

  3. lodro is offline
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    #63
    brokenball;338623I didn't ignore the frequency stuff. I simply pointed out that it can't be used for measuring speed. This thread is about measuring blade speed not frequency.
    No one, NO ONE, has shown a way to calculate blade speed using frequency.
    If you could show the forum a way then maybe we should listen but until then you and others should be ignored and only talk to walls to avoid misleading people..
    I don't understand and it is frustrating when people perpetuate the same old garbage year after year even when I have pointed out that Tiefenbacher figured this out over 20 years ago.
    I have been posting the Tiefenbacher document for over 10 years now.
    Re-read the second paragraph of section 1. You can see Tiefenbacher was frustrated too.

    Nothing has changed except that technology has improved a lot so now there are high speed cameras that can record at much higher frame rates.
    Unfortunately the TT forums have not changed and it is the TT FORUMs not ME that has ignored the true information.
    You can't refute this. That is what really p!$$e$ you off.
    Using the existing technologies and the spare time that everybody who took part in this here discussion seems to have, this might be
    a great chance to lodge a class action suit against all the blade manufacturers, stopping them once and for all to advertise their blades
    using their "fantasy-figures", and misleading the potential buyers into having to purchase half a dozen blades instead of just the one.
    The fantasy figures like SPEED : xyz
    SPINN zyx
    CONTROL xxx etc.

  4. Николай Петров is offline
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    #64
    Tbh the most accurate way that I found is to look at the blade composition the thickness and stiffness and have a brief Idea of what the blade's speed is close to compared to other blades that you have used but its still not exact and still there are some blades who you cant quite tell or explain their speed by what the manufacturer says and other people too like go to most off plus blades in tt11 and blades like hurricane hao 2-3 stiga dynasty carbon people are saying comments like great control how does a blade that national player use and is fast and stiff have great control. Some one will buy that blade because of comments like that.

  5. lodro is offline
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    #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Николай Петров
    Tbh the most accurate way that I found is to look at the blade composition the thickness and stiffness and have a brief Idea of what the blade's speed is close to compared to other blades that you have used but its still not exact and still there are some blades who you cant quite tell or explain their speed by what the manufacturer says and other people too like go to most off plus blades in tt11 and blades like hurricane hao 2-3 stiga dynasty carbon people are saying comments like great control how does a blade that national player use and is fast and stiff have great control. Some one will buy that blade because of comments like that.

    YEP ! It sure is a jungle out there and the only ones benefiting from the chaos are the manufacturers of blades. (and rubbers)
    The only ones suffering from the chaos are us players who after """"careful research """"" end up with yet another blade that has nothing in
    common with the advertising dribble of the sellers.
    Life is hard 😜

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  6. Baal is offline
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    #66
    Best way to measure blade speed? Put on your favorite rubber and play with it.

    What if you don't own it? Try your clubmate's new setup.

    None of the rest of this stuff matters.

  7. lodro is offline
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    #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Baal
    Best way to measure blade speed? Put on your favorite rubber and play with it.

    What if you don't own it? Try your clubmate's new setup.

    None of the rest of this stuff matters.


    A very big AMEN ! to that 👍


  8. silvershamaa is offline
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    #68

    Quote Originally Posted by brokenball
    Sometimes I wonder why I bother. Sometimes you guys make me want to scream something not nice.
    I have seen this frequency BS go on long enough. Frequency does have something to do with it but there is more.


    Answer this. If the ball hits the paddle and vibrates as you say then that energy is still in the paddle and NOT BEING TRANSFERRED TO THE BALL.
    An audio spectrum analyzer is good for getting a general idea. A laser sensor would be better because then it is possible to see how each square cm of the blade is vibrating. It may be possible to get a small accelerometer to do the same thing. The energy can be computed at that point then all the energy calculations for every square cm of the paddle can be summed to get the energy the paddle has absorbed and NOT RETURNED TO THE BALL. Think about it. No one has and it has been a decade at least.
    Here is a quiz.
    If you had a laser measuring system that can measure at a specific point, then what information would you need to calculate the energy in the paddle at that point?

    Did you read the Tiefenbacher document? The COR for the TT ball bouncing off of steel and bouncing off of marble are much different yet they are both "stiff".


    ???


    People generate power. The blade transfer energy to the ball but not all of it.
    Explain this. Lose power or lose energy? What is the vice-versa case. Lets see data. I want facts.


    A curve?
    No one here on this thread wants to see constant baseless insults like this against those who actually have experience building blades and have done their research. Hipnotic clearly mentioned frequency can give a general assumption but "many other variables play a part in the speed of a blade". In my blade-making experience, when two blades have a very similar structure, (for example, both 5W, 2-inner-fiber), frequency will give a fairly good indicator of how powerful the blade will play. Although of course, materials will also have an impact, such as the thickness/density of the composite layer, and what kind of fiber is used. Btw, as for why there aren't 5000 hz blades: I just bounced a ball on a 20 mm thick slab of Limba and it was below 5000 hz. I doubt anyone would ever think about playing using something more powerful than that or even close to that.

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  9. brokenball is offline
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    #69
    Quote Originally Posted by silvershamaa
    No one here on this thread wants to see constant baseless insults like this against those who actually have experience building blades and have done their research. Hipnotic clearly mentioned frequency can give a general assumption but "many other variables play a part in the speed of a blade". In my blade-making experience, when two blades have a very similar structure, (for example, both 5W, 2-inner-fiber), frequency will give a fairly good indicator of how powerful the blade will play. Although of course, materials will also have an impact, such as the thickness/density of the composite layer, and what kind of fiber is used. Btw, as for why there aren't 5000 hz blades: I just bounced a ball on a 20 mm thick slab of Limba and it was below 5000 hz. I doubt anyone would ever think about playing using something more powerful than that or even close to that.
    I didn't insult anybody. I just pointed out how to measure the speed of a blade and rubbed people's noses in it.
    No one has yet showed how they can compute the speed of a blade besides actually measuring the speed before and speed after impact.
    BTW, blades don't have or generate power unless you burn them. Then you can generate heat and boil water for steam.

    Good for you for actually bouncing a ball of of 20mm of Limba.
    What was the frequency? Was it higher than those listed in the tables above?
    Now you have some facts, not opinions like everyone else.
    It would be nice to measure the speed before or after impact to calculate a COR.
    You could also drop the ball from a height and use the square root of the rebound distance.
    This would provide an upper limit for speed for paddles.
    The short answer is the blade would be too stiff but mostly to big and heavy.
    I have a cutting board I mount rubbers on for testing. The cutting board doesn't absorb much energy. This way I can evaluate just the rubber.
    I still wonder about the lignum vitae wood. Lignum vitae is very hard. It is so hard that it was used for bearings a long time ago.

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