How Did I Win or Lose a Match?

This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
Jan 2022
1,176
1,018
3,720
Read 6 reviews

Wrighty, what up with it?!

How's your game mate?

Are you playing any league round robbin?

Hey LDM

Im playing local league (division 1) and so far have won 5/6 of my matches and played well. I have some tougher ones coming up though so don’t expect to keep that %…

Also having coaching once/week with a top UK player he coach, which is fantastic.

Keep well mate!

 
Wednesday night is my 2nd (& thankfully) last match of the week.
My ranking (specific to this league, non transferable as it were) is 646, opposition’s top 2 players (if they play) are 904 & 850ish​​​​​​’ so it’s going to be a fairly tough night, having said that, one of those better players I lost to 3-2 is ranked 913, so I feel I’m still in with a good chance of being a troublemaker!!
Ideally I’d like to beat both of em!!

https://youtu.be/DVaha6jzI9w

Lycanthrope, IB66, Gonzo & Wrighty ...

This is 1 of 2 videos of my league matches (3 - 1, 11:56) played earlier monday night

When you have time, could you pls give it a look and feedback two areas i am competent & comfortable in as well as two areas i need to diligently work on

Thank you guys for helping me improve! (2 of 2 video to follow)

LDM7

 
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
Jan 2022
1,176
1,018
3,720
Read 6 reviews


this is league match (3-1, 12:56) video #2 of 2

thank you for your watch & comments, helping me improve!

LDM7

Hey LDM

I’m no coach but would say that service looks solid and certainly service start position. Focus area - for me I would say service return looks like a real opportunity for improvement.

Keep at it 👊🏻

 
  • Like
Reactions: LDM7
says toooooo much choice!!
says toooooo much choice!!
Well-Known Member
Jul 2020
1,785
1,235
4,510
Read 11 reviews
Chalk and Cheese LDM7 !!! Man, you are looking and playing soooo much better than the 1st Video you posted months ago!!! Serves are really improving, shot selection, consistency, spin levels, open ups, movement. You look more fluid, etc etc
Nice work over the last months, keep it going!! Impressed🤩

So a couple of questions !!! Hopefully these haven’t been covered in the ‘video safe’ thread, I think you posted these vids there as well, so maybe everyone has been focused on you rather than your opponent!!!

1) What was bandana mans obvious strength and weakness? Did you suss this during the match?? Did you suss this during warm up?? If you know him and his style from previous matches, and you knew you were going to play him, did you have a plan based around how you wanted to play and his strength / weakness??

2) Which of the 2 opponents did you find more difficult to play and why??
 
  • Like
Reactions: LDM7
Several people have noticed (commented on) my improvements, although “low hanging fruits” are in season, ripe for easy picking

Honestly equal credit goes to Der who has been instrumental in guiding me through a process. He clearly communicates what we have done, what we are doing & where we are headed to

Der’s absolute strength is setting proper expectations & keeping me grounded (not too high & not too low). I would describe Der’s Pinga Ponga emotional intelligence as top notch

Finally nothing breeds success than success itself IB66, I am hopeful & excited about the trajectory of my game

I am willing to do the work … My biggest fear is if I am not capable (either physical or mental limitation) to perform a movement or executing a stroke

That would be sad 😢

btw, only a true coach would ask these thought provoking questions, let me give them some time for thoughts, ta' ta'
 
  • Love
Reactions: Takkyu_wa_inochi

Hey LDM

I’m no coach but would say that service looks solid and certainly service start position. Focus area - for me I would say service return looks like a real opportunity for improvement.

Keep at it 👊🏻

Nice Wrighty & thanks for the confirmation!

I WILL keep at it (You too)

Slap on one of your video when get a chance ... tc 👍

 
  • Like
Reactions: Wrighty67
This user has no status.

https://youtu.be/DVaha6jzI9w

Lycanthrope, IB66, Gonzo & Wrighty ...

