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  1. Wrighty67 is offline
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    #21

    Thanks for the insights here. I’m currently trying R48 on the BH of my Viscaria (usually play D05 or D80) and I’m enjoying it (although a lot of comments come my way about the green colour)

    I play either D09 or H3 national 39 on FH but was thinking that the C48 might work well - what are your thoughts on that?

    Alternatively I might stick to slightly harder as I currently use and try C48 on BH next as I enjoy slightly tacky hybrid rubbers.


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    #22
    When they say "antispin" what exactly kind of an effect do they mean?

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    #23
    I've had 3 sessions with them now. They feel a little harder than the equivalent R version, topsheet feels a little tighter, and a touch slower but not hugely.

    Comparing R48 and C48, or the 53 versions, I think there are 2 main features - better spin on brushy contacts, and a feeling of the ball "holding up" on counters. It's impossible for me to say if this grabby feeling is just the tack or if the pip structure is contributing - how would a person know for sure?

    With the tack being so slight, the speed stays relatively high in comparison with Rakza Z, which helps the flat game.

    I really like C48 and it's going on the BH side. It has the best mix of properties I've seen recently on that wing - very high grip for flips, good mid/high gear speed for punch / flat kill shots, not overly bouncy for touch play. No real weaknesses, good performance across the board, but predictable and stable when you're doing the basics. If you twisted my arm to pick fault, maybe it's a little spin sensitive on very passive shots. But it's a rubber for active play, not for standing still and passive blocking.

    I find C53 easier to use in comparison to R53, but it's still hard and demanding. It feels amazing in drills, when you know where the ball is going and you can get a full stroke in. In free play I find it easier to get along with than R53 when out of position, but it still needs big effort to extract top performance from it, and low effort shots give a weak output. It might react well to a little bit of booster, just to soften the sponge up a bit, but you could consider a C48 in ultramax if that's not too soft for your taste. Or stop being so lazy, move your feet, and play a proper shot as sensible people would say. Sounds like too much effort to me, so I'll give C48 a go on both sides.

    Durability - no idea, too early to say, but they look good after 8 hours.

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    #24
    Quote Originally Posted by JustANoob
    When they say "antispin" what exactly kind of an effect do they mean?

    The marketing is trying to imply that on topspin counters, something about the pip design is "eating" the incoming topspin. Scrubbing it off, so it becomes easier to play counterloop shots because you don't need to apply extreme bat angles to keep the ball down.

    Honestly - it did feel like you can hit / counter through spin a little more easily, in comparison with other rubbers that also have good looping performance with high-ish arcs. Hard to get that balance in a rubber right. I did find this effect more pronounced in C48 than C53, maybe because I had to keep swinging harder with 53 so it was all a little frantic. Maybe there's something in Andro's explanation, or maybe it's nonsense, but the rubbers seem very strong in two areas that sometimes aren't natural bedfellows.

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    #25
    Apart from the comparison with Rakza, which I have never played, I could have written the same things about the two new rubbers as Andy. So I´ll spare you mine, read his. ;-)

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    #26
    Andy explained this nicely, but just to stay clear the term is Counterspin - using incoming spin to your advantage.
    Antispin is killing spin and a whole different concept and type of rubber
    Quote Originally Posted by JustANoob
    When they say "antispin" what exactly kind of an effect do they mean?

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    #27
    Hey Guys,

    How is the spin generation and hardness of these rubbers compared to dignics 09c?

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    #28
    Quote Originally Posted by guni4you
    Hey Guys,

    How is the spin generation and hardness of these rubbers compared to dignics 09c?

    The C topsheet is a lot less tacky than 09c, sponges are a little softer for C53, a lot softer for C48.

    I think it's a bit easier to generate spin with C with less effort, through the middle gears. You get more out of 09C with very hard swings, or violent brush looping.

    As airoc mentioned, it's best to think of the Cs as almost-euro, whereas 09C is further down the hybrid path,

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    #29
    Just got mine today, black c53 and green r48 on Nittaku Ludeack Power, feels great , very easy to generate spin, I guess 53 ESN is about the same as 40 DHS so I’m pretty used to that hardness. I’ll put the c48 on my other Ludeack power to compare the feel. To me this seems like a pretty good alternative for people that don’t want to boost, but likes the boosted Hurricane feel.

