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  1. J Bus is offline
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    #21

    @Fzambetta I play at DVTTA in Melbourne, Victoria.

    @NDH, Thanks for posting the video. The whippyness you're talking about I can see so I'm going to try and emulate it at training and record myself. Also will do the loop then topspin to show my recovery/ stroke process.

    I have some issues holding the bat I think because my hands/fingers are quite long. If i put my right index finger straight when I hold the bat, the first joint in my index finger is almost over the end of the bat. I can almost bend my finger around the edge at the first joint so subcociously I think i have it aimed more upwards instead of straight so the full finger is on the back of the bat. I can defiently hold the bat more loosely like i do when i serve which will give me more mobility to be loose, so i'll give that a shot.

    Thanks for the input guys.


  2. NDH is offline
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    #22
    Quote Originally Posted by J Bus

    I have some issues holding the bat I think because my hands/fingers are quite long. If i put my right index finger straight when I hold the bat, the first joint in my index finger is almost over the end of the bat. I can almost bend my finger around the edge at the first joint so subcociously I think i have it aimed more upwards instead of straight so the full finger is on the back of the bat. I can defiently hold the bat more loosely like i do when i serve which will give me more mobility to be loose, so i'll give that a shot.

    Thanks for the input guys.

    I appreciate this is not an “overnight” change, but I hold the bat much lower down on the handle.

    I find it gives me more options down the line, and helps the transition to backhand.

    It would also help if you have bigger hands.

    But…. Changing the grip is quite a big thing, and I only hold it this way because my coach recommended it about 20 years ago.


  3. strangeloops is offline
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    #23
    Quote Originally Posted by latej
    I can't post links



    I re-read your post, it came after mine. It may be a coincidence, and, also possible, you misunderstood what I was trying to say when I said: "Try to put more of this into your stroke.".

    It's easy to see the mechanics of golf stroke, baseball stroke, tennis stroke, TT stroke, and even stroke like gjaku-tsuki in karate is the same. And it can't be other than the same, simply because the body is the body. We know the stroke is a sequence, people say kinetic chain. For me, because of where I come from, if I had to pick the most important part in the sequence related to power-transfer, then it is the hips.

    My post was meant to be a response to the OP, not to your post.

    What I wanted to tell is that it is usually easier to learn technique with smaller adjustments that make the strokes less straining, rather than trying to produce more power, and that the same applies to the use of body. I think it is better to start with a little body turn to get the feel for how it should work, and increase the amount once it becomes consistent enough. You know the technique is good when it produces good results with minimal effort, so that is what you should be aiming for.

    In general I favor the use of body rotation in forehand strokes, and the way in which it described in the video you linked is very simple and effective, even though I think it is not really that simple.

    Last edited by strangeloops; 09-24-2022 at 04:05 PM.

  4. latej is offline
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    #24
    Quote Originally Posted by strangeloops
    My post was meant to be a response to the OP, not to your post.[/p]

    What I wanted to tell is that it is usually easier to learn technique with smaller adjustments that make the strokes less straining, rather than trying to produce more power, and that the same applies to the use of body. I think it is better to start with a little body turn to get the feel for how it should work, and increase the amount once it becomes consistent enough. You know the technique is good when it produces good results with minimal effort, so that is what should be aimed for.

    [p]In general I favor the use of body rotation in forehand strokes, and the way in which it described in the video you linked is very simple and effective, even though I think it is not really that simple.
    Thanks for your explanation.

    Yes, I also think it is not that simple. Only mentally it is simple to check and feel, that your hips are pre-rotated (rel. to arm).

  5. Der_Echte is offline
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    #25
    FZ is discussions something so under-discussed and important about breathing and the links to performance. There ought to be more talk about this.

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  6. Der_Echte is offline
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    #26
    People fight against their own body with poor biomechanics or trying to generate power wrong way wrong time, but poor breathing is another way people fight against their own body.
    President, Korea Foreign Table Tennis Club. Hit us up on TTD or Facebook
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  7. fzambetta is offline
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    #27
    Quote Originally Posted by J Bus

    @Fzambetta I play at DVTTA in Melbourne, Victoria.

    I thought I had seen that place before, been there a couple of times even though I have never regularly played there 😅

    I live in Sunbury and played at the Sunbury and Sunhine TTAs for a few years.
    After the COVID lockdowns though, I have been playing in Coburg and I have more recently started the new summer pennant in Airport West (about a month ago).

  8. fzambetta is offline
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    #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Der_Echte
    FZ is discussions something so under-discussed and important about breathing and the links to performance. There ought to be more talk about this.

    @Der_Echte, I could not agree more!

    I find that most coaches, even really great ones, tend to overemphasise technique while downplaying psychological, match strategyl aspects and/or topics sitting a the fringe like breathing (part physical and part mental).
    Don't get me wrong, technique is absolutely critical but just honing great shots is not going to be enough to win matches.

