Should ittf take additional measures to slow the game down?

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But seriously, what would happen if one or two tournaments a year had a little higher net? Just out of curiosity.

I think for amateurs raising net would be fun change but pros are so good that if pace slows down with current ball there could be a danger to turn a game into long boring rallies where no one can finish a point?

 
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So I'm still a proponent of a higher net ... and please guys, once just maybe once try to play ~2+ cm higher net. You'll see how fun it is. Surprisingly you'll be able to play more angles, at least this is my experience.
,,,
J.

Computer simulation of table tennis ball trajectories for studies of the influence of ball size and net height
https://www.researchgate.net/public..._of_the_influence_of_ball_size_and_net_height
"The analysis confirm the empirical observation that the change of the ball in the year 2000 from a 38-mm to a 40-mm-ball can be compensated such that their resulting trajectory distribution functions are nearly identical. This was achieved in reality by adaptations of the technique and the material. A larger ball of 44 mm with small weight is one option for suppressing high velocities, resulting also in a reduction of the influence of spinning. As an alternative option an increase of the net height is possible. For this, the character of the game will change more strongly, because the possibilities for successful trajectories are reduced limiting technical and tactical alternatives. A small increase of the net height could be one option, where the basic character of the game is not too strongly modified, but reducing especially the influence of the service. Modifications of basic rules of table tennis like ball size and net height can reduce the maximum velocities, but such modifications will be linked with severe changes in the characteristics of table tennis: dynamics, technique and strategy will change strongly, too. The question is if a possible gain in attractivity of table tennis for TV by such changes is worth the loss of key elements of existing table tennis."
(simulated increases of the net height were 1 cm and 3 cm)

IMO: if the ITTF implements any further changes to limit speed and/or spin and therefore all the variations that are the essence of table tennis it is time to create a new table tennis federation that
1. reduces the ball diameter to 39 mm to get a good compromise between todays TT and the 38 mm TT.
2. deregulates blade composition i.e. allow all materials and maybe set upper limits for area and weight.
3. allows boosters made from a list of allowed substances but control for harmful substances
4. either develops better serve rules or enforces the existing rules to limit the impact of hidden serves
 
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The pros actually seem to play it safe, mostly, staying clear from full commitment, with minor exceptions. I think I see a little trend towards more risk, more creativity, more unexpectedness at that level and if true welcome that trend. Even less spin and speed would not encourage that, I think.

I have active memory of 38mm celluloid, and remember its highs and its lows well. Some players had a serve, and little more, and thrived with just that. I didn’t care much for that.

Sometimes, though, you went up against a rallying player, and the thrill of these rallies are not rivaled. Especially in matches against defenders the extremes in spin and speed, and the variations in rallies, were riveting. I miss that.

We do get more and longer rallies now. They are a bit more bland — win some, lose some.

I don’t think I’d care to stray much further in that direction. Being old, I’m one of the beneficiaries of the 40+ change, and grudgingly acknowledge it. No more, though. Please.
 
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Setup speed cameras around the table. Anytime a ball is hit faster than the speed limit of, let's say 60MPH or whatever ITTF thinks is slow enough, the player gets a yellow card. Replay the point. He would get a red card for the 2nd offense. Replay the point. And he would lose a point for every violation thereafter. In the meantime, the commentator would explain the rule and replay the video on every offense. This sure as hell will slow down the game. ITTF will live happily ever after. HAHAHA!!!
 
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Slow the players down by making them play in iron shoes.
These might be a tad heavy
 
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Computer simulation of table tennis ball trajectories for studies of the influence of ball size and net height
https://www.researchgate.net/public..._of_the_influence_of_ball_size_and_net_height
"[...] The question is if a possible gain in attractivity of table tennis for TV by such changes is worth the loss of key elements of existing table tennis."
(simulated increases of the net height were 1 cm and 3 cm)
Thank you for the link ttarc, I had a chance to read it one more time and more carefully this time probably. One thing, the paper is 2013, so 40+ balls are not considered. It basically analyzes number of successful trajectories, based on the space of initial conditions. Two quotes from me:

1. "[...] Modifications in technique, tactics, strength and fitness are not considered in this analysis." [1].
So who knows how the game would look like exactly after those changes. I.e. tactics might change.

2. "The number of successful trajectories from half distance is nearly constant for all balls and net heights. Only for distances below one meter the number of successful strokes decreases continuously," [1].
So this could be good for rallying as strokes from far away would not be affected and those "below one meter" from the edge of the table wouldn't be as lethal ...
They consider only 1 and 3 cm increase, no 2 cm for that matter.

I think for amateurs raising net would be fun change but pros are so good that if pace slows down with current ball there could be a danger to turn a game into long boring rallies where no one can finish a point?

