Ma lin unbelievable serve

Brushed. I'm sure 100%

Sorry didn't read the law of physics part.
Many could explain better than me in this.

heavy backspin but fast forward move

conttact during brushing was too fine ball jsut slipped o ff

The serve barely landed twice on the table. Opponnent barely misread teh depth and very lightly brushed it.

There is ZERO chance given the velocity of Ma Lin's serve, the very low angle the ball impacts the table, that the level of spin and friction coefficient of the table and ball would bring the ball back by itself. Just impossible.

If the impact angle is more direct (less glancing) (also means that there is less forward velocity on the ball) then you get more of the ball to "Bite" and reduce its resultant froward velocity after the bounce.

That is how the "Ghost" serve is effective. You impact the ball with very slow forward momentum, barely enough to clear the net and land close to net after first bounce. The resultant reduced forward velocity of the ball after first bounce, coupled with the new (more direct impact/less glancing) bounce angle for first bounce on other side allows the friction coefficient to make the ball lose all forward momentum and with the second and sunsequent bounces come back to the net. If the serve is high enough, the bounce is more direct and the ball can bounce once on other side and bounce back over the net.

I cannot show any equations or formulas, but my description covers the principles of how it all works.

Zhang barely touched the ball, not surprised it went down

you can all test this yourself. do the spin test with a chinese rubber. when the ball is on its way down to make contact with the rubber make a very acute angle nearly vertical.. you will see that the ball just dies down. or somewhat to the side

decoy said:

you can all test this yourself. do the spin test with a chinese rubber. when the ball is on its way down to make contact with the rubber make a very acute angle nearly vertical.. you will see that the ball just dies down. or somewhat to the side

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Yep I believe it's called the stall angle.

YosuaYosan said:

Yep I believe it's called the stall angle.

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Yup. That is how it is in SPARTA!

the ball made contact but only witht he tacky surface without even compressing the top sheet. only to drop to the table by the slowing down with by the tack

I have a good follow-up question...
Could Ma Lin have done this serve with a European rubber? Or is this kind of serve exclusive to chinese rubbers? (I mean with this extreme amount of spin on it)

Yes. A tacky rubber makes it easier to generate heavy spin with poor timing, but pros have great timing and bat spoon at impact and can do a heavy chop serve with Sriver.

The spin is irrelevant here as Zhang brushed the ball which is why the ball reacted the way it did. Any time you touch a spinning ball with your rubber in the opposite direction it is spinning and you mi**** or just barely brush it the ball will shoot out with whichever spin is left on it.

Spinny serves can be done with any rubber that can contact the ball and with proper timing. The service is the easy part it is the next shot that really matters. Yes Ma Lin could serve with another rubber, but adjusting to another rubber on the forehand is just too hard for him when his style is so deadly as it is. Many players who play Chinese most of their careers have a hard time adjusting to rubbers like Tenergy or ESN style rubbers. This causes their level to drop significantly as they are used to a certain angle and certain aspects of Chinese rubbers (i.e. short game and over the table looping).

Der_Echte said:

Yup. That is how it is in SPARTA!

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Stall angle in sparta has 2 definition:

He brushed it, it drops down before it touches the table

YY, I knew you would bring up some cool clips, that's why I quoted Sparta.

If we're gunna hijack the thread, then why not do it with some of the finest warriors that ever lived?

Der_Echte said:

YY, I knew you would bring up some cool clips, that's why I quoted Sparta.

If we're gunna hijack the thread, then why not do it with some of the finest warriors that ever lived?

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U mean like Zhang Jike? But u were right, unless the table surface is made of rubber the change of direction of the ball cannot be caused by Ma Lin's spin.