This is 1 of 2 videos of my league matches (3 - 1, 11:56) played earlier monday night

When you have time, could you pls give it a look and feedback two areas i am competent & comfortable in as well as two areas i need to diligently work on

Thank you guys for helping me improve! (2 of 2 video to follow)

LDM7

Thank you for your invitation.

I have just watched the first few minutes and the last few minutes of the 1st video. I try my best to make some comments. I wish some of my comments can make sense to you.

The things I like:
You stop your movement and observer your opponent before you serve. No mater you are really thinking of any strategy or not, you show your confidence and bring huge pressure on your opponent.
You pushed more at the beginning and you engaged into loop-open more in the last few minutes of the video. That shows you understand your opponent more and adjust your tactics accordingly.

The thing that can make you shine:
The slow and spiny loop. At the advanced level, players are required to loop at the highest point, faster and powerful. But before that level, a slow and spiny loop (loop when the ball is falling) is more useful then fast power loop. In doing slow and spiny loop, you have more time to prepare for loop, and the stronger spin and weird trajectory can earn easy points. You have done several beautiful slow and spiny loop from 10:00 in the 1st video, but I think you were not systematically applying this technique into your game. If you can systematically apply this technique into your game, your loop-open will be better and you will be able to start open easier.

 
  • Love
Reactions: LDM7
says 2023 Certified Organ Donor
says 2023 Certified Organ Donor
Well-Known Member
Sep 2011
12,868
13,316
30,558
Read 27 reviews

I am willing to do the work … My biggest fear is if I am not capable (either physical or mental limitation) to perform a movement or executing a stroke

Hi LDM7,

These are legit concerns for any player and an important part of the mental aspect of TT. A player has to manage expectations, desire, motivation, vision, etc all while battling opponents who are not there just to give it up. Opponents will rightfully test you and your abilities,,, how you read and cope and adjust and manage how to be brave and wise in deciding risk and execution are huge factors.

I try to re-circulate these things in every stage of process. Some take it better than others. No one really takes it all so soon. 3 months is a short time and you made a long path already, but those are also just short steps, but important. Getting stuff from practice to match ready is a real long process that happens over and over,,, and players will always have your concerns along the way, but improve the approach and performance.
 
  • Like
Reactions: IB66 and LDM7
says 2023 Certified Organ Donor
says 2023 Certified Organ Donor
Well-Known Member
Sep 2011
12,868
13,316
30,558
Read 27 reviews
The slow and spiny loop. At the advanced level, players are required to loop at the highest point, faster and powerful. But before that level, a slow and spiny loop (loop when the ball is falling) is more useful then fast power loop. In doing slow and spiny loop, you have more time to prepare for loop, and the stronger spin and weird trajectory can earn easy points. You have done several beautiful slow and spiny loop from 10:00 in the 1st video, but I think you were not systematically applying this technique into your game. If you can systematically apply this technique into your game, your loop-open will be better and you will be able to start open easier.

I have made every attempt to get LDM7 (and any player I can connect with) to do this very thing. I make cool sounding catch phrases to emphasize it... like SPIN WINS... Spin is your FRIEND... Spin to Win...Even at a couple levels above MY level, heavy spin is a real weapon.

I am of the inclination that one should learn how to spin real heavy and slow as a first response, then train and ingrain the fast loop properly judging when and how to use. (hit or loop kill if ball is high, otherwise, spin heavy until it is time to go fast loop learning)

I agree with you that LDM7 could use heavy spin way more than he is now... and why you rightfully emphasize this... however, it is a long process trying to get someone to do that. LDM7 was heavy spinning very little to none 3 months ago and now he is able to do it 20%+ of the time... yes, too low a number... however, HUGE improvement... and even huger considering this is just 3 months. This stuff takes a while to get there, but he is "getting there"... actually showing results sooner than would be reasonably expected at this stage considering what we had to re-do and re-shape.
 
Last edited:

Thank you for your invitation.

I have just watched the first few minutes and the last few minutes of the 1st video. I try my best to make some comments. I wish some of my comments can make sense to you.

