Just curious

monique · Jul 23, 2022

Of your forehand & backhand, what is your strong side & weakside ( (Question mostly about amateurs)
What % of players (question more about amateurs) have no weakside (more or less equal forehand & backhand) ?
What % of players (more about amateurs) have same style forehand & backhand ?
What % of amateurs delude themselves that they have the same (looping) style & equal forehand & backhand ?
What % of players are forehand dominant ?

What is the major difference between hardbat (or sandpaper) era tabletennis & sponge era tabletennis ?
(If you correctly answer the previous 5 questions, you also know the answer to this question)

What is the difference in design & operational mechanics between short pips & long pips ?
What is the difference in design & operational mechanics between anti & inverted ?
What is the history & chronological order of arrival of short pips, inverted, anti & long pips
If you answer the above 3 questions correctly, you also know the answer to 2 questions below.

Of all 4 rubber types (inverted, anti, short pips & long pips), which one is the best weakside rubber (mostly for an amateur) ? (Sorry, there is only one answer & . "It depends" is not a valid answer)
Of all 4 rubber types, which one is the worst weakside rubber (mostly for an amateur)? (Sorry, there is only one answer. & "It depends" is not a valid answer)
(I have included medium pips as part of long pips)

Bonus questions :-
What % of players choose rubbers / blades based on logic & common sense ?
What % of players ignore logic & choose their rubbers / blades based on feel ?
What % of players don't choose the correct weakside (sometimes even strongside) rubbers due to intense peer pressure & fear of social rejection & ridicule ?
What % of players ignore logic & choose their rubbers / blades blindly based on what their favorite pro uses ?

wahon · Jul 29, 2022

monique said:
Of your forehand & backhand, what is your strong side & weakside ( (Question mostly about amateurs)
What % of players (question more about amateurs) have no weakside (more or less equal forehand & backhand) ?
What % of players (more about amateurs) have same style forehand & backhand ?
What % of amateurs delude themselves that they have the same (looping) style & equal forehand & backhand ?
What % of players are forehand dominant ?

What is the major difference between hardbat (or sandpaper) era tabletennis & sponge era tabletennis ?
(If you correctly answer the previous 5 questions, you also know the answer to this question)

What is the difference in design & operational mechanics between short pips & long pips ?
What is the difference in design & operational mechanics between anti & inverted ?
What is the history & chronological order of arrival of short pips, inverted, anti & long pips
If you answer the above 3 questions correctly, you also know the answer to 2 questions below.

Of all 4 rubber types (inverted, anti, short pips & long pips), which one is the best weakside rubber (mostly for an amateur) ? (Sorry, there is only one answer & . "It depends" is not a valid answer)
Of all 4 rubber types, which one is the worst weakside rubber (mostly for an amateur)? (Sorry, there is only one answer. & "It depends" is not a valid answer)
(I have included medium pips as part of long pips)

Bonus questions :-
What % of players choose rubbers / blades based on logic & common sense ?
What % of players ignore logic & choose their rubbers / blades based on feel ?
What % of players don't choose the correct weakside (sometimes even strongside) rubbers due to intense peer pressure & fear of social rejection & ridicule ?
What % of players ignore logic & choose their rubbers / blades blindly based on what their favorite pro uses ?

By natural design of human body, don't you think ALL players in ALL racket sports are forehand dominant ? In tennis for example , is this why most players play two handed backhands ? I realize there may be some freaky exceptions

lodro · Jul 29, 2022

wahon said:
By natural design of human body, don't you think ALL players in ALL racket sports are forehand dominant ? In tennis for example , is this why most players play two handed backhands ? I realize there may be some freaky exceptions

Hi, yes, I am the freaky exception and had to force myself to learn to even use the FH when i started to play
in clubs.Beginners invariably start with pushing the balls over the net , using BH. . So I disagree with the statement that FH stroke is the natural stroke.

lodro · Jul 29, 2022

wahon said:
By natural design of human body, don't you think ALL players in ALL racket sports are forehand dominant ? In tennis for example , is this why most players play two handed backhands ? I realize there may be some freaky exceptions

Hi, yes, I am the freaky exception and had to force myself to learn to even use the FH when i started to play
in clubs.Beginners invariably start with pushing the balls over the net , using BH. . So I disagree with the statement that FH stroke is the natural stroke.

SofaChamp · Jul 30, 2022

Please tell, what is the best rubber for my weaker wing?

monique · Aug 2, 2022

SofaChamp said:
Please tell, what is the best rubber for my weaker wing?

