Viscaria with more control

Gozo Aruna · Dec 20, 2021

Colin Ksh said:
I've heard lin gaoyuan alc is softer and offers more control compare to viscaria and they are very similar in structure both being alc(s). Another options would be innerforce blades (harimoto innerforce alc, Dima innerforce alc). From what I know, dima's blade is faster, thicker core(more powerful) and more aggressive compare to harimoto despite being same composition. I think control is pretty much the same.
Why don't you wait for fan zhendong's blade? It's coming out sooner or later I predict. It'll be an alc as well.
Or you should check the viscaria golden too.

Just wait for BTY Gozo Super Awesome ZLC coming out in Summer of 2022.

He will win his club close championship in 2022 after bribing all the umpire and officials.

BTY Ltd is so gonna wanna sign him up.

NDH · Dec 20, 2021

I really feel like the characteristics of a blade are overthought on a pretty big scale.

Below is the most recent Butterfly blade matrix.

I've added the red box to show which blades I feel are too similar to seriously chop and change between.

And this is coming from someone who owns the Ovtcharov ALC, Harimoto ALC and TB ALC.

If you play at a high level, sure, you will likely benefit from some of the small differences between any of them.

But for the vast majority of people, it won't make enough of a difference to be worth it.

I'd certainly never get multiple blades that Butterfly class as the same (LG ALC, TB ALC, ZJ ALC etc).

Whilst strangers online might say they are different, it's no different to 2 of the same blade feeling slightly different.

Any blade with a "reaction" rating of 10 and above is a quick blade.

Unless you are an experienced player with very stable attacking strokes, you probably don't want a blade over the 10 mark (and certainly not over the 11 mark).

Colin Ksh · Dec 20, 2021

Gozo said:
Just wait for BTY Gozo Super Awesome ZLC coming out in Summer of 2022.

He will win his club close championship in 2022 after bribing all the umpire and officials.

BTY Ltd is so gonna wanna sign him up.

This is another good one bruhh👊

Gozo Aruna · Dec 20, 2021

You guys are really something...

Imagine a regular Joe comes into a car dealer looking or a ride and you guys started showing him all the latest Mustang GTR, Nismo Skyline GTR or the STI WRX latest product offering. The poor dude could only be looking for an entry level Corolla or a Civic.

NDH · Dec 20, 2021

Gozo said:
You guys are really something...

Imagine a regular Joe comes into a car dealer looking or a ride and you guys started showing him all the latest Mustang GTR, Nismo Skyline GTR or the STI WRX latest product offering. The poor dude could only be looking for an entry level Corolla or a Civic.

I'd usually agree with this, but the OP said he'd been playing with a Viscaria and T05 for 2 years now (and he was doing well!)

Obviously impossible to see what his standard is without a video, but the assumption has to be that if you can play well with a Viscaria and T05, you are probably a solid enough player in general!

Carl05 · Dec 20, 2021

Rakza 7/Rakza 7 soft & Vega Pro/Vega Europe, seems like a reliable and cheap downgrade from the rubbers you are trying to play with and I think it's going to give what you are looking for.

Deep74 · Dec 20, 2021

TTaddict said:
Hello everyone
I've been playing with a viscaria blade and T05 (forehand) + T05fx (backhand) for 2 years now, and it has been great, as long as I could practice very much to maintain a certain ball feeling, but the thing is that i don't have that much time anymore, and I'm lacking consistency in my passive game, especially when blocking against heavy topspin. Even tho I know the setup doesn't make the player, I was thinking about changing my blade to something viscaria-like cuz I'm still happy with it (especially for powerful shots and counter-topspins), but i would like it to be just a little bit easier to control during passive game (serve/short game/blocking). So just like a viscaria but with a bit more control if u see what I mean.
As my current setup is the only butterfly racket i ever had, i would like to get another blade from them cuz I love it, but i don't know which one, anyone who could help me a little please so I don't do any mistake ? Or maybe i should stick to it ahah
thank u very much !

after reading the posts you could firstly consider changing rubbers. T05 is spin sensitive therefore blocking heavy topspin could be the issue also T05 is very springy. I have previously used T05 and as fab as it is in open game it can be bouncy in short game and for that reason changed to Dignics. T19 is a more controlled version of T05 so u could try Tenergy 19 both sides instead first before considering blade change.

if you do consider blade change then Lin Gaoyuan ALC is similar to Viscaria but softer and more controlled. It’s my current blade. A top 10 uk player changed from Viscaria to it and his feedback was it has more feeling and control. there is a review on YouTube where a guy compares the TB, ZJK, viscaria and LGY ALC so check that out.

Alternatively if you want even more control then HM alc is great and would say blocking is great. I would say it’s great closer to table and may lack bit of power away from table compared to Viscaria and LGY but you won’t go wrong with the control

Rock-Climber · Dec 20, 2021

NDH said:
I really feel like the characteristics of a blade are overthought on a pretty big scale.

Below is the most recent Butterfly blade matrix.

I've added the red box to show which blades I feel are too similar to seriously chop and change between.

And this is coming from someone who owns the Ovtcharov ALC, Harimoto ALC and TB ALC.

If you play at a high level, sure, you will likely benefit from some of the small differences between any of them.

But for the vast majority of people, it won't make enough of a difference to be worth it.

I'd certainly never get multiple blades that Butterfly class as the same (LG ALC, TB ALC, ZJ ALC etc).

Whilst strangers online might say they are different, it's no different to 2 of the same blade feeling slightly different.

Any blade with a "reaction" rating of 10 and above is a quick blade.

Unless you are an experienced player with very stable attacking strokes, you probably don't want a blade over the 10 mark (and certainly not over the 11 mark).

