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  1. Michael Zhuang is offline
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    #21
    Quote Originally Posted by piligrim

    I had Stuor Long 5 blade witch is clone of Hurricane Long 5. I found it only looks same but play totally different. Didn't like it

    What were the main differences in how they play? Im guessing the Stuor was a lot less stiff and fast?


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    #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Zhuang

    What were the main differences in how they play? Im guessing the Stuor was a lot less stiff and fast?

    Stuor much slower


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    #23
    Quote Originally Posted by piligrim

    Stuor much slower

    Â

    What makes the HL5 so fast? Its a pretty thin blade isnt it?


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    #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Zhuang
    Â

    What makes the HL5 so fast? Its a pretty thin blade isnt it?


    I have no idea


  5. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Zhuang
    Â

    What makes the HL5 so fast? Its a pretty thin blade isnt it?

    Quote Originally Posted by piligrim


    I have no idea

    Sometimes things like gluing process, how they age or treat the wood, or if they add something in the glue to change the hardness between plies or the ability for the plies to move/flex with each other, can drastically change the playing characteristics of a blade.

    With the DHS ML5 or the W968 blade, I have no idea what they do in the process of making it. But it seems, a lot of people like that blade.
    Setup 1: Blade by Nate: Vortex Spin Machine, FH Evolution MX-K, BH Evolution FX-P
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  6. Baal is offline
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    #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Zhuang

    Whichever country you live in, you pay taxes to a criminal enterprise with crimes and sins on their hand, so we are all part of the hypocrisy. I dont think too deep, im just curious how well these cloners have learnt to make a blade.

    Just out of curiosity how would you react if a hacker stole your identity and drained your accounts?


  7. lodro is offline
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    #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Baal

    Just out of curiosity how would you react if a hacker stole your identity and drained your accounts?


    Not the same. This is not really a matter of morals and ethics.

    2 items are openly advertised : an expensive one from a reputable firm and a cheap one from "who knows what ,where and when."
    Those that want to purchase the expensive one can do so and likewise for those who prefer the el cheapo.

    NO BLAME !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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    #28
    I am very interessted in the playing charakter from this fake blade.
    I would be happy for a review.

  9. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #29
    Quote Originally Posted by lodro


    Not the same. This is not really a matter of morals and ethics.

    2 items are openly advertised : an expensive one from a reputable firm and a cheap one from "who knows what ,where and when."
    Those that want to purchase the expensive one can do so and likewise for those who prefer the el cheapo.

    NO BLAME !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    If you were talking about a Butterfly ZJK ZLC and a Yinhe blade that openly says it is a clone of the Butterfly ZLC and put a name of their own to the blade and have THEIR BRAND NAME TO STAND BEHIND THEIR PRODUCT, I would agree with you.

    But a counterfeit item is not what you describe above. The people who made the blade are putting the brand of a company that did not make the blade to hide who they are and pretend it was made by a well known company.

    If they blade comes with manufacturer's defects, you cannot contact the company that made the blade. If you try to contact Butterfly, Butterfly will tell you you bought a counterfeit and that they can't do anything for you.

    The counterfeit company is doing damage to Butterfly and you have no way of finding out who actually made the blade.

    So, I think Baal's example is not 100% the same issue. But it is actually in the ballpark, regardless of whether it is a more extreme example: that extreme example shows the ballpark and direction that things would escalate to in a more extreme example.

    The Following 2 Users Like UpSideDownCarl's Post:

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  10. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Kinay
    I am very interessted in the playing charakter from this fake blade.
    I would be happy for a review.
    Sorry about this.

    TABLE TENNIS DAILY DOES NOT PROMOTE COUNTERFEIT PRODUCTS.

    IF THEIR IS A REVIEW OF THE BLADE IN THE OP THE REVIEW WILL BE TAKEN DOWN.

    SO, NO, DO NOT REVIEW THE BLADE IN QUESTION.

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    Ch3nM3ng

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  11. Michael Zhuang is offline
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    #31
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    Sorry about this.

    TABLE TENNIS DAILY DOES NOT PROMOTE COUNTERFEIT PRODUCTS.

    IF THEIR IS A REVIEW OF THE BLADE IN THE OP THE REVIEW WILL BE TAKEN DOWN.