What is your weaker side ? Forehand or Backhand ?
How did you arrive at the conclusion that it is your weaker side ?

What are your playing styles, on your forehand & backhand ?

What is your level ?

SofaChamp · Aug 3, 2022

monique said:
What is your weaker side ? Forehand or Backhand ?
How did you arrive at the conclusion that it is your weaker side ?

What are your playing styles, on your forehand & backhand ?

What is your level ?

Weaker side: BH
Why: Arm tenses up in matches when trying to play BHs, when playing well I'm covering most of the table with my FH, many coaches have told me that I need to build my game on my FH and think of my BH as keeping me in the rally.
General syle is FH dominant looper, when playing well

Level is probably about 1300 - 1600 USATT.

Now, what rubber does my BH need?

Michael Zhuang · Aug 3, 2022

SofaChamp said:
Weaker side: BH
Why: Arm tenses up in matches when trying to play BHs, when playing well I'm covering most of the table with my FH, many coaches have told me that I need to build my game on my FH and think of my BH as keeping me in the rally.
General syle is FH dominant looper, when playing well
Level is probably about 1300 - 1600 USATT.

Now, what rubber does my BH need?

Sounds like you need a solid elastic rubber for backhand rallying, something good for blocking. Stay away from dense, heavy, tacky rubbers on backhand.

I have been using Moon Speed medium on the BH, and its very good at consistent blocking and rallying and attacking when needed. But its slower than typical ESN rubbers.

monique · Aug 3, 2022

SofaChamp said:
Weaker side: BH
Why: Arm tenses up in matches when trying to play BHs, when playing well I'm covering most of the table with my FH, many coaches have told me that I need to build my game on my FH and think of my BH as keeping me in the rally.
General syle is FH dominant looper, when playing well
Level is probably about 1300 - 1600 USATT.

Now, what rubber does my BH need?

Thanks for you information.
I forgot to ask the followinhg (Sorry about that)

1. Your approximate age group & how long you have been playing
2. What type of rubber are you using now on your backhand & how long
3. In youe honest estination, how bad is your backhand compared to your forehand
4. Your playing objective > Do you just play for fun & exercise or play competitively such as play in leagues and tournaments

SofaChamp · Aug 4, 2022

Age group: 35 - 40, playing for 8 years with coaching
BH rubber: soft tensor, same for about 2.5 years
dif in quality between bh and fh in practise: 35-65; in matches: 25-75
Playing objective: play better in the league and tournaments

monique · Aug 4, 2022

SofaChamp;377201
Age group: 35 - 40, playing for 8 years with coaching
BH rubber: soft tensor, same for about 2.5 years
dif in quality between bh and fh in practise: 35-65; in matches: 25-75
Playing objective: play better in the league and tournaments

Thanks for this information. It helps a lot.
You also said
many coaches have told me that I need to build my game on my FH and think of my BH as keeping me in the rally.
This is a polite way of your coaches telling you that your BH sucks or stinks to high heaven. Given that many coaches say the same thing, this further solidifies that suggestion that your backhand is horrible, also considering 8 years of coaching & same BH rubber for 2.5 years has not solved your BH problem

So what do you think ? Should you continue to suffer using spinny inverted rubber on your backhand ?
Or should you switch to a different type backhand rubber other than spinny inverted that will turn your weakness into a weapon ?

BTW using just a different type of spinny inverted rubber is not going to keep you in the rally because since more players than not use spinny inverted, more players than not therefore also know how to play against spinny inverted even without having to think. (Again the coaches were either being polite or hate rubbers other than spinny inverted outright or they don't hate other type rubbers but have been brainwashed and conditioned to think that you should only continue to use spinny inverted just because you and everyone else is using it , though the may not hate other type rubbers) .

So, as far as your original question about what other type of rubber you should use then, you already know the answer if you correctly answer my questions in my first post about the worst rubber type for any amateur player's weakside (backhand) & best rubber type for any amateur player's weakside(backhand). After you provide this answer to me we can discuss more on the various brands in the correct chosen type of rubber.

But the bottom-line is that the probability of your further success in a competitive environment are essentially hopeless if you continue using smooth spinny rubber on your backhand, based on the background information you have provided about yourself.

Of course I am open-minded & willing to listen to any compelling argument by other posters in this forum as to why you should continue for another 5 or 10 or 50 years using same type rubber both sides (as the stupid rule change proposal in the 90s by Sweden) or why you should go back 70 years to hardbat or even back to sandpaper etc

Keep also in mind that improving your forehand as many coaches told you is independent of what you do with your stinking backhand. Additionally you will also be twiddling after a while and using spinny inverted on your backhand & other type rubber on your forehand to vastly diversify your stroke arsenel to enjoy the sport more (of course your opponents will enjoy it less, especially those who want to keep you using spinny inverted both sides)..