I like the Innerforce Layer ALC, and used it for several years. It's the next noticeable step slower and more controllable than the Viscaria. You may also want to try Nittaku Fastarc G1 on your forehand. It's the most popular rubber sold at tabletennis11, and I've used it with success on the IF ALC. Razka 7 - 10 is popular in my area, and is slower than Tenergy 05. You could also try Tenergy 80, or 64, which are a little less spinney than T05 and Butterfly's web site indicates they block better than 05 (T19 offers marginally better control too). Same with the FX versions for your backhand. I don't recommend going with thinner T05.

piligrim · Dec 20, 2021

TTaddict said:
I wish I could do that, but the weight selection feature is not available on the french butterfly website ( i thought about ordering from another country but it won't deliver at my place then, which is kind of a problem lol

You can send them email asking to check weights. Most stores do it. When I buy blade I always check with store if they have weight I am looking for

Shooter40 · Nov 10, 2022

Softer Viscaria. Joola Vyzaryz Freeze. Limba, ALC, Limba, KIRI, Limba, ALC, Limba

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Shooter40 · Nov 10, 2022

Shooter40 said:
Softer Viscaria. Joola Vyzaryz Freeze. Limba, ALC, Limba, KIRI, Limba, ALC, Limba

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

P1ngP0ng3r · Nov 10, 2022

TTaddict said:
I wish I could do that, but the weight selection feature is not available on the french butterfly website ( i thought about ordering from another country but it won't deliver at my place then, which is kind of a problem lol

You can use the European BTY website: en.butterfly.tt

On the Dutch BTY website there is also no weight selection, that's why I don't use that website.
Got myself a 85gr Viscaria and it's slower compared to higher end 80's or 90+ gr blade, while still maintaining that crisp ALC feeling.

Edit: LOL...just noticed I'm replying to an old threat and OP most likely already playing for a year with a new blade

lulu · Jan 23, 2024

NDH said:
I'd usually agree with this, but the OP said he'd been playing with a Viscaria and T05 for 2 years now (and he was doing well!)

Obviously impossible to see what his standard is without a video, but the assumption has to be that if you can play well with a Viscaria and T05, you are probably a solid enough player in general!

(yes I’m replying 2 years later🤣) I appreciate the concerns u guys got about it and I also think they’re valid bc its true that I didn’t provide that much context, mainly bc I didn’t want to appear arrogant or something. I absolutely wouldn’t consider myself pro, but I also wouldn’t consider myself being average as i got the chance to receive quite good training through table tennis high school (regional state center) and still deeply passionate about it (I’m 23 today, started at 12yo) and got into top 1500 in France like 3years ago ^^

Anyway here’s a quick update:
I tried harimoto ALC with D05 backhand and D09C forehand, and i actually gave it to a friend bc i thought it was too slow when away from the table, i did some more researches and tried boll ALC as I realized I mainly wanted something lighter (which would therefore give a bit more control if I’m not mistaken) paired with D09C forehand and rozena backhand, i found this was a quite good combo if u ask me bc the rozena while being slower than tenergy still has little harder sponge and less sensitive to incoming spin, sure I’m not has “punchy” as with T05fx but it doesn’t matter so much since I rely way more on my forehand to gain points, and my main focus with the backhand is to have most consistency/quality as possible.

I teared one of my hamstrings and haven’t played for 5months now tho (good thing is blade is still new🤣👍) which gave me plenty of time to actually study equipment more in depth, and I’ve come to a realization recently:
If there had to be ONE THING i disliked about the timo ALC is that it feels almost “too crisp” compared to viscaria , like the contact is stiffer/harder compared to viscaria (prob since the timo is a bit thinner so one would feel the carbon more?idk that’s just my opinion🤷‍♂️)
So I was looking into two things, absolutely not linked at all to each others (🤣):

-should I try innerforce ALC-s (since I want it light like timo alc but prob more woody feeling) or would it be too slow since I find harimoto alc too slow already ? Possibly try T05hard instead of d09c to reduce power gap between blades.

-should I go for dima ALC as it’s apparently as fast as timo ALC all very similar, but u get that more woody feeling ? In that case what I’m afraid of is that weight of the blade since it’s thicker, and therefore the control which might actually be less than the timo alc’s ? (Meaning it’s actually faster than boll alc if I reason right ?)

-or the simple option : I just stick to what I have now (which I already considered doing but just wanna know what are ur thoughts on all this as, I’m still in the pursuit of the setup I will prob keep for very long, and wanna avoid buying all them since no one I know has them so I can’t try them).

Oooooffff that was MUCH, if u came this far you’re a real one I must say 🤣 thanks for the replies and keep on pongin’ 😇

Lazer · Jan 23, 2024

"should I try innerforce ALC-s"

I think it would be much too slow and mushy for You.

Cheers
L-zr

MK73 · Jan 23, 2024

Lighter Viscaria or maybe something like Nexy Eucrasia (koto top innerforce alc).

Lowday20298 · Jan 23, 2024

From outer carbon, viscaria is the easiest it gets. Innerforce alc is your best bet. But the problem isn't the blade, it's the rubbers. Tenergy is sensitive, get something more controlled.

kapahoo · Jan 23, 2024

Aren't the Boll ALC and the Viscaria the same except for the handles?

Rinforzando · Jan 23, 2024

kapahoo said:
Aren't the Boll ALC and the Viscaria the same except for the handles?

same structure but different feel

Wrighty67 · Jan 23, 2024

Stiga Inspira plus - very similar structure with thinner outer ply and more feel and control but no less speed once activated. As a Viscaria lover (and user of Boll/LGY/FZD etc) this is the best blade I have played with of this type.

Dr Evil · Jan 23, 2024

Freitas Alc. Outer carbon like Viscaria, limba instead of koto top ply. A little slower than Viscaria, faster than Harimoto.

Viscaria with more control

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