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    #30

    Interested to hear more as you play with these. I’m enjoying the R48 on my BH but keen to try C48. I’m thinking that C48 might bear similarity to H8-80?


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    #31
    I gave C48 a try on BTY Viscaria on forehand. Not quite happy with topspin drills on forehand and topspin against backspin. I have a feeling that the new pip structure really dampened the spin quite a lot. Have a feeling that it's harder to lift underspin ball than R48 and the trajectory quite low, or truely speaking, quite linear. Maybe because I've been playing with H3neo von FH for a while so it's coming out different on my.

    The real deal about this rubber is of course, the couter spin. This is a monster when it comes to counterspin because, like I said above, the pip structure takes out a tremendous amount of spin on contact. Even when I was out of position and could only reach out my arm and fold the forearm a little bit, even with quite open racket angle, I can still get the ball in. Counterspin balls are very linear and fast. If I figure out a way to overcome the problem with topspin against backspin, I may use this rubber on my BH to replace Ten05, since I love to give a little bit of force back on blocking and with Ten05 it goes out quite a lot, and when I close the racket angle a bit the ball goes in net. C48 could be a great thing for punch shot.

    About the tackiness, well I didn't even notice about the tackiness until you guys here were talking about it. Maybe due to my preference as H3Neo diminishes the tackiness of C48.

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    #32
    Quote Originally Posted by deanrazorbak
    I gave C48 a try on BTY Viscaria on forehand. Not quite happy with topspin drills on forehand and topspin against backspin. I have a feeling that the new pip structure really dampened the spin quite a lot. Have a feeling that it's harder to lift underspin ball than R48 and the trajectory quite low, or truely speaking, quite linear. Maybe because I've been playing with H3neo von FH for a while so it's coming out different on my.

    The real deal about this rubber is of course, the couter spin. This is a monster when it comes to counterspin because, like I said above, the pip structure takes out a tremendous amount of spin on contact. Even when I was out of position and could only reach out my arm and fold the forearm a little bit, even with quite open racket angle, I can still get the ball in. Counterspin balls are very linear and fast. If I figure out a way to overcome the problem with topspin against backspin, I may use this rubber on my BH to replace Ten05, since I love to give a little bit of force back on blocking and with Ten05 it goes out quite a lot, and when I close the racket angle a bit the ball goes in net. C48 could be a great thing for punch shot.

    About the tackiness, well I didn't even notice about the tackiness until you guys here were talking about it. Maybe due to my preference as H3Neo diminishes the tackiness of C48.
    Hmm, some of your statements doesn’t make sense to me, feels like you’re contradicting yourself a bit. Because if the rubber can take off lots of spin , that means it has good friction and grabs the ball quite well, and if you’re using an open angle to hit and still lands the ball, that means the ball has lots of spin otherwise it will just go straight. All of this should means that the rubber should be good at lifting downspin balls as well, as I find it quite easy to do so myself. I think the problem you’ve got is related to your stroke, since you mentioned H3Neo, it sounds like you’re more used to brushing the ball (I was like this as well), but remember c48 is fairly soft compared to H3 rubbers, that could explain why your counters feel good but lifting downspins doesn’t , because topspin balls coming your way usually has more speed, which means you don’t need to hit through the ball too much to activate the rubber, so I’d recommend adjusting your stroke to go forward a bit more when you try to lift downspins, you’ll find it much easier to lift the ball, plus you’ll get more speed.

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    Last edited by DukeGaGa; 07-02-2022 at 07:50 PM.

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    #33
    Quote Originally Posted by DukeGaGa
    Hmm, some of your statements doesn’t make sense to me, feels like you’re contradicting yourself a bit. Because if the rubber can take off lots of spin , that means it has good friction and grabs the ball quite well, and if you’re using an open angle to hit and still lands the ball, that means the ball has lots of spin otherwise it will just go straight. All of this should means that the rubber should be good at lifting downspin balls as well, as I find it quite easy to do so myself. I think the problem you’ve got is related to your stroke, since you mentioned H3Neo, it sounds like you’re more used to brushing the ball (I was like this as well), but remember c48 is fairly soft compared to H3 rubbers, that could explain why your counters feel good but lifting downspins doesn’t , because topspin balls coming your way usually has more speed, which means you don’t need to hit through the ball too much to activate the rubber, so I’d recommend adjusting your stroke to go forward a bit more when you try to lift downspins, you’ll find it much easier to lift the ball, plus you’ll get more speed.
    yeah that might be the problem I‘m facing right now. A little bit confusing switching between 2 types of rubbers.