The things I like:
You stop your movement and observer your opponent before you serve. No mater you are really thinking of any strategy or not, you show your confidence and bring huge pressure on your opponent.
You pushed more at the beginning and you engaged into loop-open more in the last few minutes of the video. That shows you understand your opponent more and adjust your tactics accordingly.

The thing that can make you shine:
The slow and spiny loop. At the advanced level, players are required to loop at the highest point, faster and powerful. But before that level, a slow and spiny loop (loop when the ball is falling) is more useful then fast power loop. In doing slow and spiny loop, you have more time to prepare for loop, and the stronger spin and weird trajectory can earn easy points. You have done several beautiful slow and spiny loop from 10:00 in the 1st video, but I think you were not systematically applying this technique into your game. If you can systematically apply this technique into your game, your loop-open will be better and you will be able to start open easier.

heLL0 Lycanthrope

Thank you for taking the time to view & feedback

Your comments are fitting from a fresh perspective

I hope to re-connect with you again in three months (if not sooner) for accountability & get your feedback on any measurable improvements (frequency & quality) in my
beautiful slow & spiny loop (better yet contacting at the ball’s peak) b/c SP!N W!NS

Der Echte & I have never formally discussed pre-serve routine. I subconsciously picked it up & copied. Sometimes I can get tells from the other’s bat or receiving position to strategize. I shall continue this practice and weaponize

These are exactly the types of feedback I am looking for!

Take care 👍

 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Lycanthrope
says toooooo much choice!!
says toooooo much choice!!
Well-Known Member
Jul 2020
1,785
1,235
4,510
Read 11 reviews

I have made every attempt to get LDM7 (and any player I can connect with) to do this very thing. I make cool sounding catch phrases to emphasize it... like SPIN WINS... Spin is your FRIEND... Spin to Win...Even at a couple levels above MY level, heavy spin is a real weapon.

I am of the inclination that one should learn how to spin real heavy and slow as a first response, then train and ingrain the fast loop properly judging when and how to use. (hit or loop kill if ball is high, otherwise, spin heavy until it is time to go fast loop learning)

I agree with you that LDM7 could use heavy spin way more than he is now... and why you rightfully emphasize this... however, it is a long process trying to get someone to do that. LDM7 was heavy spinning very little to none 3 months ago and now he is able to do it 20%+ of the time... yes, too low a number... however, HUGE improvement... and even huger considering this is just 3 months. This stuff takes a while to get there, but he is "getting there"... actually showing results sooner than would be reasonably expected at this stage considering what we had to re-do and re-shape.

Hi Der,

When I watched the latest vids I was like 'wow LDM7 is really moving in the right direction' things just looked so much better, compliments to yourself and LDM7.
Judging LDM7 against players that I have been involved in coaching (& yeah everyone is different) I would put LDM7's progress ABOVE the average curve!!! Especially considering age etc!!!!
Sometimes it can be hard to get players heads right about slow high spin loops, both BH & FH, they seem to think power and speed is the kiddie, which it is AT THE RIGHT TIME. We watch Pro's they hit hard fast and spinny. We ARE NOT Pro's. anyone can hit hard and fast, not necessarily with accuracy and consistency, hitting hard and fast with good or high spin is harder. Creating the spin, understanding how to create spin and understanding that there is a trade off, to a certain extent, regarding speed and spin. understanding that spin is going to make shots 'SAFER' in the long term. Understanding that spin is really your BFF that's key!!!!

 
Chalk and Cheese LDM7 !!!

1) What was bandana mans obvious strength and weakness? Did you suss this during the match?? Did you suss this during warm up?? If you know him and his style from previous matches, and you knew you were going to play him, did you have a plan based around how you wanted to play and his strength / weakness??

2) Which of the 2 opponents did you find more difficult to play and why??

1) What was bandana mans obvious strength and weakness?
=> i think bandana mans strength = BH, windshield wiper serve setup,
=> weakness = service return, his FH, movement (up & back, side 2 side), middle (he's tall 6'2")



Did you suss this during the match??
=> only a little bit, at service, when both are still & i can think
=> i need 2 be less concerned at what i am supposed to be doing & pay more attention to what the others doing (AGREE?!)