    I feel my performance has been hindered for so long by a lack of a systematic approach to match play (including match strategy, and a proper approach to relaxing, keeping cool in a match, things that are all connected).
    Dora Kurimay's book is an excellent intro to the topic albeit one of a very few, as far as I can tell.

    Be happy to start a new thread if others are keen to discuss such topics 😅

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    #29
    Quote Originally Posted by fzambetta

    @Der_Echte, I could not agree more!

    I find that most coaches, even really great ones, tend to overemphasise technique while downplaying psychological, match strategyl aspects and/or topics sitting a the fringe like breathing (part physical and part mental).
    Don't get me wrong, technique is absolutely critical but just honing great shots is not going to be enough to win matches.

    I feel my performance has been hindered for so long by a lack of a systematic approach to match play (including match strategy, and a proper approach to relaxing, keeping cool in a match, things that are all connected).
    Dora Kurimay's book is an excellent intro to the topic albeit one of a very few, as far as I can tell.

    Be happy to start a new thread if others are keen to discuss such topics 😅

    FZ
    Do you not consider Breathing to be part of Technique?
    I am currently coaching someone who is currently becoming interested in matchplay and tactics, but is constantly stymied by his errors in implementation due to unsound technique.
    Tactics is always fascinating but sound technique is the bedrock of success and must come first

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    ppp

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  10. fzambetta is offline
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    #30
    @pingpongpaddy, I consider proper breathing as part of both technique and more broadly approaching a game strategically.

    The reason for that is that proper breathing allows you to be calmer hence not only performing technique better and
    /or with more power, but also allowing to think more clearly about your game plan (being more relaxed helps with reducing cognitive load).

    As I said, the book I have referenced, details all this in the different area of one's game (of course, including technique).

    PS=Absolutely no argument from me about having to have very sound technique. There is pretty much no limit to how much technical work one can do, and I absolutely love doing it. I have two technical training sessions a week, in fact (that's how much I love that sort of thing) 😅

    My point was though that once you start having a sound enough technique (say as an intermediate to advanced player) you need to start worrying about match strategy and all those mental aspects and details that fall in between.

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    Last edited by fzambetta; 09-26-2022 at 03:57 AM.

  11. latej is offline
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    #31
    Quote Originally Posted by fzambetta
    My point was though that once you start having a sound enough technique (say as an intermediate to advanced player) you need to start worrying about match strategy and all those mental aspects and details that fall in between.
    Quote Originally Posted by fzambetta
    @Der_Echte, I could not agree more!

    Be happy to start a new thread if others are keen to discuss such topics 😅
    L1: Everything depends on equipment. Equipment is everything. We need the proper hardness, thickness, pimple pattern, sponge structure and the blade must exactly match it.

    L2: It's the stroke. It must be perfect. We must get low enough, we must transfer the force, and everything must feel smooth as silk.

    L3: It's about the movement, you idiot. We finally escape the valid cage of "strokes" to realize the space of space. Equilibrium: The geometric distribution of antagonists in any gun battle is a statistically predictable element. :-)

    L4: The strategy. The ability to concentrate, to adapt, to change. Breathing is here. Full serve utilization too.

    L5: Chi! Flow! Nothing!

    I can't say much on L4 and above because I am only knocking on L3 :-)

    I wrote all this BS so that you start the THREAD! :-) I trust that Der, and others, will participate there.

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  12. pingpongpaddy is offline
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    #32
    Quote Originally Posted by latej
    L1: Everything depends on equipment. Equipment is everything. We need the proper hardness, thickness, pimple pattern, sponge structure and the blade must exactly match it.

    L2: It's the stroke. It must be perfect. We must get low enough, we must transfer the force, and everything must feel smooth as silk.

    L3: It's about the movement, you idiot. We finally escape the valid cage of "strokes" to realize the space of space. Equilibrium: The geometric distribution of antagonists in any gun battle is a statistically predictable element. :-)

    L4: The strategy. The ability to concentrate, to adapt, to change. Breathing is here. Full serve utilization too.

    L5: Chi! Flow! Nothing!

    I can't say much on L4 and above because I am only knocking on L3 :-)

    I wrote all this BS so that you start the THREAD! :-) I trust that Der, and others, will participate there.

    do you mean its all HOT AIR!!

    ppp

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  13. latej is offline
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    #33
    Quote Originally Posted by pingpongpaddy
    do you mean its all HOT AIR!!
    :-) It's a little bit of everything. But mostly, it is an invitation.

  14. fzambetta is offline
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    #34
    Sure thing, I will get a thread started soon on L4 and its relationship to L1-L3 and hopefully a few people can contribute links to existing sources and/or their experiences.

    I was planning to do so earlier, but I have been on holiday these last few days in a regional area with an iffy Internet connection 😅
    ​​​​​​
    EDIT: It is done 😁
    Last edited by fzambetta; 09-27-2022 at 12:35 PM.

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