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    #34
    Quote Originally Posted by deanrazorbak
    yeah that might be the problem I‘m facing right now. A little bit confusing switching between 2 types of rubbers.
    Same here, it’s still a little hard for me to control how much brush vs. hit with non-tacky rubbers right now.

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    #35
    Quote Originally Posted by DukeGaGa
    Same here, it’s still a little hard for me to control how much brush vs. hit with non-tacky rubbers right now.

    Im having the same issue right now having moved from H3 to D05 - quite challenging..


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    #36
    Quote Originally Posted by DukeGaGa
    Same here, it’s still a little hard for me to control how much brush vs. hit with non-tacky rubbers right now.

    After speaking with some coaches and doing research via tutorials I have just mention that we need to hit the ball with a little bit closed angle than H3neo and with forward movement. Keep in mind that it has to be forward all the way. I gave C48 a try against today and it was phenomenal. Not quite the feeling that I like but at least I got much better spin compared to last try.

    H3neo has a very “dead” top sheet so we need to open the racket angle a bit more, but on esn rubbers we need to keep it a little bit closed on FH top spin as the sponge is springy. Worked like a charm today.

    Counter topspin stays top notch. So far the best ever rubber for counter topspin. It’s so effortless that I have the feeling I only need to reach out my arm with a closed racket angle and do a lazy stroke with just folding the forearm and a little bit of wrist action.

    But for now I will stick with my combo until something changes. Maybe when I get older and don’t have the power for H3neo more.


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    #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Wrighty67

    Im having the same issue right now having moved from H3 to D05 - quite challenging..

    Keep the ratio between H3neo and T05 and you will get it right. D05 is hybrid, the topsheet is a littlebit sticky/tacky so hitting full forward like the Tenergy serie won’t really do the job. You can check out the review of D05 and see that it’s so bad for flat hitting and smashing in comparison to T05. As the rubber is hybrid, play hybrid. Which means, you give it a forward dominant stroke WITH brushing with a bit closed bat angle compared to H3neo.

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    #38
    Quote Originally Posted by deanrazorbak

    Keep the ratio between H3neo and T05 and you will get it right. D05 is hybrid, the topsheet is a littlebit sticky/tacky so hitting full forward like the Tenergy serie won’t really do the job. You can check out the review of D05 and see that it’s so bad for flat hitting and smashing in comparison to T05. As the rubber is hybrid, play hybrid. Which means, you give it a forward dominant stroke WITH brushing with a bit closed bat angle compared to H3neo.

    Thanks - makes sense. I really felt the need to close angle and hit forward tonight when playing and hit way too many FH long - very upsetting. When I hit them well however, the penetration is far better than with H3 for my stroke.

    Tried C48 on BH tonight and struggled with consistency compared to my 3 week old sheet of R48 on my other blade - I was was way less consistent but not sure why. Will try it again tomorrow.

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    #39
    Quote Originally Posted by DukeGaGa
    Just got mine today, black c53 and green r48 on Nittaku Ludeack Power, feels great , very easy to generate spin, I guess 53 ESN is about the same as 40 DHS so I’m pretty used to that hardness. I’ll put the c48 on my other Ludeack power to compare the feel. To me this seems like a pretty good alternative for people that don’t want to boost, but likes the boosted Hurricane feel.

    Duke, how are you finding C48 vs R48 - I have now had a session with C48 tonight and found it way harder to play with than R48 based on one session - could have been me playing poorly of course, but very keen to hear from you.


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    #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Wrighty67

    Duke, how are you finding C48 vs R48 - I have now had a session with C48 tonight and found it way harder to play with than R48 based on one session - could have been me playing poorly of course, but very keen to hear from you.

    I’m still not too sure whether I want to keep using it in matches, but I do want to keep training with it. It helped me understand my strokes better, and I found myself playing much better with Hurricane after training with c53/c48. I do however really like the r48 on my BH, feels solid in practice and also in games as well, but I’ve got a few more rubbers to test. The main reason I got r48 is it has a green top sheet option, the other ones I got coming are Joola dynaryz acc in purple, Victas v15 extra in blue, and Gewo nexxus pro 48 in green as well. We shall see which of them plays better.


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