Did you suss this during warm up??
=> no, my mind was wondering ... my eyes were on the ball during warm-up
=> also i forgot to check his rubber


If you know him and his style from previous matches, and you knew you were going to play him, did you have a plan based around how you wanted to play and his strength / weakness??
=> i do know him, played a few times this year
=> i knew i was going to play him, did not formulate any plan


2) Which of the 2 opponents did you find more difficult to play and why??
=> i found the middle-eastern guy (dont know his name) more difficult to play b/c of his movement & his FH can be legit at times,
=> i feel when he develops a higher % spiny FH loop, he's going to be trouble

 
  • Like
Reactions: IB66
says toooooo much choice!!
says toooooo much choice!!
Well-Known Member
Jul 2020
1,785
1,235
4,510
Read 11 reviews

1) What was bandana mans obvious strength and weakness?
=> i think bandana mans strength = BH, windshield wiper serve setup,
=> weakness = service return, his FH, movement (up & back, side 2 side), middle (he's tall 6'2")



Did you suss this during the match??
=> only a little bit, at service, when both are still & i can think
=> i need 2 be less concerned at what i am supposed to be doing & pay more attention to what the others doing (AGREE?!)


Did you suss this during warm up??
=> no, my mind was wondering ... my eyes were on the ball during warm-up
=> also i forgot to check his rubber


If you know him and his style from previous matches, and you knew you were going to play him, did you have a plan based around how you wanted to play and his strength / weakness??
=> i do know him, played a few times this year
=> i knew i was going to play him, did not formulate any plan


2) Which of the 2 opponents did you find more difficult to play and why??
=> i found the middle-eastern guy (dont know his name) more difficult to play b/c of his movement & his FH can be legit at times,
=> i feel when he develops a higher % spiny FH loop, he's going to be trouble

Bandana man’s BH drive / topspin is, as far as I’m concerned his best and his comfortable shot, he moved across towards his FH side to use his BH. He did set up his BH reasonably well with his service.
If he opened up v backspin on the BH side, I didn’t see many, so Backspin to his BH becomes a weakness, to a certain extent, because you KNOW he is 99% likely to push!!

For me the obvious weakness was his FH, does he have a FH loop? If he does he didn’t use if much or at all. He didn’t seem attack minded on his FH side.
Now you’ve improved your service, it showed in his serve return, sweet!!
Yep, you moved him about some as well, being 6ft 2 can make movement an issue. But I think movement is gonna be a weakness of many club level players, myself included!!!

In match analysing is an art in itself !! Something to be worked on by the pair of us!! Can be difficult to do. I’m sure Der has some good info on this, it’s much easier when you are watching rather than playing.
Balance is required about what you are doing and what your opponent is doing, both go hand in hand !!

Warm ups can be deceiving sometimes, players don’t show their hand!! But even a basic warm up, FH to FH drive can show consistency levels. Also, yeah you concentrate on the ball but for a time the ball is right in front of or next to the player, they are in plain sight, get use to SEEING not only the ball but the player, peripheral vision or indirect vision, out of the corner of your eye!!! This is important during a rally as well, we do it naturally but our brains ‘file it away’ lots of visual info because the brain thinks the info may not be important when compared to actually hitting a ball !!

Knowing who you were going to play and not using the info gained from previous encounters to have even a basic game plan is an area to work on!! We all do it!! An ‘off table’ area to work on!!

I agree about the Middle Eastern guy, better ‘all round’ game .

So LDM7 how did you win or lose???😀

 
  • Haha
Reactions: LDM7
says 2023 Certified Organ Donor
says 2023 Certified Organ Donor
Well-Known Member
Sep 2011
12,868
13,316
30,558
Read 27 reviews
Your bandana man (Joel) is a player who has tried hard and for a couple years went nowhere. Recently, he has been improving finally. He prolly takes lessons from JZ and LDM's previous coach. Only recently has Joel has any measurable results.