That's why we need experiments and variety and introduce only small changes at a time.
We do get more and longer rallies now. They are a bit more bland — win some, lose some.

I don’t think I’d care to stray much further in that direction. Being old, I’m one of the beneficiaries of the 40+ change, and grudgingly acknowledge it. No more, though. Please.
Well, yeah I don't know about the rallies. They seem quite enjoyable today ...
I understand the resilience against the constant change, But I'm not suggesting it (in some sense). What I'm saying is to introduce more variety into the game. Current version would still be a main stream, but having i.e. few tournaments with different setups would allow to observe new things. If they do not work out fine, but if they do, then we have a working proof they can be safely incorporated into the game, if we want to.

[1] https://www.researchgate.net/public..._of_the_influence_of_ball_size_and_net_height ["Computer simulations of table tennis ball trajectories for studies of the influence of ball size and net height." Ralf Schneider1, Oleksandr Kalentev1, Tatyana Ivanovska2 & Stefan Kemnitz3 1Institute of Physics, Ernst-Moritz-Arndt University Greifswald 2Institute of Community Medicine, Ernst-Moritz-Arndt University Greifswald 3Faculty of Informatics and Electrical Engineering, University Rostock}

 
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... but I will say this at the amateur level...

YES, it has become easier to attack serves with BH flip... (due to ball and training) ... yet it has also become EASIER to COUNTER TOPSIN those 2nd ball attacks and make rallies where there is immediately two strong offensive shots.

Yes, some of it is evolution of training and strategic growth for me, but with the D40+ generations of ABS balls, it is easier and more satisfying to attack topspin and play more aggressive.

I agree. Balls are hit harder and closer to the table but are also a bit easier to return by top players. For some time the super modern harimoto style with flipping every return and super close table attack seemed to take over but players adjusted to this a little and now fzd for example dialed down his flips a little and short pushed more against ma long because ma long is so good at counter attack.

I think the overall rally length isn't bad, it is a bit more like female game now with the quick BH to BH rallies close to table but there are definitely some longer rallies now between top players.

the big disadvantage is that it killed many styles like penhold, chopper or jpen

 
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The problem with these changes made is that they were made to make Table Tennis a "watchable prime time sport," where in fact it really is not. ITTF is trying so hard to market it as a "prime time" sport but the game's mechanics is so hard to appreciate for an average sport fan/viewer. The game by nature is more technical than athletic, so selling it like tennis, basketball or football will never find success because those sports were made for fans to be amazed by the athletic feats they offer while Table Tennis on the other hand rely mostly on spin, angles, and equipment. Speed and athleticism are mostly secondary because you can only hit the ball so hard before it flies passed the table. These makes the game look boring if you are not playing the game, it's like chess- you can only appreciate chess if you are also playing chess yourself.

If changes were supposed to be made then it should be to balance the game and not to make money out of it.
 
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A question that ought to be asked is should we require all ITTF officials to take a 10 liter enema before the end of the week.

Why? They seem to be excessively full of it and an enema is a very low-cost, solution that has almost immediate effect.

EDIT: If the enemas do not work, we could always require them to get a "Booster" enema every month until all their crap is no longer an issue.

female%20doctor%20hold%20enema%20pump%20jpg.jpeg
 
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ITTF could also pay Joo Sae Hyuk a lot of money to produce more JSK players...

Anyone who has seen JSH play in the 38 ERA before he got on KNT, or in his prime with 40mm cell, or in hte ABS era... DOESN'T MATTER. If you saw dude play, it didn't matter what the ball was or how strong the opponnent was, he BROUGHT EXCITEMENT. Of all the live crowds I have been in or seen on vids, there is absolutely NO ONE on the tour who would get a crowd excited standing on their feet about to go nuts and KEEP them so excited with each hit.

Finding players like that would go a real long way and free up some of the ITTF budget spent on enema treatments.
 
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Raising the net a bit and bringing back 38mm ball woud be interesting experiment.
I would expect this to to be tested prior introduction of 40mm ball. Maybe it was and conclusion was bigger ball is better than raising the net.
 
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SLICK TABLES DETRIMENTAL FOR THE SPORT. (DHS Rainbow playing surface was found to have near zero frictionality CoF < 0.10).

Dear learned Fellows.
Please be aware that ITTF has recently discontinued all researching works on the High Net Project. Still, the study of minimum friction on the table surface is now underway, supervised by Brazil Table Tennis Associaton.

Be happy.
 
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In a rare moment of agreement with Igor, I will agree. Recently, one of the largest and greatest TT clubs in USA held a teams tourney with one large hall filled with an extremely slick Xiom table (it wasn't the X5, the Xiom version of the Korean standard excellent Champion Pro 9) and it was a certified disaster. Very difficult to serve short, unless you REALLY slowed the ball down. Topspin rallies even wierder bounce from table.

