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    #1

    DHS Hurricane hardness

    Hi,

    I keep looking for about what is the difference between the hardness of DHS Hurricane [3 NEO or non NEO] rubbers, i know about thickness, but i don't know about hardness, is the higher number means it is harder? And if it is harder does it mean it is faster or less control or what exactly? And if higher hardness with thick sponge say 2.2, does it need boosting if used on fast blade as well?

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    #2
    Quote Originally Posted by TareqPhoto
    Hi,I keep looking for about what is the difference between the hardness of DHS Hurricane [3 NEO or non NEO] rubbers, i know about thickness, but i don't know about hardness, is the higher number means it is harder? And if it is harder does it mean it is faster or less control or what exactly? And if higher hardness with thick sponge say 2.2, does it need boosting if used on fast blade as well?
    • Higher number harder.
    • 39 DHS scale is about as hard MX-D.
    • The harder the rubber the harder it is to play that faster it POTENTIALLY can play. If you cannot compress it with your stroke, you will NOT get the benefits.
    • 37 should have similar combined hardness as your tenergy
    Last edited by Kuba Hajto; 06-22-2022 at 11:21 AM.
    /devnull

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    #3
    I understood it that harder rubbers are faster if you can swing fast but actually slower if you can't swing fast and also hard rubbers can generate a lot of spin if you brush it very hard and precise but a softer rubber it is easier to generate spin if you can't swing very fast.

    Not sure if that is correct though.

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    Well, I really don't know about hardness of rubbers even if people put comparisons, for example i see Tibhar MX-P so harder than Tenergy 05, to my taste i hate MX-P very much, i like Tenergy 05 and 05FX, i also bought recently Nittaku Fastarc G-1 and it is fast because i use thinner sponge, but it is also less hardness than MX-P, and i was playing with Hurricane 3 not sure which version but it was stolen, then i bought another one with i think 39 hardness and 2.15 sponge thickness, it is slower than Fastarc G-1 but more control for me, also ordered a Provincial blue sponge rubber so i hope to receive it soon and i asked a coach to boost it for me once i get it to see.

    What i want to say is, i don't know what combination i should go when choosing hardness and thickness, for me it sounds i will only play with the hardest sheet if it is thinner rubber and vise versa maybe, and also someone told me that he used MX-P with thickest rubber [2.2] and he didn't like it, same with me, so he advised me to go a bit thinner like 1.9mm or 2.0mm at most, so i am not sure if thickness of sponge is the only factor here, and i never read about hardness with other rubbers but only DHS mainly and alike, so if i want to order another DHS Hurricane 3 rubber i don't know which version and hardness to get, i will go with less thickness like 2.1mm or 2.15mm maybe, i am not really good with 2.2mm, even with Tenergy 05 but it was amazing rubber top sheet that is why i could manage the thickness maybe.

  5. Kuba Hajto is offline
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    #5
    Quote Originally Posted by TareqPhoto
    Well, I really don't know about hardness of rubbers even if people put comparisons, for example i see Tibhar MX-P so harder than Tenergy 05, to my taste i hate MX-P very much, i like Tenergy 05 and 05FX, i also bought recently Nittaku Fastarc G-1 and it is fast because i use thinner sponge, but it is also less hardness than MX-P, and i was playing with Hurricane 3 not sure which version but it was stolen, then i bought another one with i think 39 hardness and 2.15 sponge thickness, it is slower than Fastarc G-1 but more control for me, also ordered a Provincial blue sponge rubber so i hope to receive it soon and i asked a coach to boost it for me once i get it to see.

    What i want to say is, i don't know what combination i should go when choosing hardness and thickness, for me it sounds i will only play with the hardest sheet if it is thinner rubber and vise versa maybe, and also someone told me that he used MX-P with thickest rubber [2.2] and he didn't like it, same with me, so he advised me to go a bit thinner like 1.9mm or 2.0mm at most, so i am not sure if thickness of sponge is the only factor here, and i never read about hardness with other rubbers but only DHS mainly and alike, so if i want to order another DHS Hurricane 3 rubber i don't know which version and hardness to get, i will go with less thickness like 2.1mm or 2.15mm maybe, i am not really good with 2.2mm, even with Tenergy 05 but it was amazing rubber top sheet that is why i could manage the thickness maybe.