Like any player, if you stop attacking and give opponent easy balls where they like them, you are doomed. You still have to fight.

A LOT of hte players +/- 100 rating points of LDM7's level are improving... and I have no issue helping them improve for free. I talk to them as often as I can. Why? I want LDM7 to have players around him improving and force him to adapt and force him to be assertive.
 
  • Like
  • Angry
Reactions: IB66 and LDM7
says toooooo much choice!!
says toooooo much choice!!
Well-Known Member
Jul 2020
1,785
1,235
4,510
Read 11 reviews
This week I have played 2 club matches.
1st match was vs a team that fielded an all female team, (all of them are ranked higher than myself by 120 to 140 points), nice to see this!!! match score was 6-4 to the ladies!!!
Personally I won 2 out of the 3 singles.
1st match I lost 3-1, the end I won was 11-3, no mistakes, good point construction on serve, positive play in general. Ends lost 8-11, 8-11, were tight and I think that because I was slightly negative and didn't assert my game, and when I did try more open-ups made mistakes. Last end 6-11, this was after winning the 3rd end 11-3, mistake city!!
This ladies playing style was based on being consistent and good ball placement, a lot of pushes, when playing top spin rallies she had a compact FH & BH but nothing special just consistent, few mistakes. She never really tried to win points outright. her consistency won her the match, My consistency and not imposing myself better lost me the match.
More to come on the rest of the games later!!!
 
This week I have played 2 club matches.
1st match was vs a team that fielded an all female team, (all of them are ranked higher than myself by 120 to 140 points), nice to see this!!! match score was 6-4 to the ladies!!!
Personally I won 2 out of the 3 singles.
1st match I lost 3-1, the end I won was 11-3, no mistakes, good point construction on serve, positive play in general. Ends lost 8-11, 8-11, were tight and I think that because I was slightly negative and didn't assert my game, and when I did try more open-ups made mistakes. Last end 6-11, this was after winning the 3rd end 11-3, mistake city!!
This ladies playing style was based on being consistent and good ball placement, a lot of pushes, when playing top spin rallies she had a compact FH & BH but nothing special just consistent, few mistakes. She never really tried to win points outright. her consistency won her the match, My consistency and not imposing myself better lost me the match.
More to come on the rest of the games later!!!

How are you IB66,

I read your above match analysis twice, considered your words over time & have the following questions

Thank you for taking the time to reply (if you so chose) & start a dialogue around how did we win-or-lose a match (you chose a loss)



1st match I lost 3-1, the end I won was 11-3, no mistakes, good point construction on serve, positive play in general. Ends lost 8-11, 8-11, were tight and I think that because I was slightly negative and didn't assert my game, and when I did try more open-ups made mistakes. Last end 6-11, this was after winning the 3rd end 11-3, mistake city!!

=> imo 8 - 11 were close, an edge here, another net there ... wa la, pressure is square on her

=> what were your self-talk during these two ends?

=> what caused you to be "slightly negative?"


This ladies playing style was based on being consistent and good ball placement, a lot of pushes
More to come on the rest of the games later!!!

=> did you open (attack) those pushes or were you timid?

=> were most of those pushes in your middle, jammed you?

=> did you see her pushed balls early enough to get in position to open (either side)?


when playing top spin rallies she had a compact FH & BH but nothing special just consistent, few mistakes

=> i am thinking ... instead of playing her consistent, patty cake brand of TT, not kill loop every shot (high risks), rather start with her middle, then run her side-2-side (variety)???

My consistency and not imposing myself better lost me the match

=> I am right there with you IB66, is it possible that your consistency wasn't the culprit, rather type of shots & LOCATION could have been different at times?

=> i interpret "not imposing myself" as you held back, WHY? playing not to lose? first time playing that lady? game-2-game adjustments?



3rd end 11-3, mistake city

=> mentally, did you give up already, fatigued or did she play even more consistent to cause you "mistake city?"

 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: IB66
Top