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  1. Michael Zhuang is offline
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    #1

    Best non-ESN, non-BTY tensor rubber?

    Is there any general consensus about what is the best non-ESN and non-BTY tensor rubber? Almost every rubber I hear about nowadays is a ESN.

    The only non-ESN rubber that I even know of is the new Hammond Z2 and Victas 07.

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    #2
    AFAIK, 'Tensor' rubbers all come from the ESN factory.

    Obviously Hurricane would be the most popular attacking rubber but its characteristics are very different from ESN tensor rubbers.

    Maybe some of the DHS GoldArc rubbers are a candidate for this?

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    #3
    The Gold Arc 5 and 8 are ESN as well, the Tin Arc series was the Chinese "tensor" copy. There are a few Chinese made rubbers that are non tacky and have cake sponge. 729 Presto series, Yinhe Moon (Speed), Victas TR, Yasaka Hovering Dragon. But all of these play quite differently.

    I guess the best non-ESN non-BTY "tensor" rubbers are the Mizuno Q-series.

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    #4
    Interesting, I've never heard of Mizuno rubbers. In Japan, they are very popular for athletic clothes and shoes and such.

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    #5
    For me the winner of this category goes to Friendship 729 Battle II. It is definitely non-ESN and non-BTY, satisfying both criteria.


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    #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Gozo
    For me the winner of this category goes to Friendship 729 Battle II. It is definitely non-ESN and non-BTY, satisfying both criteria.

    Well im specifically asking about tensor type rubbers, meaning those bouncy catapult rubbers.

    But for tacky rubbers, i agree with you


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    #7

    I see there's a new Stiga Mantra Pro series listed on the ITTF website, as well as a Stiga Truls Moregard rubber. We'll have to wait and see where these new ones are made, but weren't the old Mantra series made in Japan (ie. non-ESN)?


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    #8
    Why not H8-80. The #80 sponge is non ESN but has a very similar feel to Tenergy sponge. The clicking sound and clear feedback are very well delivered by DHS.

    And the topsheet is half tacky.

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    #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Manto76

    I see there's a new Stiga Mantra Pro series listed on the ITTF website, as well as a Stiga Truls Moregard rubber. We'll have to wait and see where these new ones are made, but weren't the old Mantra series made in Japan (ie. non-ESN)?

    Yes, Mantra, Airoc, Calibra, etc etc were all Japanese made.


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    #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Zwill

    Yes, Mantra, Airoc, Calibra, etc etc were all Japanese made.

    Well, then the Mantra Pro series sounds very promising!

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    #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Zwill

    Yes, Mantra, Airoc, Calibra, etc etc were all Japanese made.

    Who makes these rubbers? Do they also make for other tt brands?


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    #12
    Well, then the Mantra Pro series sounds very promising!


    Indeed, I was sad when Stiga moved to ESN as the manufacturer. I thought they're gonna break up with Daiki or whoever made their Japanese rubbers.


    Who makes these rubbers? Do they also make for other tt brands?

    Yes, I think they make the rubbers for Nexy, most likely the Neottec rubber too that got some traction a few months ago. Chances are that if it's a Japanese rubber and not BTY or Mizuno Q series it is made by them.
    Probably the Hammond Z2 is made by them.
    Last edited by Zwill; 09-15-2022 at 09:56 AM.

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    #13
    You may find this thread interesting:
    https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/for...-manufacturers

    No discussion of "best" rubbers (Is there such a thing? How would you measure this, objectively?), but covers some of who makes what where.
    "When you look at the Dark Side, careful you must be, for the Dark Side looks back." -- Yoda

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    #14
    Discontinued, but Nittaku Hammond Pro Beta
    Go crazy go stupid

