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    #1

    Ma long vs Fan Zhendong

    Who will win wtt smashback and why? What are your thoughts?

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    #2
    The Grand Smash in Budapest has been cancelled if you are referring to that.

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    #3
    Ok,thanks for the information.

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    #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Franek
    Who will win wtt smashback and why? What are your thoughts?

    The upcoming video is just a replay. Smashback is no actual tournament


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    #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Attitude

    The upcoming video is just a replay. Smashback is no actual tournament

    yeah, and WTT replays a lot of Non-WTT videos too.
    Even calls the most recent Olympics, the Tokyo 2021 Olympics

    I really don't understand where WTT stand in the whole scale of things.
    WTT took over ITTF world tours (pro tours), and introduced some silly camera angles (still need to see if the big events will still continue with it).
    Feeder events have less then a months notice.... gets played in clubs, because too late (or not enough budget) to get a proper venue...
    The schedule is so delayed compared to ITTF days, where everything is confirmed before the year even began.
    Then you have tournaments of same status on the same day in two different continent.
    Then world ranking points, Olympic Gold is the same value as a WTT tournament (wow)
    The world ranking still totally messed up, might need 6 to 12 month for corrections to happen.

    Idea may be good, but really needs to have more attention to details and make corrections where there is mistakes.

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    Last edited by Tony's Table Tennis; 06-24-2022 at 01:58 PM.
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    #6
    Last edited by backspacer; 06-24-2022 at 02:15 PM.

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    #7
    I think as you said it will take up to 12 months to correct world ranking. I also don't know why for example Truls is in top 10. There are many better players such as Wang Chuqin who deserve top 10 more.

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    #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Franek
    I think as you said it will take up to 12 months to correct world ranking. I also don't know why for example Truls is in top 10. There are many better players such as Wang Chuqin who deserve top 10 more.

    Truls got 1400 points by getting to the final of the WTTC.
    Wang only has 1295 points from everything he played.
    1400 would get you WR13 today

    Truls also got 400 points for winning a feeder (there are a lot of feeders and 400 points up for grabs)
    350 points for finalist in contential cup, so those 3 are bulk of his points (2130 of his 2385)
    2130 would give him Lin's spot at 6.

    The Chinese 1st team players will need to take part in all these events, and soon.
    However, while it happens, they will be unseed and it won't be fair to the other nonseed/groups.

    I know of a few former WR50, that goes into groups and win, knock out seeds etc,
    the whole seeding is a mess.

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    #9
    Quote Originally Posted by backspacer

    thanks for sharing,

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    #10
    Everything is totally ruined and messed up except for maybe the corner angle which they have added, but as soon as they put the side camera again it becomes unwatchable for me.

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    #11
    Quote Originally Posted by backspacer
    The Grand Smash in Budapest has been cancelled if you are referring to that.

    Where did you get this from? It looks like it is still happening (although for relevance of this thread, fan pulled out) https://worldtabletennis.com/description?artId=1465
    Maybe the branding has just been changed to this champions thing


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    #12
    On the other hand Iba is only ranked FFTT N°57 and plays in Pro B for Roanne's club Loire Nord TT, not even the top national league then...

    For example, Alexis Lebrunh as played for Pontoise Cergy in Pro A this year with a 12W/3L ratio as a medical joker, beating Omar Assar, Jon Persson, Joao Geraldo (top Pro B performer last year) or Wang Yang. As for his FFTT Single Championship runner-up vs Simon Gauzy, he totally deserves to be featured in Contender tournaments, his current potential is a FFTT Top 5 ranking.

    Of course the FFTT is way more powerful than the FSTT cos' Senegal focuses more on football and athletics, that's why african french speaking athletes come to the french leagues to develop thelmselves by getting better training. The FSTT senior management team has been renewed recently and is quite young and new to all this management stuff, the ITFF helps them providing french speaking expert coaches to develop TT in Senegal, but for sure it's still hard for them.


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    #13
    Quote Originally Posted by TaiHaoPingPong

    Where did you get this from?

    26 May https://www.ittf.com/2022/05/26/buda...nd-smash-host/

    30 May https://www.insidethegames.biz/artic...tt-grand-smash

    Seems like on 13 June, the WTT event page for budapest smash was still active - https://worldtabletennis.com/eventIn...d&eventId=2584

    17 June - postponed - https://exbulletin.com/sports/1694285/

    So tournament announced less than 2 months and cancelled less than a month to go from tournament start date.... sounds amateurish doesn't it?

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    #14
    Quote Originally Posted by OldUser
    On the other hand Iba is only ranked FFTT N°57 and plays in Pro B for Roanne's club Loire Nord TT, not even the top national league then...