    SO, NO, DO NOT REVIEW THE BLADE IN QUESTION.
    Â

    I wont review the product to promote it, but can I just make a few comments about the blade as an examination of the curious nature of these fake blades.Â


  12. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Zhuang
    Â

    I wont review the product to promote it, but can I just make a few comments about the blade as an examination of the curious nature of these fake blades.Â

    Comments like the ones I have already made, "they play better than one might expect," are fine. But a detailed review like you are trying to promote the blade would not be okay. So, I am okay with the comment above. As long as you understand where I am coming from and why I can't let posts that promote a counterfeit product to stand.

    All that being said, I prefer the discussion about different TT companies make good quality TT products for less money than the more popular brands. To me that is a more interesting subject anyway.
    Last edited by UpSideDownCarl; 4 Weeks Ago at 08:39 PM.
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  13. lodro is offline
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    #33
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    If you were talking about a Butterfly ZJK ZLC and a Yinhe blade that openly says it is a clone of the Butterfly ZLC and put a name of their own to the blade and have THEIR BRAND NAME TO STAND BEHIND THEIR PRODUCT, I would agree with you.

    But a counterfeit item is not what you describe above. The people who made the blade are putting the brand of a company that did not make the blade to hide who they are and pretend it was made by a well known company.

    If they blade comes with manufacturer's defects, you cannot contact the company that made the blade. If you try to contact Butterfly, Butterfly will tell you you bought a counterfeit and that they can't do anything for you.

    The counterfeit company is doing damage to Butterfly and you have no way of finding out who actually made the blade.

    So, I think Baal's example is not 100% the same issue. But it is actually in the ballpark, regardless of whether it is a more extreme example: that extreme example shows the ballpark and direction that things would escalate to in a more extreme example.


    like i already said in post #11 Re. criminal activities : I know everybody is pinching of everybody and I have long accepted that.
    I do wish though that when someone makes a clone they would stand by it.
    I don't mind them declaring : ""This is a perfect clone of XYZ """ but trying to sell it as "The REAL THING""" goes a bit far.

    Maybe Butterfly have given up being pro-active in trying to fight manufacturers and sellers of their RIP-OFFs
    Personally, I would buy a clone - but never a clone that actually openly pretends that it is the real thing.
    I do applaud DHS for their system of the golden "scratchy-stickers". While not perfect, it does give a buyer a fair chance to check if
    he/she has been sold a genuine product.

    All being said, I do agree with yours and this forums policies wholeheartedly 👍

    The Following User Likes lodro's Post:

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  14. Michael Zhuang is offline
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    #34
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    Comments like the ones I have already made, "they play better than one might expect," are fine. But a detailed review like you are trying to promote the blade would not be okay. So, I am okay with the comment above. As long as you understand where I am coming from and why I can't let posts that promote a counterfeit product to stand.

    All that being said, I prefer the discussion about different TT companies make good quality TT products for less money than the more popular brands. To me that is a more interesting subject anyway.
    Â

    Im very interested in this subject as well. Its hard to get factual and objective information online. I really want to know all the good blades from Yinhe, Sanwei, Sword, Loki, etc.Â

    And I want to know the good rubbers from them as well.Â


  15. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #35
    Quote Originally Posted by lodro


    like i already said in post #11 Re. criminal activities : I know everybody is pinching of everybody and I have long accepted that.
    I do wish though that when someone makes a clone they would stand by it.
    I don't mind them declaring : ""This is a perfect clone of XYZ """ but trying to sell it as "The REAL THING""" goes a bit far.

    Maybe Butterfly have given up being pro-active in trying to fight manufacturers and sellers of their RIP-OFFs
    Personally, I would buy a clone - but never a clone that actually openly pretends that it is the real thing.
    I do applaud DHS for their system of the golden "scratchy-stickers". While not perfect, it does give a buyer a fair chance to check if
    he/she has been sold a genuine product.

    All being said, I do agree with yours and this forums policies wholeheartedly 👍

    I would say, then, it is worth distinguishing between two things:

    1) A CLONE: a blade that is an attempt to copy the plies and playing characteristics of a blade from another brand.

    2) A COUNTERFEIT: A blade that may not have any similarity in plies but is made to look like the original and is falsely branded as if it was the original.

    A Clone and a Counterfeit are not the same thing. And I think you are equating them. But they are quite different. A clone of a ZLC blade would actually have as close to the same kind of composite layer as the company trying to make the clone can get ahold of. A counterfeit, the composite ply may look like a ZLC ply, but odds on, it is not even an attempt at making a ply that plays like a ZLC ply even if the ply has good playing characteristics.