That club used excellent judgement and promptyly replaced all those table (at a HUGE expense) for the next and subsequent tourneys with an excellent table iwth more average friction.. If a player complained about tables after that, the player would be a candidate for a mental examination AND a few series of enemas.
 
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SLICK TABLES DETRIMENTAL FOR THE SPORT. (DHS Rainbow playing surface was found to have near zero frictionality CoF < 0.10).

Dear learned Fellows.
Please be aware that ITTF has recently discontinued all researching works on the High Net Project. Still, the study of minimum friction on the table surface is now underway, supervised by Brazil Table Tennis Associaton.

Be happy.

And good ... maybe there is no easy way to predict scientifically how the game would look like under certain conditions, how the players would adopt or if the game would remain interesting?

Way more successful "Big" tennis, for sure has more variety then ours and the current stage of our "small" tennis is very "serve and volley" oriented, extremely fast and with very little diversity ... sorry to say.
So why not open the door, at least a little for experimenting?

I personally like to play higher net, specially with less experienced players. Higher net simply makes people see how their strokes are underdeveloped sometimes, that the swing is not as full. You simply have to work for your shot. Like with regular net if they make 7-8 points, sometimes due to their luck or my mistakes, with 2 cm something higher net, the number of points they get is much lower. So there is less chaos in the game for sure, and the quality of a play gets more visible. I guess to the audience too.

And yeah JSH vs Werner Schlager 2003 was a masterpiece ... :)
Regards.

 
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I agree! But it isn't the Chinese TT players that are the problem. It is the fact the ITTF is controlled by the CCP.
It was in the beginning and has been ever since. The ITTF is a dictatorship. Did anybody here vote for body or anything the ITTF does?
https://populous.com/the-godfather-of-chinese-table-tennis

Table tennis is for the players! Not the ITTF! The ITTF is not necessary.

The ball doesn't need to be slowed down if all one is interested in is TV. There are instant replay cameras now that can play a wining point in slow motion if desired.

Get help.

 
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Are there any other sports, where the international federation continues to make changes to the rules, to make the sport more interesting for non-playing audiences (often at the detriment of the players)?
Extreme speed and spin makes our sport special!

In the world of cycling, cyclists pretty much universally disparage the UCI, the equivalent of the ITTF. And for many of the same reasons, especially introduction of stupid rules that either impede the progress of the sport or make things worse -- while at the same time systematically ignoring crucial issues that specifically pertain to rider safety especially in the most important professional road cycling events such as the Tour de France. As you can imagine, crashing on a bike at 60 kilometers per hour is a worse outcome than not being able to generate as much spin on your forehand as you would like. They've also not done a really great job of promoting the sport, and by turning a blind eye to doping at Key times in the past did a lot of damage. I find the similarities between these two international sports federations to be really interesting.

 
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SLICK TABLES DETRIMENTAL FOR THE SPORT. (DHS Rainbow playing surface was found to have near zero frictionality CoF < 0.10).

Dear learned Fellows.
Please be aware that ITTF has recently discontinued all researching works on the High Net Project. Still, the study of minimum friction on the table surface is now underway, supervised by Brazil Table Tennis Associaton.

Be happy.

Interesting comments about the friction of the table. I doubt it has anything to do with the color of the table, but low friction could still be a real problem. I remember a number of years ago playing in China on some Double Fish tables that had a surface that was like ice. It was really hard to get used to playing on that. And I've never played on tables like that anywhere else. Actually if you look at video from the Olympics in Beijing in 2008, the tables used there also appeared to have a very slick surface. In the early rounds of that tournament you can see that even the top pros were struggling with those tables. By the time later rounds, from the quarterfinals on, it seemed like players had adjusted and the rallies got better. The reason I mention this, even though it's been 13+ years, those Olympics occurred in the same year as a trip I took to China where I experienced those very slick tables. It really sucked to play on them and the horror of the experience was fresh in my mind.. By the way, they were a fairly light blue color.

 
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Baal,

The new Xiom tables 888 had were manfactured with multiple coats of Slick 50. Just wierd ball slide on most shots. You got used to it for the open ralies, but it was way harder to serve your normal short serves on that table. You had to really slow the ball down.

I still beleive even the majority of players/forum members get too hung up on tweakng this thing or that to make it easier/better for tv or vids.

I beleive that the most exciting players doing their thing can translate it to teh average viewer who doesn't know the intricate nuances of or even basics of TT.

Surely, a player like JSH who brings back ball after ball that looks impossible and still threatens attack is dynamic and easily appreciated by any viewer. His kind of play doesn't require a technical breakdown, his play simply inspires excitement to anyone seeing it.

I think the sport would do well at the pro level to foster and some more of this type and level of player on the tour.
 
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