    The hardness refers to the sponge only. The rubber which the top sheet is made of also hast its own hardness. But it is rarely disclosed.

    /devnull

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    #6
    Quote Originally Posted by TareqPhoto
    Well, I really don't know about hardness of rubbers even if people put comparisons, for example i see Tibhar MX-P so harder than Tenergy 05, to my taste i hate MX-P very much, i like Tenergy 05 and 05FX, i also bought recently Nittaku Fastarc G-1 and it is fast because i use thinner sponge, but it is also less hardness than MX-P, and i was playing with Hurricane 3 not sure which version but it was stolen, then i bought another one with i think 39 hardness and 2.15 sponge thickness, it is slower than Fastarc G-1 but more control for me, also ordered a Provincial blue sponge rubber so i hope to receive it soon and i asked a coach to boost it for me once i get it to see.

    What i want to say is, i don't know what combination i should go when choosing hardness and thickness, for me it sounds i will only play with the hardest sheet if it is thinner rubber and vise versa maybe, and also someone told me that he used MX-P with thickest rubber [2.2] and he didn't like it, same with me, so he advised me to go a bit thinner like 1.9mm or 2.0mm at most, so i am not sure if thickness of sponge is the only factor here, and i never read about hardness with other rubbers but only DHS mainly and alike, so if i want to order another DHS Hurricane 3 rubber i don't know which version and hardness to get, i will go with less thickness like 2.1mm or 2.15mm maybe, i am not really good with 2.2mm, even with Tenergy 05 but it was amazing rubber top sheet that is why i could manage the thickness maybe.

    That depends on the parameters Kuba mentioned and how you play. Nobody can say for certain what would be the best hardness for you.
    38-39 is usually a really good starting point to get to know the rubber. If you can hit really hard and need a little bit more high end speed you take the harder versions 40-41. Though i actually rarely see people capable of hitting real hard and quality shots where they would benefit from even harder sponges...


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    #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuba Hajto

    The hardness refers to the sponge only. The rubber which the top sheet is made of also hast its own hardness. But it is rarely disclosed.

    But when i want to choose DHS Hurricane rubber they right like H39/40/41 and thickness 2.1mm/2.15/2.2, so what is the difference between the two? And i can find the combination between two in two colors anyway, but because i only use it for FH which means only black color, so which one i should buy, 38H 2.15mm or 41H 2.1mm or 40H 2.15mm?


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    #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Attitude

    That depends on the parameters Kuba mentioned and how you play. Nobody can say for certain what would be the best hardness for you.
    38-39 is usually a really good starting point to get to know the rubber. If you can hit really hard and need a little bit more high end speed you take the harder versions 40-41. Though i actually rarely see people capable of hitting real hard and quality shots where they would benefit from even harder sponges...

    The problem with me hitting harder is that i am not fit, i can hit hard for 3 hours not a big deal, but in all those 3 hours i might have like 40% successful hard hitting or 85% or 60%, depends on my mood and atmosphere, if it is hot and i slept enough and eat good food i can make it up to 75-90% success, i won't say 95-100%, but in hot weather or humidity like some places here and didn't sleep well, ok, i don't think i can do anything not just hitting hard.

    I don't know what is that Nittaku Fastarc G-1 top sheet hardness is, but i bought the medium thickness sponge i believe maybe 1.7mm or 1.9mm, and i can hear that BOOOM catapult sound with my bad cheap cheap blade, so maybe that top sheet of Fastarc G-1 is great for me, also before with my stolen DHS hurricane 3 rubber i had it was tacky as i play nicely from far and it gives me time to return and attack, wasn't fastest but not slow at all, and i remember someone just commented when i practice only FH with him about the rubber: "It is CATCHY", but the new second one wasn't as tacky or control, was a bit faster, it is 39H 2.15mm, and can't remember which rubber specs of that Provincial blue sponge i ordered, but it will be used with my fastest blade and maybe i will boost it, i bought second new DHS same as the new first one and i asked the coach to boost for me to see the difference between boosted and unboosted regardless different blades.