    So, in your post that I have quoted, it sounds like you are saying you are good with clones but not with counterfeits. We agree. And they definitely are not the same thing.

    The Following 2 Users Like UpSideDownCarl's Post:

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  16. UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Zhuang
    Â

    Im very interested in this subject as well. Its hard to get factual and objective information online. I really want to know all the good blades from Yinhe, Sanwei, Sword, Loki, etc.Â

    And I want to know the good rubbers from them as well.Â

    This is an excellent subject. Perhaps Yogi can jump on and give some information about blades from some of those brands you mentioned that are worth trying and using. My experience is that some of those brands make excellent products and a vastly less expensive price than the major companies that are popular in the west.
    Setup 1: Blade by Nate: Vortex Spin Machine, FH Evolution MX-K, BH Evolution FX-P
    Setup 2: OSP Virtuoso Plus, FH Rasanter R 48, BH Rasanter R 48
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    #37
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    This is an excellent subject. Perhaps Yogi can jump on and give some information about blades from some of those brands you mentioned that are worth trying and using. My experience is that some of those brands make excellent products and a vastly less expensive price than the major companies that are popular in the west.

    I have a blade called Sword Thunderbolt 6000. Its not well known at all, I cant find any information, but I received it as a gift some 20 years ago. I still use it all the time, because it just plays very good for me. Its a inner carbon 6mm Off-/Off blade. It has a very solid/stable feeling and bounce. It looks really cheap, like $15. I really wonder how much of a difference this blade is from high end blades. I also have a Boll ALC, but I dont even use it anymore.

    Another blade I have is Dawei BioX 50 which I got from ColesTT for $20 about 15 years ago. Its also inner carbon blade, Off-/Off speed, quite soft and flexy. My favorite thing is the handle is long and thin, making it easier to turn in your hand to get the right angle of attack. I wonder if I am just not noticing the quality difference, or if there realy just isnt much difference between these and top blades.


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    #38
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    This is an excellent subject. Perhaps Yogi can jump on and give some information about blades from some of those brands you mentioned that are worth trying and using. My experience is that some of those brands make excellent products and a vastly less expensive price than the major companies that are popular in the west.

    I also want to know which rubbers most closely perform like ESN/Tenergy type rubbers.

    I have AK47 and Yinhe Moon Speed. Both are very good, but not really Tenergy level speed. What are the fastest Chinese nontacky rubbers?

    Some other names I have heard but not tried yet are Bomb Mopha, 729 Aurora, 729 Presto, Loki T3


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    #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Zhuang

    I also want to know which rubbers most closely perform like ESN/Tenergy type rubbers.

    I have AK47 and Yinhe Moon Speed. Both are very good, but not really Tenergy level speed. What are the fastest Chinese nontacky rubbers?

    Some other names I have heard but not tried yet are Bomb Mopha, 729 Aurora, 729 Presto, Loki T3

    I play with the AK-47 Red, and Blue variants ... The Red variant, I'd say, plays like a toned-down MX-P, but feels a tad harder and less bouncy... The amazing part about the AK-47 RED, is that Palio have managed to produce a 45°+ sponge that when cut, can weigh ≤40gms .. In terms of just plain speed, I think it could match the Tenergys .. It produces respectable amounts of spin, but not as much as Tenergys... Same can be said for lifting backspin .. and grip .. Infact, I find the the grip on the AK-47 diminishes with time, at a rate, more rapidly than the Tenergys .. Quality is nowhere even close to the Tenergys ...

    That being said, I'd say few rubbers offer this kind of priceerformance ..


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    #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Funk Fu Master

    I play with the AK-47 Red, and Blue variants ... The Red variant, I'd say, plays like a toned-down MX-P, but feels a tad harder and less bouncy... The amazing part about the AK-47 RED, is that Palio have managed to produce a 45°+ sponge that when cut, can weigh ≤40gms .. In terms of just plain speed, I think it could match the Tenergys .. It produces respectable amounts of spin, but not as much as Tenergys... Same can be said for lifting backspin .. and grip .. Infact, I find the the grip on the AK-47 diminishes with time, at a rate, more rapidly than the Tenergys .. Quality is nowhere even close to the Tenergys ...

    That being said, I'd say few rubbers offer this kind of priceerformance ..

    Â

    How is ak47 yellow? Is it faster than blue?


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