    For example, Alexis Lebrunh as played for Pontoise Cergy in Pro A this year with a 12W/3L ratio as a medical joker, beating Omar Assar, Jon Persson, Joao Geraldo (top Pro B performer last year) or Wang Yang. As for his FFTT Single Championship runner-up vs Simon Gauzy, he totally deserves to be featured in Contender tournaments, his current potential is a FFTT Top 5 ranking.

    Of course the FFTT is way more powerful than the FSTT cos' Senegal focuses more on football and athletics, that's why african french speaking athletes come to the french leagues to develop thelmselves by getting better training. The FSTT senior management team has been renewed recently and is quite young and new to all this management stuff, the ITFF helps them providing french speaking expert coaches to develop TT in Senegal, but for sure it's still hard for them.

    Iba is ranked 65 in the world and is a seasoned pro on the world circuit for many years already.
    Even if he was ranked 100 or 200, his voice of his experience traveling the world - 10 to 15 internationals a year for many many years does give merit.

    People are far too obsessed with the voices of superstars, but forgotten about the 99% others who are not super star level.
    If you remove these 99%, you won't have a tournament.

    If you are telling me a top 100 or 200 player (which applies to many forum member's national team players), who used to (with the same budget) play 10~15 tournaments a year, and now only can play 3 to 4 today..... we have a serious problem.

    Many things Iba mentioned is correct. The scheduling is a mess.
    "a grand slam" can't be announced 2 months to go and cancelled less than 30 days away.
    How do you plan for such things as a professional athlete?

    Your super stars has the budget. But for the rest, as can seen by the amount of support....many pros have the same view of Iba

    Last edited by Tony's Table Tennis; 06-26-2022 at 03:13 AM.
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    #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Tony's Table Tennis
    26 May https://www.ittf.com/2022/05/26/buda...nd-smash-host/

    30 May https://www.insidethegames.biz/artic...tt-grand-smash

    Seems like on 13 June, the WTT event page for budapest smash was still active - https://worldtabletennis.com/eventIn...d&eventId=2584

    17 June - postponed - https://exbulletin.com/sports/1694285/

    So tournament announced less than 2 months and cancelled less than a month to go from tournament start date.... sounds amateurish doesn't it?

    Ah i see, thanks. It's unclear to me what actually happened,
    "In the absence of a government decision",

    So the government didn't permit the grand smash? But a big table tennis tournament is fine if it's called champions tournament?

    Either way, it doesn't make a difference to me what it's called. The participant list is great


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    #16
    Quote Originally Posted by TaiHaoPingPong

    Ah i see, thanks. It's unclear to me what actually happened,
    "In the absence of a government decision",

    So the government didn't permit the grand smash? But a big table tennis tournament is fine if it's called champions tournament?

    Either way, it doesn't make a difference to me what it's called. The participant list is great

    It obvious you and most people only care about the super star participant list.

    doesn't 2 month notice and 1 month notice ring any alarm bells for you?
    the gov of Hungary has nothing to do with this decision....and any well run professional organization would have some PR coverage for such matters.

    The whole motive of WTT is to have Grand Smash (copy cat of Tennis)
    And a Hungarian Grand Smash was promised and just disappeared with 1 month to go.
    The Singaporean Grand Smash was also hosted with super short notice.... WTT is a short notice organization by the look of it.

    glad you happy of the participant list
    for people out side the top 32, they not even allowed to take part any more.
    how many like Iba had to cancel his tickets...and hotel bookings...

    And for star contender, limited to 4 players max in the Top 20..... and now how many are they for this "star contender" before the champions one?
    No wonder Iba said, it is like him paying money to play in star contender, to provide prize money for the full force Top 20 that is playing (as the max 4 has been lifted)
    Iba also mentioned something about Grand Smash is cost is free, but now Star Contender, he must pay....(less than a months notice to raise funds....)

    Last edited by Tony's Table Tennis; 06-26-2022 at 11:55 AM.
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    #17

    A 13W/7L ratio (65% wins) in the 2nd tier league at 30+ of age is not enough to me to be featured directly in contender events for Iba Diaw. The WTT ranking system is not accurate at all according to many fans here, many have complained about that. It favors the historical pros and "little confederation", I mean... Omar Assar for example is far from being a true n°20 today... really far ! only a 10/10 ratio in the french pro A https://www.fftt.com/site/personnes/...ber_id=4217505

    The RC system shows that Iba is only n°191 with only 1 competition played with a positive ratio, it was in Tunis last year with a way lighter opposition, and only because he's made it vs Martin Allegro, only one win in this tournament ! before that he's lost to Clarence Chew Zhe Yu in the first round of the Olympics 2021, a player ranked over the WTT top 100... Africa is way less powerfull than any other confederation, so it's way easier for him to win in african tournaments where weaker athletes come in, than in european or asian ones with a much stronger opposition. That's why he can win a qualification for the Olympics each time, we all know way better euro or asian players can't go to the Olympics. It's a kind of "positive discrimination" system to help weaker confederations with its pros and cons... here in that case it's definitely a cons.