    So when DHS mention for example 40 hardness does it means the whole rubber and not just top sheet and not sponge? I ordered MX-P twice of same thickness 2.2mm and never mentioned about hardness, and both i hated, at least i prefer Rakza 9 i had more, to me i feel like that MX-P could be only big hype from people to have replacement of Tenergy, i tested a coach racket which he has Tibhar FX-P and that was even better than MX-P to me.


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    #9
    Sponge acts more or less like a spring in this situation, meaning it stores energy, so the thicker it is the more energy it can store, so the top end speed will differ a bit. Thicker sponges are also heavier, which is another big reason to choose different thicknesses to achieve the weight you want on your paddle.

    As for the hardness, the numbers any manufacturer says on the packaging are the hardness of the sponge only, at least that is true for now. The combined hardness of top sheet and sponge, or the individual hardness of the top sheet are not disclosed by them, so you really can’t compare products between different companies using the numbers. Btw, they uses different hardness scales too, so you’ll have to convert them, but people can’t seem to agree on the conversion either. So like mentioned above, Hurricane 3 rubbers, just pick 39 degree as a start, most people find that to be the sweet spot.
    Last edited by DukeGaGa; 06-22-2022 at 02:15 PM.

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    #10
    Quote Originally Posted by DukeGaGa
    Sponge acts more or less like a spring in this situation, meaning it stores energy, so the thicker it is the more energy it can store, so the top end speed will differ a bit. Thicker sponges are also heavier, which is another big reason to choose different thicknesses to achieve the weight you want on your paddle.

    Ok, i should mention about weight, how i forgot about it, for me i like less weight rubbers, it makes my play style more effectiveness as i don't need lots of energy or hard time hitting all my power, so i feel like the racket in my hand is moving light speed which is what i need, more than slow but so strong heavy balls maybe, many people told me that i am better at faster moves and attacks than hitting harder all my hand energy swinging, that is why i felt with Fastarc that it is like a rocket because no much thickness for weight and then it won't absorb more energy.


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    #11
    Performance is directly proportional to the hardness of the sponge.
    The higher the game performance, the higher the hardness.
    The 2.1 mm sponge is optimal, it responds better to the booster.
    Hardnesses are 37, 38, 39, 40 and 41 °.

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    #12
    Quote Originally Posted by harty
    Performance is directly proportional to the hardness of the sponge.
    The higher the game performance, the higher the hardness.
    The 2.1 mm sponge is optimal, it responds better to the booster.
    Hardnesses are 37, 38, 39, 40 and 41 °.

    So those numbers are the hardness of the sponge not the top sheet or it is the whole rubber?

    So thickness and hardness both are related to the sponge then.


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    #13
    To me, i hate to have hardest sponge, only i can choose hardest sponge if i go with thinner one, like from 1.5mm up to 2mm maximum, i don't have much success of love to hardest thickest rubbers anyway.

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    #14
    Quote Originally Posted by TareqPhoto


    So thickness and hardness both are related to the sponge then.

    Yes they are


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    #15
    Quote Originally Posted by DukeGaGa

    Yes they are

    Ah ok, so this will make it easy for me to choose then, i won't go for hardest sponge, maybe 38 or 39 is good for me then.

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    #16
    Quote Originally Posted by TareqPhoto
    Ah ok, so this will make it easy for me to choose then, i won't go for hardest sponge, maybe 38 or 39 is good for me then.
    Yes, that would be my guess too. Go for 38.

    Honestly when I read the thread I was a bit confused. You said you already tried H3, so you should know how that one rubber (with its one hardness) behaves. You also said you ordered H3 and it is on the way already - now trying to pick another one? And you said you like Rakza 9, very bouncy rubber. I'd say if you like R9, you won't like H3, and vice-versa. So I really honestly don't quite understand.

    About H3 - my opinion is that here in TTD somehow magically a bubble formed, of people who like H3, and that statistically this is a rarity. Around me noone plays with it, when they try my setup, they tend to be a bit surprised, call it "control setup" :-). In my cca 75 matches last season maybe 3 opponents used H3, but not more. So I personally enjoy this statistical bubble rarity here, like god-send fun area. At the same time I believe chance it good you won't enjoy the rubber.

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    #17
    Quote Originally Posted by latej
    Yes, that would be my guess too. Go for 38.