Most amateurs overly focus on consistency of strokes rather than diversity of their stroke aresenel though the saturation point for a particular stroke for an amateur is nowhere clsoe to even a low level pro. The only salvation for an amateur is diversification of their equipment & strokes arsenel especially their weakest strokes (as well as serves) and not the just consistency of their best strokes

Last but not least keep in mind that using a different type of rubber is not a one week fling. You are not going to master other type of rubber in a week. It is a long term commitment & I guarantee you that you will learn more about people you thought your were your friends in tabletennis.
Lot of players who use smooth rubbers both sides try other type rubber secretly, thinking they can master it in a few days or a week. When they realize how hard it is, they go back to smooth rubber and to badmouthing other type rubbers.

If you were in an age group under 18 years of age or over say 60 years of age, of course my answer to your question would be somewhat different.

SofaChamp · Aug 4, 2022

monique said:
[...]

So what do you think ? Should you continue to suffer using spinny inverted rubber on your backhand ?
Or should you switch to a different type backhand rubber other than spinny inverted that will turn your weakness into a weapon ?

[...]

So, as far as your original question about what other type of rubber you should use then, you already know the answer if you correctly answer my questions about the worst rubber type for any amateur player's weakside (backhand) & best rubber type for any amateur player's weakside(backhand). After you provide this answer to me we can discuss more on the various brands in the correct chosen type of rubber.

Well, trying to answer your question about the best and worst type of rubber for an amateur player's weaker wing, surely this depends on specific weaknesses. However, I'm inclined to say that some LPs or an Anti might be the answer? But I'm not the guru, please give me answers

monique · Aug 4, 2022

SofaChamp said:
Well, trying to answer your question about the best and worst type of rubber for an amateur player's weaker wing, surely this depends on specific weaknesses. However, I'm inclined to say that some LPs or an Anti might be the answer? But I'm not the guru, please give me answers

You are 50% correct. It does not matter what your weakness is . The best & ONLY weakside (backhand) rubber in the amateur player context, is long pips. Anti may work in some exceptions such as American grip (Seemiller / Boggan) type players or even some traditional penhold players who twiddle (Even in these cases, I think the time has come and gone for anti such as for hardbat & sandpaper & I think long pips is far superior in these cases)

The problem with anti rubbers is that it is too close spinny inverted in the spin continuum scale where spinny inverted sits on the top spin side & long pips sits on the back spin side with short pips in dead center and anti pretty close to the middle on the back spin side. So a spinny inverted & long pips provides the maximum spin contrast combination of back-spin & top-spin & the unknown. Anti & short pips (in non-primary- side or what I call the Hou Yingchao / Mima Ito mode) are just mostly marketing gimmicks with claims of increased spin reversal or disruption etc. The spinny inverted / long pips is the most diverse and most lethal combination for an amateur. Of course short pips / long pips is also a great combination with short pips mostly on strong side (forehand) if you can do it. Theer are rare exceptions where players may do well with say a short pips / anti combo but this is just as rare as an extremely bizarre grip.

Long pips are of course much harder to learn to use than anti but once you get the hang of it, the difficulty is transferred to your opponent (see the duality priciple of tabletennis below) & long pips are better in almost every aapect compared to anti. The biggest problem with long pips is that your stroke depends a lot more also on the level of spin and speed of incoming ball than anti or short pips or inverted. But the other benefits of long pips far outwiegh anti & weakside short pips. People who seek instant gratification or rubbers that "seem" to be able to do little bit everything (but not really) settle with anti or weakside short-pips.

The duality principle of tableetnnis (for amteur players mostly) :- Any rubber or blade that is harder for you to control is also equally harder for your opponents to play against. Any rubber that provides you lots of spin (such as spinny inverted) will also react equally violently to incoming spin & harder for you to control. Any rubber in general easier for you to use is also equally easy for your opponents to play against etc etc . So it is all a matter of tradeoffs between how much you want to dish out & how much you can handle (give & take)

Even medium pips rubbers such as 563, 837, 799, 388C-1 etc may be mostly waste of time but may be good as transtional rubbers to make the first move to the divine side ( offensively known as the dark side). I personally think a player should move to long pips right away if they choose to come to the divine side.

Just curious

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