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    #15
    Made in Japan:
    Mizuno Q1, Q3, Q4, Q5, QQuality
    Friendship Visnatura, Pando
    Nexy Etika
    Neottec X5
    Victas/TSP VJ>07, Regalis
    Nittaku Hammond Z2, Z6, Z8, Goriki
    Stiga Mantra, Mantra Pro
    Made in China:
    Victas Triple Regular, Triple Extra, Triple Double Extra (if we allow hybrid rubbers)
    Friendship Presto
    Yinhe Moon Speed
    DHS Hurricane 8-80 and maybe Skyline 3-60 (hybrid)
    Palio AK47
    Sanwei Gear Hyper (hybrid)
    Stiga Genesis 1, 2 (hybrid)
    Yasaka Hovering Dragon (hybrid?)
    Loki Arthur (China, Asia, Pro, Euro maybe all hybrid rubbers)

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    #16
    Oh that's so interesting that Daiki and Sumitomo make rubbers for all these companies.

    Ive only tried victas 07 and hammond z2 from daiki. But from what ive seen, their rubbers are just as good as esn. Why arent they more popular?

    Ive never tried anything from sumitomo, but the mizuno q series seems like it has strong reviews.

  17. Zwill is online now
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    #17
    Quote Originally Posted by ttarc
    Made in Japan:
    Mizuno Q1, Q3, Q4, Q5, QQuality
    Friendship Visnatura, Pando
    Nexy Etika
    Neottec X5
    Victas/TSP VJ>07, Regalis
    Nittaku Hammond Z2, Z6, Z8, Goriki
    Stiga Mantra, Mantra Pro
    Made in China:
    Victas Triple Regular, Triple Extra, Triple Double Extra (if we allow hybrid rubbers)
    Friendship Presto
    Yinhe Moon Speed
    DHS Hurricane 8-80 and maybe Skyline 3-60 (hybrid)
    Palio AK47
    Sanwei Gear Hyper (hybrid)
    Stiga Genesis 1, 2 (hybrid)
    Yasaka Hovering Dragon (hybrid?)
    Loki Arthur (China, Asia, Pro, Euro maybe all hybrid rubbers)

    Hovering Dragon is not a hybrid in the sense that it doesn't have a tacky topsheet. However the sponge I think is Japanese and the rubber topsheet is Chinese. In that sense it's a hybrid and feels kinda like a speedglued rubber. But not ESN-like...

    I think the definition of a tensor rubber is that it should mimic the good old speed glued rubbers without speed glueing. In that sense I would not add the Pando (feels kinda like a Mark V w/o speed glue), Victas TE, TDE, H8-80 doesn't really mimic speed glue feeling, but it does have some bounciness. Skyline 3-60 is pretty good, especially the softer one (35deg), and the Hurricane 3-60 has even better speedglue feeling even tho these are tacky rubbers.
    Stiga Genesis I tried briefly, but it did not give me the impression of speedglue-like play. The rest is OK or I haven't tried and cannot comment.


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    #18
    Tensor is patented name for ESN products exclusively.
    ​​​​​​China-made rubbers that employ high tension material similar to ESN's are found on market under differen label , e.g. "high inner energy rubber" or suchlike. GD is known for making tensioned rubbers with a strong katapulta inside.
    Last edited by igorponger; 09-16-2022 at 07:21 AM.

  19. Michael Zhuang is offline
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    #19
    Quote Originally Posted by igorponger
    Tensor is patented name for ESN products exclusively.
    ​​​​​​China-made rubbers that employ high tension material similar to ESN's are found on market under differen label , e.g. "high inner energy rubber" or suchlike. GD is known for making tensioned rubbers with a strong katapulta inside.
    What is GD?

    I've tried many Chinese attempts at making bouncy rubbers, but I don't think I would call any of them truly catapult rubbers like true ESN tensors. Which rubbers are you referring to?

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    #20
    A CLEVER HOAX TO BOOST SELLING RATES..

    In terms of elastomer material science, there is NO clearcut definition of TENSOR rubbers. There is no distinct difference between TENSORIC and Non TENSORIC rubbers. As matter of fact, not all rubbers being claimed to have tensor effect would play like real tensors.

    Be happy.

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    Last edited by igorponger; 09-16-2022 at 10:15 PM.

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