    Even Quadri Aruna and Omar Assar are not that well ranked according to the RC system.

    https://www.ratingscentral.com/Playe...layerID=119471


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    #18
    Quote Originally Posted by OldUser

    A 13W/7L ratio (65% wins) in the 2nd tier league at 30+ of age is not enough to me to be featured directly in contender events for Iba Diaw. The WTT ranking system is not accurate at all according to many fans here, many have complained about that. It favors the historical pros and "little confederation", I mean... Omar Assar for example is far from being a true n°20 today... really far ! only a 10/10 ratio in the french pro A https://www.fftt.com/site/personnes/...ber_id=4217505

    The RC system shows that Iba is only n°191 with only 1 competition played with a positive ratio, it was in Tunis last year with a way lighter opposition, and only because he's made it vs Martin Allegro, only one win in this tournament ! before that he's lost to Clarence Chew Zhe Yu in the first round of the Olympics 2021, a player ranked over the WTT top 100... Africa is way less powerfull than any other confederation, so it's way easier for him to win in african tournaments where weaker athletes come in, than in european or asian ones with a much stronger opposition. That's why he can win a qualification for the Olympics each time, we all know way better euro or asian players can't go to the Olympics. It's a kind of "positive discrimination" system to help weaker confederations with its pros and cons... here in that case it's definitely a cons.

    Even Quadri Aruna and Omar Assar are not that well ranked according to the RC system.

    https://www.ratingscentral.com/Playe...layerID=119471

    Iba can be last place for all I care, I'm talking about WTT and its problems for players and fans, you talking about some French league performance.
    The truth is, Iba is a seasoned pro on ITTF world circuits for many years - and it is beyond playing in Africa.
    So his level, result and other thing are not important - so please focus on what he is saying and not his level....

    you welcome to go and check Ittf.com for his international participation history.

    So once you can agree that he is a "seasoned pro" (which means he takes part in 10~15 international ITTF events as per his claimed - and for many many years already), then maybe, maybe what he says, his experience he is saying, has some value and MANY much better players are supporting him. Or is it because of his level, you choose to not believe what he says and is of new value?

    Someone with maybe 100+ international event experience says the new system is failing (schedule, costing among many), and you dont give a damn about it and say - oh he is 2nd tier league, so don't listen to him?
    Last edited by Tony's Table Tennis; 06-28-2022 at 02:06 PM.
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    #19
    The Ranking system is slightly unfair, especially against chinese guys but I like that it forces chinese guys to play more tournaments in europe.

    With the old system many chinese guys could just stay home all year and work on improving their game while euro players had less time for practice as they played tournaments and league and then when they faced second tier Chinese they were not really prepared.

    Today the first tier chinese players still dominate but the second tier guys are actually losing some matches too because they can't hide as much anymore and euro and japanese/korean players are more prepared.

    So there is a simple solution for Chinese players, don't focus so much time on training and play more tournaments, then your seeding is going to be better too.

    ​​​​​​Currently the world ranking is a bit of a mess but I guess in a couple years it will be like ATP tour in tennis where players are playing tournaments all year and then the ranking will be more reflective of the true strength

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    #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Dominikk85
    The Ranking system is slightly unfair, especially against chinese guys but I like that it forces chinese guys to play more tournaments in europe.

    With the old system many chinese guys could just stay home all year and work on improving their game while euro players had less time for practice as they played tournaments and league and then when they faced second tier Chinese they were not really prepared.

    Today the first tier chinese players still dominate but the second tier guys are actually losing some matches too because they can't hide as much anymore and euro and japanese/korean players are more prepared.

    So there is a simple solution for Chinese players, don't focus so much time on training and play more tournaments, then your seeding is going to be better too.

    ​​​​​​Currently the world ranking is a bit of a mess but I guess in a couple years it will be like ATP tour in tennis where players are playing tournaments all year and then the ranking will be more reflective of the true strength

    The new ranking system was out before WTT.
    Ranking system can work with the previous ITTF world tours for example
    I don't think the rant from players is only about ranking system, but WTT events and how it is done.

    Having 2 equal weight tournament in Lima and Zagreb for example is unheard of in the past - do you get the same with ATP?
    One is a weaker tournament, while the other not (due to participation). But both hold the same values in terms of point.

    Grand Smash and then no more? Scheduling is a nightmare, and the August schedule has been like that for 3 - 4 months, meaning, no updates to Sep~Dec schedule? we like 2 months away....

    Then you have star contender, then full of top 20 playing and not max of 4?
    This is not my rules, but WTT rules.

    Also, why Ima's girlfriend staying with him, she also has to pay 250 euro for hotel and meals per day? Hotel is expensive, or is WTT making money to "pay" the champions?

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