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  1. lodro is offline
    says TT-CLOWN, old git
     
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    lodro is offline
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    #21
    Quote Originally Posted by hipnotic

    If I were to fix it I would first check if the top ply was secure in the middle, but I would probably remove it completely and apply a new one.

    Wondering about 2 things:
    1 what glue was used ?
    2 did they glued the whole laminate in one packet or did they applied the outer koto last after ???

    I remembered that a same blade second hand sold on the local auction site for NZ $ 77 last week with similar delam problems
    I tried to upload some pics but this here website real sucks now for uploading pics.



  2. Zwill is offline
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    #22
    Man, these pics are quite horrible to watch. I only ever had delamination problems with Yinhe clone blades, but only near the edge and in small patches. Those Yinhe Viscaria clones have a super thin top koto ply so I wasn't super surprised, but still hurt.

    Ever since I use DHS no15 glue I never had issue with delamination or the glue peeling up. The DHS no15 is also super easy to remove from the sponge be it cake sponge or non porous.

  3. hipnotic is offline
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    #23
    Quote Originally Posted by lodro

    Wondering about 2 things:
    1 what glue was used ?
    2 did they glued the whole laminate in one packet or did they applied the outer koto last after ???

    I remembered that a same blade second hand sold on the local auction site for NZ $ 77 last week with similar delam problems
    I tried to upload some pics but this here website real sucks now for uploading pics.

    Not glue, resin. And there are literally tons of different resins that can be used, that's why I find it funny when people just talk about the fiber like it's the only thing that matters. There are hundreds of variables in that layer alone, and I'm guessing every brand has their own recipe. But I digress...

    There are 2 ways the fiber can be applied. The first one, the one I use and I'm guessing most blade builders here, it to laminate the fiber between the wood plies. This results in a softer feeling, but it's harder to do, you have to be careful with the amount of resin otherwise it will bleed through the top layer. Different fibers require different amounts of resin. It's also time consuming and messy. Another way is to laminate the composite layer separately and then glue the whole thing. This is easier to do on a mass production scale, but it results in a harder feeling because you end up with a lot more resin than needed. That's why those chinese "ALC" blades always feel harder than their original counterparts. I know Stiga also does this with their Carbonado line, but I guess that in that case the process is more controlled, the blades are good after all. But it's also not uncommon to see delamination on those.

    As for the blade you've posted, seems like a fake to me. The cloth is too tightly woven, the "Arylate" is only on one direction and you can see the layer is embedded in a glass like material. That's the excess resin I talked about earlier.

    The Following User Likes hipnotic's Post:

    lodro

    www.sdcttblades.com / Insta: @sdc_tt_blades / Face: @SDCblades

  4. UpSideDownCarl is offline
    says I like to hit Heavy Topspin
     
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    #24
    Quote Originally Posted by hipnotic


    As for the blade you've posted, seems like a fake to me. The cloth is too tightly woven, the "Arylate" is only on one direction and you can see the layer is embedded in a glass like material. That's the excess resin I talked about earlier.

    Yep. And this is why I asked to see the handle and the silver tag.

    But, I am also noticing that the OP (Rookies) has not posted since the 3rd post of this thread. It was only yesterday so, this is sort of more that the thread has progressed in spite of there being no clarifying comments from Rookies.

    The Following User Likes UpSideDownCarl's Post:

    lodro

    Setup 1: Blade by Nate: Vortex Spin Machine, FH Evolution MX-K, BH Evolution FX-P
    Setup 2: OSP Virtuoso Plus, FH Rasanter R 48, BH Rasanter R 48
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  5. lodro is offline
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    #25
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    Yep. And this is why I asked to see the handle and the silver tag.

    But, I am also noticing that the OP (Rookies) has not posted since the 3rd post of this thread. It was only yesterday so, this is sort of more that the thread has progressed in spite of there being no clarifying comments from Rookies.



    i was wondering if the OP was just trying to """shame""" the manufacturer by showing us the photos


  6. Michael Zhuang is offline
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    #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Zwill
    Man, these pics are quite horrible to watch. I only ever had delamination problems with Yinhe clone blades, but only near the edge and in small patches. Those Yinhe Viscaria clones have a super thin top koto ply so I wasn't super surprised, but still hurt.

    Ever since I use DHS no15 glue I never had issue with delamination or the glue peeling up. The DHS no15 is also super easy to remove from the sponge be it cake sponge or non porous.

    Which blades are you referring to specifically? V14 Pro? others?


  7. Michael Zhuang is offline
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    #27
    Quote Originally Posted by UpSideDownCarl
    Yep. And this is why I asked to see the handle and the silver tag.

    But, I am also noticing that the OP (Rookies) has not posted since the 3rd post of this thread. It was only yesterday so, this is sort of more that the thread has progressed in spite of there being no clarifying comments from Rookies.

