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    #1

    Harimoto serve

    Hello, i would like to know what make Harimoto's serve more deceptive from other top players? He make contact with the ball near head and he use same movement but all top players try to do that and still his serves are harder to read. Even Ma long, Xu xin and Zhang Jike had problems to read them.

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    #2
    Firstly, the contact is not head or near head.
    The ball is closer towards the table, then it is towards the head.

    And i'm not sure if a video compilation of all serves that Harimoto winning the serves is a true reflection on how many points Harimoto actually has from direct serving or results of a good serve.
    Even if 1 out of 2 serves, he gets a direct point, and works on the 2 point beyond service return, that is still very high. And I honestly don't think Harimoto is that high or good.

    His results shows he does struggle to win. So if 50% of the time, Harimoto is serving, and everyone else who has problems reading is actually having a problem, Harimotos result will be much better and we all know and can see the wins/loss.

    I never felt Harimoto's serve is one of the best. But with his aggressive nature, his overall strategy is actually well thought of. His execution is a problem at times - that is why his result won't be high up there.
    Serve is part of a strategy. It isn't to win the point out right, but to win in the mental combat and to make your opponent over think and have doubts.
    Many times, the 3rd ball, 5th ball doubt is what make service return errors. So its all link to each other, hence, Strategy.

    Having said that, when he is not screaming, his body language shows sign of mental weakness. More opponents knows how to play him now and I wish he can overcome the short term problems and become a more complete player.

    TTT

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    #3
    Of course that is a compilation of his best serves in his career. Nevertheless in almost every match i watch with him his opponents misread about 2 serves per set which i think is alot for players at this level. I'm not talking abou ace serves but serves that set up his 3rd ball attack for example but that's only my opinion. Who in your opinion have one of the best serves?
    Last edited by Franek; 06-30-2022 at 12:43 PM.

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    #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Franek
    I'm not talking abou ace serves but serves that set up his 3rd ball attack for example.
    and so am I

    Its a complete package.
    Its all mental game at that level
    TTT

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    #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Franek
    Of course that is a compilation of his best serves in his career. Nevertheless in almost every match i watch with him his opponents misread about 2 serves per set which i think is alot for players at this level. I'm not talking abou ace serves but serves that set up his 3rd ball attack for example but that's only my opinion. Who in your opinion have one of the best serves?

    Ma Lin hands down, imo. King of both ace serves and 3rd ball attacks.


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    #6
    I don't know whether harimoto has the best serves or not but for sure his grip when serving is unique. The term unique i wanna mention here doesn't mean either good or bad in a way. It's just not like ordinary grips that most players use to serve.

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    #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Colin Ksh
    I don't know whether harimoto has the best serves or not but for sure his grip when serving is unique. The term unique i wanna mention here doesn't mean either good or bad in a way. It's just not like ordinary grips that most players use to serve.

    I also notice that but idk if it has some influence on serve quality etc.


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    #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Tony's Table Tennis
    Firstly, the contact is not head or near head.
    The ball is closer towards the table, then it is towards the head.

    And i'm not sure if a video compilation of all serves that Harimoto winning the serves is a true reflection on how many points Harimoto actually has from direct serving or results of a good serve.
    Even if 1 out of 2 serves, he gets a direct point, and works on the 2 point beyond service return, that is still very high. And I honestly don't think Harimoto is that high or good.

    His results shows he does struggle to win. So if 50% of the time, Harimoto is serving, and everyone else who has problems reading is actually having a problem, Harimotos result will be much better and we all know and can see the wins/loss.

    I never felt Harimoto's serve is one of the best. But with his aggressive nature, his overall strategy is actually well thought of. His execution is a problem at times - that is why his result won't be high up there.
    Serve is part of a strategy. It isn't to win the point out right, but to win in the mental combat and to make your opponent over think and have doubts.
    Many times, the 3rd ball, 5th ball doubt is what make service return errors. So its all link to each other, hence, Strategy.

    Having said that, when he is not screaming, his body language shows sign of mental weakness. More opponents knows how to play him now and I wish he can overcome the short term problems and become a more complete player.
    It’s like Liu Guoliang.
    Depends too much on service, and unusualness of style. Once everyone learns how to play him, he is forced to retire.
    Achieve your dreams, or die trying.

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    #9
    Quote Originally Posted by vvk1

    Ma Lin hands down, imo. King of both ace serves and 3rd ball attacks.

    Not sure on serves, but his third balls are unbeatable.
    Achieve your dreams, or die trying.

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    #10
    the contact is not head or near head.

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    #11
    About the grip,

    what's unique here is that he's using an almost regular shakehand grip while serving.
    So he's not loosening the grip and holding only with thumb and index finger, like other players do.
    This should make it harder for him to generate and alter/mask spin.
    But on the other hand, he's immediately ready for the return, doesn't have to change his grip after serving.

    This is something I personally struggle with, finding a good grip after doing a pendulum serve.
    If my opponent has fast returns, I have to drop my pendulum serves and do other serves, because I'm not ready for the 3rd ball, still trying to find my shakehand grip.
    I would very much like to learn how Harimoto manages to still put so much spin (variation) on his serve, with such a firm grip...

    FYI I think when OP mentioned "contact near the head", they meant the head of the racket, not Harimoto's head ;-)

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    #12
    Quote Originally Posted by timdm
    About the grip,

    what's unique here is that he's using an almost regular shakehand grip while serving.
    So he's not loosening the grip and holding only with thumb and index finger, like other players do.
    This should make it harder for him to generate and alter/mask spin.
    But on the other hand, he's immediately ready for the return, doesn't have to change his grip after serving.

    This is something I personally struggle with, finding a good grip after doing a pendulum serve.
    If my opponent has fast returns, I have to drop my pendulum serves and do other serves, because I'm not ready for the 3rd ball, still trying to find my shakehand grip.
    I would very much like to learn how Harimoto manages to still put so much spin (variation) on his serve, with such a firm grip...

    FYI I think when OP mentioned "contact near the head", they meant the head of the racket, not Harimoto's head ;-)
    Yes i also noticed that. His grip is unique. But I'm not sure if that will be convenient for everyone. He's serving ever since i knew him before. Maybe for the pros' grip the time gap for getting ready after the serve even the milli seconds matter or could it just be harimoto.

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    #13
    Quote Originally Posted by timdm
    About the grip,

    what's unique here is that he's using an almost regular shakehand grip while serving.
    So he's not loosening the grip and holding only with thumb and index finger, like other players do.
    This should make it harder for him to generate and alter/mask spin.
    But on the other hand, he's immediately ready for the return, doesn't have to change his grip after serving.

    This is something I personally struggle with, finding a good grip after doing a pendulum serve.
    If my opponent has fast returns, I have to drop my pendulum serves and do other serves, because I'm not ready for the 3rd ball, still trying to find my shakehand grip.
    I would very much like to learn how Harimoto manages to still put so much spin (variation) on his serve, with such a firm grip...

    FYI I think when OP mentioned "contact near the head", they meant the head of the racket, not Harimoto's head ;-)
    Yes i also noticed that. His grip is unique. But I'm not sure if that will be convenient for everyone. He's serving ever since i knew him before. Maybe for the pros' grip the time gap for getting ready after the serve even the milli seconds matter or could it just be harimoto.

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