    Honestly when I read the thread I was a bit confused. You said you already tried H3, so you should know how that one rubber (with its one hardness) behaves. You also said you ordered H3 and it is on the way already - now trying to pick another one? And you said you like Rakza 9, very bouncy rubber. I'd say if you like R9, you won't like H3, and vice-versa. So I really honestly don't quite understand.

    About H3 - my opinion is that here in TTD somehow magically a bubble formed, of people who like H3, and that statistically this is a rarity. Around me noone plays with it, when they try my setup, they tend to be a bit surprised, call it "control setup" :-). In my cca 75 matches last season maybe 3 opponents used H3, but not more. So I personally enjoy this statistical bubble rarity here, like god-send fun area. At the same time I believe chance it good you won't enjoy the rubber.

    correct,
    you either like it (and can use it) or you don't like it.

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    #18
    Quote Originally Posted by latej
    Yes, that would be my guess too. Go for 38.

    Honestly when I read the thread I was a bit confused. You said you already tried H3, so you should know how that one rubber (with its one hardness) behaves. You also said you ordered H3 and it is on the way already - now trying to pick another one? And you said you like Rakza 9, very bouncy rubber. I'd say if you like R9, you won't like H3, and vice-versa. So I really honestly don't quite understand.

    About H3 - my opinion is that here in TTD somehow magically a bubble formed, of people who like H3, and that statistically this is a rarity. Around me noone plays with it, when they try my setup, they tend to be a bit surprised, call it "control setup" :-). In my cca 75 matches last season maybe 3 opponents used H3, but not more. So I personally enjoy this statistical bubble rarity here, like god-send fun area. At the same time I believe chance it good you won't enjoy the rubber.

    All that confusing is coming from that i test different rubbers with different blades with different specs of each maybe, so maybe a rubber that shine on one blade can be a garbage on another.

    Let's clarify quick about R9, i tested very few times, not for long time, it is placed on a defensive blade, BTY Defence III, so maybe that changed the rubber strength a bit, if i used this rubber on my fastest blade for example Long 5X i might hate it very much, but i didn't say i will buy R9 again, i just talked about it compared to MX-P which i didn't like on two different blades anyway [Stiga Carbonado 190 and Yasaka Extra], i couldn't keep buying Tenergy rubbers, so wanted to try something else cheaper, that including MX-P and Rakza 9 and DHS H3.

    For that H3, when i had my blade of BTY Primorac EX i replaced the rubber dead on it [i forgot which one] to a used H3 i bought from a coach, i never know which H3 version it was, but it was perfect on that blade, Rakza 7 soft on BH, but i lost it or it was stolen from me so i was trying to buy another H3 if it can be the same, so i ordered one from a local online store, it came and i put it on DHS Hao III blade to replace old Tenergy rubber it has before, it was much better than MX-P on any blade, but less performance than that H3 on my Primorac EX blade stolen, so not sure it was a wrong choice, but i will keep using it, it is new anyway, and i ordered the same again because i got both for very low price to me locally [about ~$27 each], so the second one i am asking the coach to put it on that Yasaka Extra to replace MX-P and boosting it, hopefully it will be amazing, and i ordered a Provincial H3 blue sponge [NEO or not i don't know] from Aliexpress to be used on my blade DHS Hurricane 5X, this blade is my jewel really, even with almost dead rubbers of Tenergy 80 on it i can see its performance but i have to change, my lady friend played with it for the first time last time i met her and she was like a pro with it, and told me it is a super mind blowing blade, so hopefully that blue sponge rubber for FH can make it shines again, and i didn't decide if to boost or not, but the coach has a boosted H3 blue sponge National version and he loved it, different blade though.


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    #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Tony's Table Tennis

    correct,
    you either like it (and can use it) or you don't like it.

    Very true for anything, even for my other hobbies.


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    #20
    Quote Originally Posted by TareqPhoto

    Very true for anything, even for my other hobbies.

    Some people just can't use H3 properly and can't adapt to its strengths.

    I once had someone tell me, they like to have it on the bh, as it is a very good blocking rubber....obviously we can all guess the player level of such statement
    Last edited by Tony's Table Tennis; 06-22-2022 at 03:28 PM.
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