    If it is a fake, Im actually surprised that it has that kind of ALC weave in it. I just assumed they called it ALC but just had a random carbon inside.


  8. lodro is offline
    says TT-CLOWN, old git
     
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    lodro is offline
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    #28
    Quote Originally Posted by hipnotic

    Not glue, resin. And there are literally tons of different resins that can be used, that's why I find it funny when people just talk about the fiber like it's the only thing that matters. There are hundreds of variables in that layer alone, and I'm guessing every brand has their own recipe. But I digress...

    There are 2 ways the fiber can be applied. The first one, the one I use and I'm guessing most blade builders here, it to laminate the fiber between the wood plies. This results in a softer feeling, but it's harder to do, you have to be careful with the amount of resin otherwise it will bleed through the top layer. Different fibers require different amounts of resin. It's also time consuming and messy. Another way is to laminate the composite layer separately and then glue the whole thing. This is easier to do on a mass production scale, but it results in a harder feeling because you end up with a lot more resin than needed. That's why those chinese "ALC" blades always feel harder than their original counterparts. I know Stiga also does this with their Carbonado line, but I guess that in that case the process is more controlled, the blades are good after all. But it's also not uncommon to see delamination on those.

    As for the blade you've posted, seems like a fake to me. The cloth is too tightly woven, the "Arylate" is only on one direction and you can see the layer is embedded in a glass like material. That's the excess resin I talked about earlier.


    Yep, if the composite layer is being impregnated with the resin separately , been let to harden up and then added to the rest as a a "sheet" (so to speak) there is a big chance
    that the layers will not bond properly , leading to delamination later. In a factory situation one can not likely sand the surface of the composite-sheet to assure a better grip with the wood veneers ........


  9. UpSideDownCarl is offline
    says I like to hit Heavy Topspin
     
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    #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Zhuang

    If it is a fake, Im actually surprised that it has that kind of ALC weave in it. I just assumed they called it ALC but just had a random carbon inside.

    All you can tell from the photo is that the layer is a weave and that there are blue and black in the weave. If it is real, which is possible, it will be the first time I have seen a Butterfly blade delaminate like that. If it is fake, it will not be too surprising. We can't tell if it is real or not from the photos shown.


    It would also be interesting to know how/where/what temperature the blade was stored.
    Last edited by UpSideDownCarl; 10-02-2021 at 11:07 PM.
    Setup 1: Blade by Nate: Vortex Spin Machine, FH Evolution MX-K, BH Evolution FX-P
    Setup 2: OSP Virtuoso Plus, FH Rasanter R 48, BH Rasanter R 48
    Spin is Everything

  10. lodro is offline
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    lodro is offline
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    #30

    i give up, this stinks

    [h3]


    The following errors occurred with your submission[/h3]
    • The message you have entered is too short. Please lengthen your message to at least 5 characters
    • If this is the fake, then the OP blade is the real Butterfly blade.

    The Following User Likes lodro's Post:

    Chang

    Last edited by lodro; 10-03-2021 at 08:03 AM.

  11. Kuba Hajto is offline
    says Equipment matters a lot to scrubs who can't make minor adjustments to their stroke.
     
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    Kuba Hajto is offline
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    #31
    Quote Originally Posted by paulheck

    Yes you can repair this one but I would suggest you to purchase a new one instead of repairing this because the durability won't much last and you will get the best ping pong paddles for under 100$.

    You are offering someone who has Timo Boll ALC a premade racket as a replacement, and a 100$ premade at that? Are you a bot?

    Last edited by Kuba Hajto; 4 Weeks Ago at 08:30 AM.
    WTB Butterfly Ovtcharov and Vodak Horejsi ALC PM me if you want to sell one.

  12. UpSideDownCarl is offline
    says I like to hit Heavy Topspin
     
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    UpSideDownCarl is offline
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    #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuba Hajto

    You are offering someone who has Timo Boll ALC a premade racket as a replacement, and a 100$ premade at that? Are you a bot?

    If you are ever quoting someone you think is a bot, please try to remove the quotes. Why would you help the bot by adding more links to the spam it is posting?

    I am not sure if that is a bot or not. It does look like a bot. But because the link content is actually about table tennis, I will wait till I see something more conclusive. But please remove the link from the quote so you are not giving that mediocre table tennis site extra links which will cause it to list higher up on a search in a search engine which is the real reasons there are bots that post links.

    The more links (even if on the same page) from other sites pointing to the target site, the more traffic the site will get and the higher it will appear on searches which is where the traffic comes from. So, edit your post and delete the link in your quote. Thank you.
    Setup 1: Blade by Nate: Vortex Spin Machine, FH Evolution MX-K, BH Evolution FX-P
    Setup 2: OSP Virtuoso Plus, FH Rasanter R 48, BH Rasanter R 48
    Spin is Everything

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